I'd like to try again here...

[Oarsman]

Welcome back.

 

[GottleibDaimler]

Welcome GD - I read your earlier thread and some of the response it received with interest.

Being frank, most of us on this forum are enthusiasts running MBs (and other marques) on a budget and probably initially were persuaded to buy the brand due to design, build quality and reliability.

I agree, and I think that's where part of the ill feeling stems from on this forum.

There are as you know issues with cars built between 1995 and 2009 that have proved to be a disappointment for many owners, bought both new and secondhand. The key words here are rust, SBC and Airmatic which have tarnished the brand and led to some bad feeling due to MBUK and the dealer networks mixed response to these issues under the warranty schemes.

Again, all good points. I should point out that I've seen a couple of 50% contributions on SBC pumps on cars as old as seven or eight years old, in the last few months.

Most owners on the forum, including myself, feel that MB have shown little interest in making a service offering that owners of 4+ year old cars can engage with as the servicing costs per hour are so high. To cater for this market MB could have franchised it out or thought up some other means of providing a service but has shown little or no interest. This gap in the market has predominately been filled with ex-MB techies setting up on their own, which in the main part has proved very useful for owners of older cars, as their rates are 50% of the dealers.

I actually disagree, but I don't think it's very well marketed or publicised. MB offer 4+ prices, but these are masked by the high cost of the fourth year service (unavoidable given the MB service regime. MB prescribe that at least three additional items are due on the fourth year for most people, in addition to a major service) This puts people off and they often never come back. MB also offer cheap servicing for 7+ cars, outside of the normal service regime (£139 for a minor service on a C-class). Before anyone jumps on me, I'm not seeking to sell, just to inform.

I'm sure people on the forum will find it interesting to hear what MB currently have to offer, in terms of service contracts and special offers which may come up, but essentially we are here to support people with reliabilty issues who will not go near a dealer because of the aforementioned points.

Hopefully I can be of some help too.

I hope you enjoy the forum and learn from it as we all have and hopefully your impressions gained here may go some way to changing the culture of MBUK, if only at your dealership.

Some good points and a good discussion.

 

[Gkinghorn]

Interesting on the 7+ year service option... When I asked the local dealer I was told that as it did not have a FMBSH they would do the work they thought should be done on it even then a fair bit of it was unnecessary and had already been done - but as they had no record they insisted on doing the work... I took it to an indie who checked it all over and serviced it much cheaper than the dealer.

Also recently had a quote for replacing brake discs/pads and the quote for the 2 at the dealer was the same price as all 4 at the indie ..using MB approved parts...

Seems to me its the labour cost that's the issue here ... The servicing piece I can almost get but don't see why they would replace perfectly good spark plugs just because they didnt have a record it had been done...

I think those are the attitudes that bother members here..


==========================

 

[television]

Interesting on the 7+ year service option... When I asked the local dealer I was told that as it did not have a FMBSH they would do the work they thought should be done on it even then a fair bit of it was unnecessary and had already been done - but as they had no record they insisted on doing the work... I took it to an indie who checked it all over and serviced it much cheaper than the dealer.

Also recently had a quote for replacing brake discs/pads and the quote for the 2 at the dealer was the same price as all 4 at the indie ..using MB approved parts...

Seems to me its the labour cost that's the issue here ... The servicing piece I can almost get but don't see why they would replace perfectly good spark plugs just because they didnt have a record it had been done...

I think those are the attitudes that bother members here..


==========================

Indeed Gordon this is a concern to many, I am by no means poor but there is no way that I will pay £120 per hour plus VAT for this work

 

[SL63 Mark]

Welcome back, GD. Kudos to you for sticking around.

I disagree that MB are not interested in 4+ YO cars. My local dealership regularly contacts me to discuss my servicing requirements, and recently, when I will be replacing my SL. (never!) When I ordered parts, my car and phone number went onto their database, so zere iss no escape.

As an SL55 owner no doubt they can see plenty of earning potential.

No mention of any special deals though :

 

[tode]

Indeed Gordon this is a concern to many, I am by no means poor but there is no way that I will pay £120 per hour plus VAT for this work

Why is the hourly rate so high in UK? My local dealer was at £64/hour (in Nov. 2012). There has to be a reason . . . but what ? (VAT included)

 

[Gkinghorn]

It's interesting I have had one pice of work done at the Merc dealer because I had to really ... That was the £850 gearshift replacement ... Now when I do drive in to their dealership the camera recognises the car and puts up a nice sign saying "welcome Mr Kinghorn Pleas park on the right" at which point the barrier to the 'special' parking section is opened for me and I virtually park in the showroom!

