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Amazon Replaced DRLs - CL500 not playing nice.

Discussion in 'Electrics, Vacuum, Ignition and ECU' started by Submariner1, Mar 19, 2017.

  1. Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Windsor Berkshire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    Amazon were great spoke yesterday, new kit arrived today.
    Obviously tried them before cutting the plugs off to squeeze through the cable route.

    Connected the + to battery, and both negatives to the - battery terminal.
    Yippee engine starts, LEDs work, cut engine LEDs stop .... perfect. Tried 4 times, perfect :):)

    Other than I was advised by MB main dear, to use the VEP [vehicle earth point]
    So I .Swapped the earth point to the Vehicle Earth Point.

    It Worked 3 times with no switch off, and then reverted back to switching on the LEDs, then 9 secs later they turn off and then come back on again 2 secs later. But now its doing this 3 out of 5 times.

    I also wonder if I had left the negative on the battery - terninal, would it have started to play up there too. ( rain stopped testing out)

    It could be
    1. Amazon have a faulty batch
    2. By using the V.E.P the battery control module is doing something these DRLs dont like.

    Where would you earth them? Battery negative terminal or the VEP?

    If tomorrow I put the earth back on the battery and get no faults, would you ignore MBs advice and do what the instructions say , namely use the battery negative as the earth?
    Or do as MB say and use the VEP, and live with the switch off routine.

    Personally I could handle the switch off, I am. Only concerned something is not working correctly and wonder could that damage the car?

    Any views much appreciated and does anyone know, what does this battery control module actually do?
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2017
  2. Yugguy

    Yugguy Senior Member

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    Location:
    Rugby, UK
    Your Mercedes:
    C220CDI W204 Elegance Comand
    There are several earthing points in my w204 engine bay. One is the bolt for the expansion tank. There's another the other side of the by. Look for bolts with other earth wires already on.
     
  3. OP
    Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Windsor Berkshire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    Thanks, I have been shown the official earth point [ VEP ] its a one inch long M8 brass stud.
    My issue is understanding why the DRLs appear (not conclusivily proved) to work correctly when earthed to the battery terminal, but switch off after 10 seconds for a period of 2 seconds when earthed to the VEP.

    My main dealer head technician said earth the CTEK charger on this VEP.
     
  4. houseboss2

    houseboss2 Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Leicestershire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 09/09 (2010 my) 32K Palladium/Black
    Any chance of a photo of the official earth point.

    Michael
     
  5. alexanderfoti

    alexanderfoti Moderator

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    Location:
    West London
    Your Mercedes:
    W221 S65 AMG, C203 220 CDI
    Do they turn on, then off once, or do they repeat this cycle continuously?
     
  6. OP
    Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

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    Location:
    Windsor Berkshire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    Of course as soon as it stops raining
     
  7. OP
    Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,986
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    7
    Location:
    Windsor Berkshire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    They turn on, 9 seconds later go off , stay off for 2 secs, then turn themselves on. They then stay on until you stop the car engine.

    So it is just a one thing me blip.
     
  8. alexanderfoti

    alexanderfoti Moderator

    Messages:
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    Location:
    West London
    Your Mercedes:
    W221 S65 AMG, C203 220 CDI
    Is there an option to use a switched 12v input?

    If you monitor charging voltage after start, it probably goes up, then down, then stabilises, which is what causes them to turn on, off, then on again.
     
  9. OP
    Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

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    Location:
    Windsor Berkshire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    Finally 5 days later I get this alledgedly from Philips technical

    "The temporary off and on at the beginning that you described to me on the phone happens because the
    Control box is not able to detect the harmonics needed, e.g. because they are too low during some kind of eco mode operation, etc."

    Doesnt inspire me with confidence .... imo "the language of the lost"
     
  10. OP
    Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Windsor Berkshire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    Thanks Alex
    I suspected that might be the case, and previously monitored the charging voltage straight after starting. The voltage before starting the engine read 12.8V
    Directly after charging it was 12.1V and quickly, and consistently rose in increments of 0.1 V to 14.2V at idle. But it never went down. It took 10 seconds to reach 14.2V and stabilise. Coincendently thats when the leds came back on and stayed on.

    Philips have now suggested that instead of grounding the Blue wire, that I should connect that to the + Ign. acc terminal.

    Both my main dealer and MBS said its better not to use a switched ign. Acc, i.e. Keep this non MB unit, away from the monitored MB wiring.

    Alternatively as on the initial trial of the replacement kit, when both the blue and the black were connected to the actual battery negative terminal. For 4x engine starts there was no LED switch off.
    So, I could move the black and blue wires back to the battery neg. term and do about 10 engine starts. And if it works leave it at that.
    But that goes against the advice of the good MB technician, who said it was much safer to use the VEP as a ground; because if you dont you can confuse the BCM ( in my single battery case, the Battery Sensor Module ).

