1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

2003 C270 CDi performance upgrades

Discussion in 'Tuning, Styling and Performance.' started by Benny Dub, Jan 8, 2018.

  1. Benny Dub

    Benny Dub Senior Member

    Messages:
    83
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    May 9, 2012
    Location:
    Swindon, UK
    Your Mercedes:
    2003 C270 CDI Wagon
    Evening all - I'm now about 4 months back into Mercedes ownership - I sold my W208 a couple years ago but needing something a bit more economic, comfy and practical than my old MG I've got myself a 2003 W203 wagon, C270 CDi.

    I plan to get a bit more power out of it, and although was initially only planning some basic breathing mods (decat exhaust, air filter, maybe losing a silencer) and a remap, I've started looking at a few more drastic measures.

    I've read that the turbo from a W210 E320 CDi should be a straight swap - is this the case? I keep seeing GT2359V mentioned but can only seem to find GT23V's for sale - what's the difference and is the GT23V still a straight-swap upgrade?

    Also what other cost-effective mods should I consider to take advantage of a turbo upgrade and remap?

    Cheers
    Ben
     
    Fernando411 likes this.
  2. alexanderfoti

    alexanderfoti Moderator

    Messages:
    9,552
    Likes Received:
    785
    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Location:
    West London
    Your Mercedes:
    W221 S65 AMG - W204 C63 AMG
    If you go down the turbo upgrade route, you will hit the torque limit of the gearbox sooner rather than later.

    Depending on how far past the limit you go, the car will either wear the box quickly, or go into limp mode when you floor it.

    Other mods can include a larger intercooler and water/meth injection.
     
  3. Tashman

    Tashman Senior Member

    Messages:
    439
    Likes Received:
    13
    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2008
    Your Mercedes:
    W123-300D, W123-240D, 507D campervan, W210-E220CDI, W114-250
    If the 320's box can handle the torque then why shouldn't a 270's box? Isn't it the same box? A 722.6? After completing all his mods he might be getting close to 320 power and torque levels, so I don't see a problem with the box handling it. A cynic might say "why not just buy a 320 CDI in the first place" (but not me!)
     
  4. alexanderfoti

    alexanderfoti Moderator

    Messages:
    9,552
    Likes Received:
    785
    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Location:
    West London
    Your Mercedes:
    W221 S65 AMG - W204 C63 AMG
    270 cdi W 5 A 300
    320 cdi W 5 A 580

    There are many versions of the 722.6 with different torque ratings (The last number in NM).

    The torque limiter is in the gearbox ecu mapping, and can be set to anything by a tuner. Obviously, if the limiter is raised past the rated torque of the box then the box will wear, or drop in neutral if it slips.

    They only did the 203 320 cdi in the V6 cdi after the facelift, so OP would have to buy a 3 year newer car if he wanted that :) Of course he could fit a W5A 580 version from a 210 etc and map it up.

    Keep in mind that after a certain torque limit, the internal ratios changed so would need to be compensated in the map for the gearbox ecu.
     
  5. LostKiwi

    LostKiwi Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,193
    Likes Received:
    4,230
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2006
    Location:
    Midlands / Charente-Maritime
    Your Mercedes:
    '93 500SL-32, '01 W210 Estate E240, 02 R230 SL500 (Malcolm Spec), 04 Smart Roadster Coupe
    The 722.6 is used in everything from a C180 right up to SL600 V12 twin turbos but.. they are NOT the same box.
    The 722.6 family is internally different in every application. - this can be number of clutch plates in the clutch packs, thickness of plates, material etc.
    You need to compare the full model number and not just '722.6' to find if the box is the same as the other models with larger engines.
     
  6. M80

    M80 Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,961
    Likes Received:
    328
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2006
    Location:
    Derbyshire
    Your Mercedes:
    Viano 3.0 ExLWB (09)
    I can't remember the max torque capability of the 5 speed box but thought it was way higher than we would likely get to with mods.

    A chap with a Vito 320 V6 CDI using the same box has modded to what I considered to be a crazy output.
    Larger turbo, that would likely make it less pleasurable around town, and remapping to 420BHP (so the torque would presumably be increased by similar proportions).
    Talking to him he certainly enjoys the loud pedal response. The whole van with 22" wheels and dropped suspension is designed for using up tyres in short distances. He has been using the van like that for some time, but I would consider longevity must be affected some, even if it's just wearing the clutches out a lot faster.

    For me a remap would get close enough to 320 output to be enough. The 270 isn't lazy anyway.
    With what you are considering you will soon spend much more than the cars value.
     
  7. alexanderfoti

    alexanderfoti Moderator

    Messages:
    9,552
    Likes Received:
    785
    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Location:
    West London
    Your Mercedes:
    W221 S65 AMG - W204 C63 AMG
    The Vito V6 would have the 722.9 box I would have thought? Not sure if they paired the V6 CDI with the 722.6 in any application?

    Yes for sure, it would be peaky and the lag would be larger with a bigger turbo.

    I would do the same as you, remap and call it a day.
     
  8. M80

    M80 Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,961
    Likes Received:
    328
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2006
    Location:
    Derbyshire
    Your Mercedes:
    Viano 3.0 ExLWB (09)
    I a
    Assumed the same till I started the research.
    As far as I'm aware all 639 V6 have the 722.6, mine does as did his. Apparently they all have a flipp' DPF too.

    Probably my poor memory but didn't the 5 speed have a greater torque capability than the 7 speed, generally?
     
  9. alexanderfoti

    alexanderfoti Moderator

    Messages:
    9,552
    Likes Received:
    785
    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Location:
    West London
    Your Mercedes:
    W221 S65 AMG - W204 C63 AMG
    Aha interesting!

    Initially they did not have a version available to replace the highest torque capacity 722.6 until 2011.