So yes I think they see the SL owner as someone wit money to spend ..


==========================

 

[television]

It's interesting I have had one pice of work done at the Merc dealer because I had to really ... That was the £850 gearshift replacement ... Now when I do drive in to their dealership the camera recognises the car and puts up a nice sign saying "welcome Mr Kinghorn Pleas park on the right" at which point the barrier to the 'special' parking section is opened for me and I virtually park in the showroom!

So yes I think they see the SL owner as someone wit money to spend ..


==========================

It must be nice to be that rich. I had a T shirt once that said
"You may not recognize me but I am internationally famous and incredibly rich"

A girl in a super market asked one day if she could rad my T shirt, she gazed at it for a minute and said " that must be very nice"

 

[television]

Why is the hourly rate so high in UK? My local dealer was at £64/hour (in Nov. 2012). There has to be a reason . . . but what ? (VAT included)

Are the workshops in France in the same style expensive showrooms that we have over here

 

[GottleibDaimler]

Interesting on the 7+ year service option... When I asked the local dealer I was told that as it did not have a FMBSH they would do the work they thought should be done on it even then a fair bit of it was unnecessary and had already been done - but as they had no record they insisted on doing the work... I took it to an indie who checked it all over and serviced it much cheaper than the dealer.

Not being overprotective, or, again, selling, but my main dealer would never do that. I, when quoting, would always explain that the 7+ option is not a Manufacturer's Recommended Service, but that it is a valid option and better than taking it to Halfords Autocentres for the same oil and filter change. On the day, we would then report the other items that would be recommended, as well as any wear and tear or damage. We would never insist on doing anything; we are grateful for custom and don't like to take the p***.

Also recently had a quote for replacing brake discs/pads and the quote for the 2 at the dealer was the same price as all 4 at the indie ..using MB approved parts...
Not sure quite how competitive we are, but our dealer group does pads and discs on a C-class for about £280 fitted.

Seems to me its the labour cost that's the issue here ... The servicing piece I can almost get but don't see why they would replace perfectly good spark plugs just because they didnt have a record it had been done...
MB tell us we HAVE to advise that things like spark plugs are done every 50k(ish, dependent on model) or four years, unless already done. We can tell you they look alright, just as we'd tell you three years since the last change if they looked like they needed. It's also about trying to protect the customer's benefits, particularly Mobilo and Goodwill.

I think those are the attitudes that bother members here..


==========================

Those attitudes bother me too. Again, not trying to sell; just informing/advising about our standard practices, as I can only comment on my own dealership.

 

[GottleibDaimler]

Indeed Gordon this is a concern to many, I am by no means poor but there is no way that I will pay £120 per hour plus VAT for this work

Not sure about elsewhere, but although our headline rate is £110 plus VAT, any car over four years old gets labour for about £85/hour ex VAT. And services are worked out from a fixed price menu, rather than having anything to do with the labour rate directly.

 

[tode]

Are the workshops in France in the same style expensive showrooms that we have over here

Well, the showrooms are . . . palatial (but then most makers are).

The preparation bays are pretty slick (white tiles and white gloves )

But when you go in the workshop, it's pretty much like a . . . garage

And these are 5-year old purpose-built premises. The money all goes in the "commercial" area

 

[television]

I know MB SW very well, there is the service manager, 4 to 5 service guys booking in cars, 3 guys in the parts, quite a few mouths to feed, the worst side is the ones booking the cars in do not have a clue about cars and there faults, this could account for 50% of the faults not getting fixed.

 

[malcolm E53 AMG]

Some good points and a good discussion.

Re servicing issues:

1 - It's a competitive world out there and if MB decide not to compete on labour costs ph that's up to them, best value will prevail.

2 - The only way to build a business is to give the customer what they want at a fair price with offers that are easy to undrstand and genuine, ie additional items should be included in any offers and a genuine attempt made to provide 'no worry' maintenance plans that take the vehicles up to at least 6-8 years old.