    Personally I could live with it turning off once, as it does.
    Do you think leaving it with this little glitch could harm the car in any way?
     
  11. alexanderfoti

    alexanderfoti Moderator

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    7,767
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    Location:
    West London
    Your Mercedes:
    W221 S65 AMG, C203 220 CDI
    I would do this, I see no issues with this method.

    I see no issue with leaving it as is either. You can have imagine it as your car blinking :)
     
  12. Yugguy

    Yugguy Senior Member

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    Location:
    Rugby, UK
    Your Mercedes:
    C220CDI W204 Elegance Comand
    Sub, yep, there is the vep, the brass rod, but there are also several other bolts in the engine bay that are earth points, try one of those and see. My DRLs use one of these and are fine.
     
  13. OP
    Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
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    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    Thanks
    I did, naturally I got the same result as with the VEP; because as you pointed out they are the same thing.
    Other than the VEP from the factory has no other wires attached and a sort of extra welded on the body washer. I assume so you can get a ground to bare metal without compromising the anti-rust layers
     
  14. OP
    Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Windsor Berkshire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    Thanks Alex
    I think I will go with the blink. My nearest ign.acc is in the fusebox on the other side of the engine. Plus tbh I am not sure how to get the wire out in a "waterproof way"
    Also its the easiest way should they fail , i.e. To replace.
     
  15. OP
    Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

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    Location:
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    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    Hi Michael
    [​IMG]

    Its the hollow - brass top hat elongated nut - as seen on the right hand side, half way up the picture.
    Just parralell and to the right of those two, short, curved, aluminium pipes (curving off to the right) .
    Its a 13mm socket, brass "nut" on a M8 Stud.

    ( Tip do not drop it ...
    Mine fell and it took me 1/2 hour to claw it back with a grabber ) lol

    So its on the passenger side, inner metal wheel arch ... above the blue washer fluid res.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2017
  16. houseboss2

    houseboss2 Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Leicestershire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 09/09 (2010 my) 32K Palladium/Black
    Thankyou Sub1

    I had used the post on the "strap" to the left of the correct "top Hat post"

    Thank you for your trouble.


    Michael
     
  17. OP
    Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Windsor Berkshire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    My pleasure, the really brilliant technician, said the top hat was best, because it didnt disturb the harness, and thus avoided rust building up .. that potentially could cause in the future current drains/false indicators to Star etc.
    That said some silicone jelly sandwiched down by the nut would achieve the same result.

    But he really did not like the idea of grounding on the battery negative.
    I think this battery control module does quite a lot.

    By the way you got a storming deal on your car.
    If my understanding is correct you bought it in October 2015 making it 6 years old.
    Try looking for a march 2011 CL500 with AMG body mods and 26,500 miles ... more like £31,000 from a trader!
    I think they have gone up in price. :)
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2017
  18. houseboss2

    houseboss2 Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Leicestershire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 09/09 (2010 my) 32K Palladium/Black
    I took a long time to find the right car and this has proved worth while, as to date I have not had one problem and the car looks better now than it did when purchased.

    I have recently used a clay bar on all of the bodywork and also the wheels. This was easier than I anticipated with the car being garaged, I could take my time with it and do it as and when I was in the mood.

    I am about to get it serviced for the second time in my ownership and after reading about growla66 problems, I have decided to stay with main agent as I feel it may be prudent to maintain mobilo life facility.

    As the car is now over 7 years old I was quoted £159 value service or £275 for full service with continued mobilo by MB Leicester (Inchcape).

    I still review the adverts out of interest but am aware that Mercedes depreciation on large coupes is still quite a high annual percentage and have accepted this as the car is still well worth it. A 5 Star driving experience that I have not experienced in any other car.

    Michael
     
  19. OP
    Submariner1

    Submariner1 Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Windsor Berkshire
    Your Mercedes:
    CL500 2009 5.5
    Finally Philips technical called me back, 7 days later!
    No wonder he didnt want to speak to me. His lack of basic electrics, vehicle knowledge and logic was scary!

    Conversely, the Problem solved by Carl at MBS in 3 mins!

    In summary I am connecting the Red to battery Positive, and the Black and the Blue control wire to VEP. As recommended by MB MD and Carl and Alex.
    I will live with the "one time switch off and on", on startup.
    Most think this is due to a transient low voltage beneath the DRL kit's min. Voltage threshold, until the Altenator stabilises at a high enough voltage.
     
  20. Yugguy

    Yugguy Senior Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Rugby, UK
    Your Mercedes:
    C220CDI W204 Elegance Comand
    mountings.jpg

    for ref here is where my drls are grounded. They are the black wire, the brown are other earth wires already there.
     

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