no claims bonus - a shady area for me

[ypkx]

Hi,

As none of you know, im actually a very young mercedes driver, only at the age of 19.
Before you all make obvious judgements like; 19, drives an mb, starting a thread in the insurance area.. I actually bought the car for 'banter', my friend paid for the car when my astra was classed as an mot failure 'not fixable'.

I managed to dodge insurance quotes of £3000+, but i couldnt get it any lower than £2400 (affordable for myself)
But in the end i decided to get insured on a relatives policy to save myself the extra hundred pounds.

Yes, i know, stupid.

It eventually came to £2100 with my aunt as the main driver with 9+ years no claims and myself as the named driver with 1 years no claims and pass plus.

We mentioned to the lovely lady on the phone that she IS on another policy for her nissan almera with the no claims in use. But she had claimed that this is not an issue so we went ahead with the quote.

We recently got an email through (ecarinsurance.co.uk) telling us that the no claims bonus proof is valid but 'is still in use' therefore classed void.

Where did we go wrong?

 

[whitenemesis]

Never mind the NCB issue what you are doing by having your aunt as the main driver is called "Fronting" and is illegal.

http://www.uk-insurance-index.co.uk...ed-about-car-insurance-fronting-legality.html

 

[ypkx]

I live with my aunt, shes my parental guardian. And I hardly drive as it is, so i didnt see this as an issue. :S

 

[Chrishazle]

As said above, fronting is illegal and voids your insurance - there's been enough about it in the press recently.

However, having the insurance in your name with your Aunt as a named driver is not illegal - but can drastically reduce the premium!

We did this some years ago when my daughter (then 18, now 25) got her first car, a Hyundai Amica. With her as the policyholder and only named driver, policy was about £850. Add wife and I as named drivers, policy dropped to about £600 - fully comp! Try the online comparison sites and see if it still works.

 

[ypkx]

As said above, fronting is illegal and voids your insurance - there's been enough about it in the press recently.

However, having the insurance in your name with your Aunt as a named driver is not illegal - but can drastically reduce the premium!

We did this some years ago when my daughter (then 18, now 25) got her first car, a Hyundai Amica. With her as the policyholder and only named driver, policy was about £850. Add wife and I as named drivers, policy dropped to about £600 - fully comp! Try the online comparison sites and see if it still works.

i tried that, really didnt work. But i guess i should shop again.

 

[mandrake]

i think the world of insurance is a big grey area full stop ,to me the quote of £2400 is a bit ott but then again tis is a sighn of the times . to save a couple of hundred quid going on your relatives insurance with your car with her being the main driver even though you may be a named driver if you use the car more than your aunt and the car is in your name ,then you are technicaly the main driver ,rendering your car as uninsured .as i say it is hard to prove in the case of a claim ,but it has been done and if the insurance company get a snif of it belive me they will try to prove it , also i beleive that for every year you dont claim on the insuranceof your aunts, your no clames that you would have earned will not stand when you come to get your own named cover

 

[ypkx]

However, having the insurance in your name with your Aunt as a named driver is not illegal - but can drastically reduce the premium!

Ok, new quote, both from ecar;

On my own - £2900.00 (full payment)

With my aunt as named driver - £3300.00 (full payment)

I somehow would rather drive, uninsured...

i think the world of insurance is a big grey area full stop ,to me the quote of £2400 is a bit ott but then again tis is a sighn of the times . to save a couple of hundred quid going on your relatives insurance with your car with her being the main driver even though you may be a named driver if you use the car more than your aunt and the car is in your name ,then you are technicaly the main driver ,rendering your car as uninsured .as i say it is hard to prove in the case of a claim ,but it has been done and if the insurance company get a snif of it belive me they will try to prove it , also i beleive that for every year you dont claim on the insuranceof your aunts, your no clames that you would have earned will not stand when you come to get your own named cover

I agree, insurance is ridiculous, its being raped by the fair few young drivers WHO DO cause problems on the road and the majority of us suffer.
I already have 1 years no claims on an expire policy, will this just vanish?

 

[Rory]

We recently got an email through (ecarinsurance.co.uk) telling us that the no claims bonus proof is valid but 'is still in use' therefore classed void.

Where did we go wrong?

You can't use the NCB twice.

Some companies will "mirror" it if you own two cars and both are insured with them, but probably not with a young driver named on the policy.

The legality of fronting is a bit vague, but you (or more particularly your aunt) could have a problem if you were to have a serious accident while commuting etc, as the reality of the situation would come out.

 

[Rory]

I already have 1 years no claims on an expire policy, will this just vanish?

No, it remains valid for 2 years.

 

[Micman]

When you are a young driver you have to make the decision:

Either accept and pay the high premium to drive a better car.

Or do your time and drive a sensible car for a few years to establish a NCB.

There's no point moaning, it's a fact of life.

I know times have changed and insurance has escalated for young drivers, but when I started driving in 1991 aged 17 I had a 1.1 fiesta for 2 years insured in my own name. I then upgraded and bought a very very nice Volvo 480 Turbo (which was not a typical car for a young driver to own aged 19). I started off by paying £1200 a year for 3rd party fire and theft insurance even taking my 2 years no claims into account!