3 - If MB had enough faith in its product it would offer extended warranties at reasonable cost. This would be my priority to keep cars within the dealer network, and this is the period of ownership where things start to go wrong with the MBUK business model

4 - The vast majority on here do not want the remote customer service provided by MB, I for one want to talk to the person doing the job or his immediate supervisor not an intermediary so the whole experience for me falls down on walking through the door.

As you say it's good to talk!

 

[GottleibDaimler]

Re servicing issues:

1 - It's a competitive world out there and if MB decide not to compete on labour costs ph that's up to them, best value will prevail.

2 - The only way to build a business is to give the customer what they want at a fair price with offers that are easy to undrstand and genuine, ie additional items should be included in any offers and a genuine attempt made to provide 'no worry' maintenance plans that take the vehicles up to at least 6-8 years old.

3 - If MB had enough faith in its product it would offer extended warranties at reasonable cost. This would be my priority to keep cars within the dealer network, and this is the period of ownership where things start to go wrong with the MBUK business model

4 - The vast majority on here do not want the remote customer service provided by MB, I for one want to talk to the person doing the job or his immediate supervisor not an intermediary so the whole experience for me falls down on walking through the door.

As you say it's good to talk!

1 - I genuinely think that they, or at least my dealership(!), is more competitive than you are giving credit. Yes, depending on the job, things can get pricey, but included in that you get expertise, a two year warranty, a loan car if you want one, etc. With a brand like Mercedes-Benz, it's not about appealing to the lowest common denominator, like, for example, Ford. It's about adding value to what you do, and that's about more than just labour rates per hour (which as I say aren't especially relevant at a main dealer anyway as there are fixed and different prices all over the place.

2 - Impossible within the framework of the Mercedes-Benz service regime. 15,500 miles, for goodness sake?! A problem, I agree, but at the top, not at dealer level. And so a B service for the ordinary person will mean brake fluid too, as it should arrive at 2 years. But if you do more than 31,000 in 24 months, you'll have a B without brake fluid. Likewise if you hit 50k before four years, you'll do your sparks/fuel filter and air filter before the fourth year service. The only way you can include everything in a price is via the Service Care Plan route. I agree maintenance plans should be brought back. For me, there should be Service Plans, Service and Maintenance (i.e. pads and discs, tyres, wipers) and then Comprehensive, which encompasses an extended warranty.

3 - My dealer group does extended warranties at something like £999. An SBC pump costs more than that.

4 - By this do you mean you want to talk to the technician, rather than a Service Advisor? Because no main dealer of any brand that I know of has this set up. And no technician that I know of has any interest in speaking to customers! A genuine observation, and it makes sense to me. They like cars from the inside out. I like them perhaps slightly more superficially (in the sense that I'm not passionate about mechanics), but I also like dealing with people. I know some very mechanically knowledgeable SAs though, and my Service Manager was a technician many moons ago. If you spoke to me about cars I'd hold my own, and I can always get you an answer within five minutes if I don't know it myself.

It seems like my dealership is a million times better than the average one described on here. I don't think that can be the case, though, and there is probably some bias from each side. Sadly, disliking the dealer seems to be the default position, and I'm sure there are reasons behind this, be they historical, anecdotal or current.

 

[dizzy lizzy]

welcome back, you didn't upset me, but I am only the domestic engineer on here, so what do I know..ha ha...welcome

 

[Smacsor]

I don't think the servicing costs at my main dealer are too bad?

£285 for a B service. That's only 20 quid more than a well-respected Indy on here advertises on his website (although the website says its £135 cheaper!)

Simon

 

[television]

I don't think the servicing costs at my main dealer are too bad?

£285 for a B service. That's only 20 quid more than a well-respected Indy on here advertises on his website (although the website says its £135 cheaper!)

Simon

Mine would be more than double that

 

[Xtractorfan]

Glad to see you decided to return and not be deflected by our thread closing moderator..He has closed down more threads on here than a power cut in a yarn factory

 

[GottleibDaimler]

I don't think the servicing costs at my main dealer are too bad?

£285 for a B service. That's only 20 quid more than a well-respected Indy on here advertises on his website (although the website says its £135 cheaper!)

Simon

In the interests of parity, I should point out that the indy may be including brake fluid in his price, and the main dealer almost certainly (but rightly, IMO) isn't.