    They also fitted a higher capcity box to the v6 cdi 320 than the straight 6 cdi (700nm for the v6 vs the 580 for the I6)
     
    Wighty and M80 like this.
  10. V6Matty

    V6Matty Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,156
    Likes Received:
    347
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2012
    Location:
    Newark, Notts
    Your Mercedes:
    S212/10/E350(His) W169/2005/A180 (Hers)
    Just decat, delete egr in the remap and bigger intercooler, that will take you quite happily to around 245/250 BHP and about 300 tourques, you could upgrade the injectors and the turbo cartridge (just fit the one from a 320) but to be honest the costs here are starting to outweigh the value and investment in dyno time to get it ll working properly.
     
  11. V6Matty

    V6Matty Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,156
    Likes Received:
    347
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2012
    Location:
    Newark, Notts
    Your Mercedes:
    S212/10/E350(His) W169/2005/A180 (Hers)
    If you just go for decat, egr delete and remap you will get around 225BHP and 240 torques
     
  12. KeithJG

    KeithJG Senior Member

    Messages:
    139
    Likes Received:
    13
    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2014
    Location:
    Dover, Kent
    Your Mercedes:
    C320CDI Sport Edition S203 2006 V6 7g
    Is this helpful?

    Gearbox Max.

    211.006 box 722.699 = 330Nm (220)
    211.008 box 722.640 = 580Nm (220)
    211.016 box 722.640 = 580Nm (270)
    211.026 box 722.626 = 580Nm (320)
     
  13. LostKiwi

    LostKiwi Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,193
    Likes Received:
    4,230
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2006
    Location:
    Midlands / Charente-Maritime
    Your Mercedes:
    '93 500SL-32, '01 W210 Estate E240, 02 R230 SL500 (Malcolm Spec), 04 Smart Roadster Coupe
    OP is a W203 - have you the same info for them?
     
  14. KeithJG

    KeithJG Senior Member

    Messages:
    139
    Likes Received:
    13
    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2014
    Location:
    Dover, Kent
    Your Mercedes:
    C320CDI Sport Edition S203 2006 V6 7g
    Sorry new to facts and figures just thought you ignored the first model numbers like this:-
    Will the OP know what numbered box he has because of his model?
    Gearbox Max.

    box 722.699 = 330Nm (220)
    box 722.640 = 580Nm (220)
    box 722.640 = 580Nm (270)
    box 722.626 = 580Nm (320)

    I have now just stumbled on this haven`t read it all yet?

    http://forums.mbclub.co.uk/threads/max-torque-rating-of-c220-w203-autobox.67650/
     
  15. LostKiwi

    LostKiwi Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,193
    Likes Received:
    4,230
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2006
    Location:
    Midlands / Charente-Maritime
    Your Mercedes:
    '93 500SL-32, '01 W210 Estate E240, 02 R230 SL500 (Malcolm Spec), 04 Smart Roadster Coupe
    I was looking at the 211.xxx and the link through to the box. Not sure if MB uses the same box for the same engine in different models.

    It appears the gearbox may have a W5A.xxx number stamped into it. The xxx is the torque rating for the box.

    So far I've found references to W5A-330, 380, 400, 460, 580 gearboxes but no cross reference to engines/models/722.xxx numbers.
     
  16. LostKiwi

    LostKiwi Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,193
    Likes Received:
    4,230
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2006
    Location:
    Midlands / Charente-Maritime
    Your Mercedes:
    '93 500SL-32, '01 W210 Estate E240, 02 R230 SL500 (Malcolm Spec), 04 Smart Roadster Coupe
    M80 likes this.
  17. LostKiwi

    LostKiwi Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,193
    Likes Received:
    4,230
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2006
    Location:
    Midlands / Charente-Maritime
    Your Mercedes:
    '93 500SL-32, '01 W210 Estate E240, 02 R230 SL500 (Malcolm Spec), 04 Smart Roadster Coupe
    Just found there is also a W5A-900 and W5A-1000 (!!!) fitted to the V12 bi-turbo as in the R230 SL600.

    Also a check on EPC shows the C270.016 is fitted with the W5A-580 gearbox so has a max input torque of 580Nm so should be plenty strong enough (same torque capacity as SL55 5.5 litre supercharged V8).
     
  18. alexanderfoti

    alexanderfoti Moderator

    Messages:
    9,552
    Likes Received:
    785
    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Location:
    West London
    Your Mercedes:
    W221 S65 AMG - W204 C63 AMG
    You are correct, I was reading from an ML270 which appears to have a 300nm version which is odd. The reality is the gearbox is the last thing to worry about. If you hit the torque limit it will just go into neutral. If you drive it hard you will wear the clutches (which only wear when changing gear). Its the hard/fast changes that wear them. Just mod it until the box goes into limp mode then mod the valve body for increased pressure or swap the box for a higher capacity one.
     
  19. V6Matty

    V6Matty Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,156
    Likes Received:
    347
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2012
    Location:
    Newark, Notts
    Your Mercedes:
    S212/10/E350(His) W169/2005/A180 (Hers)
    The 163 270 will be a 612 where the 203 270 will be a 647, much better engine IMO and much better at putting tourque down so with the above figures you should be good for tuning a fair amount
     
  20. alexanderfoti

    alexanderfoti Moderator

    Messages:
    9,552
    Likes Received:
    785
    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Location:
    West London
    Your Mercedes:
    W221 S65 AMG - W204 C63 AMG
    I do wonder what the real differences are with those engines.

    The 612 has 370 N⋅m @1600–2800 rpm + 125kw @4200rpm.
    The 647 has 400 NM @1800-2600rpm + 130Kw @4200rpm.

    Apart from Variable Geo turbo's they seems to be identical...
     

Share This Page