Looking back it seems crazy I paid that money, but I wanted a nice car and insurance was high back then too for young drivers (the late 80's, boy racers in hot hatches and the time of joy riding vehicle thefts on your telly in Police, Camera, Action!). Insurance for young drivers is higher - it always has been and always well be.

Fortunately the gamble paid off for me, I never had any incidents in the Volvo and my premiums eventually went down as my NCB built up.

What I would say is young drivers today need to remember they have much more choice of good quality, reliable and safe, small engined cars than I ever did back in 1991. There are also amazing deals on new small cars if you can afford the monthly repayments. So why insurance might be steep - you have a better choice of quality cars to drive to get you started and build a NCB.

 

[Mic]

Never ever lie about your circumstances, especially in regard to insurance, and never ever get behind the wheel of a motor vehicle uninsured......criminal and lunacy.

Keep shopping.....you may find that the comparison sites do not throw up the most competitive premiums, not all insurers are on the comparison sites. A good, well connected, broker may be your best solution but it is tough and expensive.

Good luck but be truthful.

Mic

 

[Blobcat]

I have the same issue with NCB on my Smart, as my 9+ years is on my Mercedes I had to start the Smart with 0. I have found a broker who will mirror the NCB so next year my Smart (with luck...) will also show 9+ years NCB.

 

[Chrishazle]

Just had to take out a separate policy for the recently aquired 968 cab as insurers of the 968 coupe would only add an additional car for 30 days - and I don't know how long it will take to sell the coupe! I have the C270 insured with Saga, they gave me (as an existing customer) 60% introductory discount on the cab, plus I can cancel the policy without penalty or exit charge at any time. OK, policy was £320 compared to the £220 I pay Classic Line for the coupe, but it's a better deal than putting the cab on a monthly policy until I sell the coupe!

 

[d215yq]

Never ever lie about your circumstances, especially in regard to insurance, and never ever get behind the wheel of a motor vehicle uninsured......criminal and lunacy.

Keep shopping.....you may find that the comparison sites do not throw up the most competitive premiums, not all insurers are on the comparison sites. A good, well connected, broker may be your best solution but it is tough and expensive.

Good luck but be truthful.

Mic

Well it's easy to say that but I think sometimes it just becomes prohibitively expensive. For example I have a policy which boasts european cover, but when you read the small print it says the car can only be used abroad for 30days in a row.

So i phoned up and said i needed it for 6 months in a row in Europe and it went from £450 to £5,200 for 10 months cover. Sorry but that is unjustifiable and I have not changed the policy.

OK so if I caused a very serious accident I could be in trouble but quite frankly anyone insured or not could be injured/killed when they get in a car, and we all accept that greater danger so maybe if we get back to basics and stop believing the hype its not such lunacy accepting the less severe financial risk of not being fully insured?

Its easy to say uninsured drivers are scum, etc but at the end of the day dangerous drivers that risk life/injury (insured or uninsured) are the real scum. Not much good if your loved one is killed by an insured driver, that fact isnt going to bring them back!

If I was the OP i would register the car in his aunt's name so she is the legal keeper and then i can't see how they'd prove "fronting". Perhaps the "what if" aspect may make them subconsiously drive a bit more carefully too (as it has for me).

 

[Naraic]

^ Good point. I could never understand why it was dangerous to drive whilst uninsured.

 

[oldcro]

On the news today an accident victim has been awarded £4,500,000 compensation. Driving without insurance is as sensible as playing Russian Roulette with all chambers loaded.

 

[d215yq]

I don't necessarily advocate driving without insurance, nor completely lieing to get a cheap quote, I'm just saying we are prepared to risk losing limbs/life/and also other people's lives everytime we get into a car so conceptually it doesn't seem that crazy to risk losing money as well. I'd rather lose £4,500,000 than my legs or sight or life!

Also for me (and i guess many others) if I started paying £5k for car insurance we'd definitely be bankrupt within a few years so it's actually more sensible to risk being slightly economical with the truth so atleast there's a very, very good chance of not being bankrupt in a few years if, like in my other 9 years of driving, nothing bad happens.

Just because the media whip up a storm that uninsured drivers cost everyone money (when the reason for high premums could be argued to be the fault of those who willingly pay extreme amounts for their insurance thus allowing the companies to get away with it), doesn't necessarily make it immoral.

I know people with high powered cars that drive recklessly and who've had crashes and think because they are fully insured its fine - they even suggested when i told them about my insurance i was responsible for premiums going up, of course, the considerable damage they caused on their claim didn't make everyone's premiums go up at all?! But when most people are just fed a diet of uninsured/drink driving/no MOT = BAD and speed/real dangerous driving = GOOD i guess they lose the ability (and maybe the will) to apply rational thought.

 

[Naraic]

On the news today an accident victim has been awarded £4,500,000 compensation. Driving without insurance is as sensible as playing Russian Roulette with all chambers loaded.

Agreed...but it doesn't make you a dangerous driver...just an inconsiderate one.

 

[whitenemesis]

Agreed...but it doesn't make you a dangerous driver...just an inconsiderate one.

And a criminal one...

 

[Frontstep]

Surely the answer has be to get a sensible car not look for ways to cheat,
My first car was an Austin 1100 and about as cool as acne, but I never struggled to fill it with friends and girlfriends and it got me to where I wanted to go,
grow some b***s and get on with it.