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Xtractorfan

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Don't see the need to complain about arguments that happen online, No one gets hurt, Its just that we can't all be of the same mind on these things. And my point of view is generally the one that is right and proper ..ha lol ...
This Brexit thing is worthy of discussion, because it is a major upset and upheaval for many many people, and comment and debate cannot be stifled by a few who think that closing the thread or banning certain people will make the problem go away.
And it gets more interesting now that Boris has decided to give the NHS the £350 mil per week that was promised during the referendum campaign.
 

malcolm E53 AMG

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Agree with the above!

Politics by it's very nature is a very emotive subject and therefore opinions will be put strongly which means from time to time there will be disagreements but they shouldn't lapse into personal comments.

I've found this thread very interesting, entertaining and enlightening and like the subject itself it has polarised members into two extreme viewpoints you are for or against Brexit

I've made my views very clear as have a lot of other forum members on here so let's continue the debate it's the most important decision this country has had to make this century
 

Yugguy

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It doesn't need X's constant insinuations that we're all stupid because we don't agree with him.

Now LK's views are quite opposite to mine but I certainly don't think he's stupid, in fact he sounds like a thoroughly decent bloke I could happily have a drink with.
 

AMGeed

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Don't see the need to complain about arguments that happen online, No one gets hurt, Its just that we can't all be of the same mind on these things.

As long as the arguments don't turn too personal, I'd agree with this.
When two opposing sides of the political spectrum have the opportunity to post an opinion, and not necessarily fact, there are bound to be disagreements. Trying to keep it civil whilst putting your point across seems to be the problem.

I would hope one of admin/mods would message me if I have overstepped the line.
 

Xtractorfan

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Not sure I've ever used the word stupid to describe any other member on here, possibly in a literary way to belittle some of our elected elite, but certainly never a fellow member on here, .It is a big boys club, many varied and differing opinions.
I just happen to have socialist view on these things. But that should not be held against me, Jeremy needs all the support he can get if we are ever to get this great country back on its feet again and being of benefit to everyone, not just the privileged few.
 

Frontstep

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Don't see the need to complain about arguments that happen online, No one gets hurt, Its just that we can't all be of the same mind on these things. And my point of view is generally the one that is right and proper ..ha lol ...
This Brexit thing is worthy of discussion, because it is a major upset and upheaval for many many people, and comment and debate cannot be stifled by a few who think that closing the thread or banning certain people will make the problem go away.
And it gets more interesting now that Boris has decided to give the NHS the £350 mil per week that was promised during the referendum campaign.


That repeats the same mistake as that made during the referendum campaign Boris actually said;

“It would be a fine thing, as many of us have pointed out, if a lot of that money went on the NHS, provided we use that cash injection to modernise and make the most of new technology.


Tis any wonder so many voted to remain, they didn't understand the debate.
 

LostKiwi

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That repeats the same mistake as that made during the referendum campaign Boris actually said;

“It would be a fine thing, as many of us have pointed out, if a lot of that money went on the NHS, provided we use that cash injection to modernise and make the most of new technology.


Tis any wonder so many voted to remain, they didn't understand the debate.
On the contrary I did. I just didn't believe Boris that it would.
 

M80

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I wouldn't pay too much notice of Boris's latest dribble.
Just one of the career politicians that's feeling insecure that David Davies is being set up as future PM when TM steps aside.

Anything for attention with Boris.
 

Frontstep

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Boris deriding the £100 billion exit bill was widely reported, now its reported we are offering a fifth of that Boris's star maybe just maybe !!!!!!!!
 

keefysher

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Has Mayhem made her speech yet?

Not heard it yet, nor seen the transcript. Have seen and heard meedja hysteria, but nothing concrete.

I love this public negotiation. Would you run a business with everything out in the open?
 

Yugguy

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41355186

It is often assumed that the right-wing, anti-EU stance is a UK-only phenomena.

Not sure it is really. And while I don't want the rise of far-right movemements any more than a left-winger would, this strikes me as having the same root cause as UKIP's rise did - when people's concerns (legitimate or not) are swept under the carpet.
 

Craiglxviii

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Has Mayhem made her speech yet?

Not heard it yet, nor seen the transcript. Have seen and heard meedja hysteria, but nothing concrete.

I love this public negotiation. Would you run a publically-owned business with everything out in the open before it had been put to the shareholders?[/QUOTE]


FTFY... ;)
 

LostKiwi

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41355186

It is often assumed that the right-wing, anti-EU stance is a UK-only phenomena.

Not sure it is really. And while I don't want the rise of far-right movemements any more than a left-winger would, this strikes me as having the same root cause as UKIP's rise did - when people's concerns (legitimate or not) are swept under the carpet.


I don't think there is too much doubt that voters the world over are disenchanted by their political leaders and political systems.
The Brexit vote has been acknowledged by some to be a protest vote as much as a real desire to leave the EU. Trump similarly was a protest against the political families in the US. Macron likewise was a new face with no real history or ties to the status quo.

Personally I would expect to see more of these 'unexpected' results from elections. As the dominant force in most of the western world is in the band of centre left to centre right then any rebellion from voters will by default be more likely to the extremes of one or the other of Right or Left - anything else is just more of the same and many electorates know that's not what they want.

Much of this change can be laid at the door of social media. Social media gives the ability for anyone to have a soapbox to stand on and be heard, and those who are persuasive will have a following that will make those views pervasive across a larger cross section of the population. Increasingly we see social media being used by politicians (Trump for example with his regular 'inflammatory' tweets where he will say something to gauge the reaction before taking his next step).

There are without doubt interesting and difficult times ahead for politicians.
 

davidsl500

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She is speaking around 2.15pm UK time today. Barnier will speak shortly afterwards. No doubt he will generally trash the speech in the normal european "how dare you leave us" way..

I'm not particularly against the idea of a 2 year transitional arrangement after the Brexit deadline, it would give more time to get all the mechanics in place. That's, of course, subject to us being able to be able to negotiate trading agreements elsewhere during the transition phase. We've paid into it for 40 years so another couple won't hurt and would fulfil our 2013-2020 Budget "responsibility". I presume the markets would also prefer an easy exit.
 

M80

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I don't think there is too much doubt that voters the world over are disenchanted by their political leaders and political systems.

Personally I would expect to see more of these 'unexpected' results from elections.

There are without doubt interesting and difficult times ahead for politicians.

I think there is an increasing chance that subversive methods will be used to squash up and coming political threats, a little in the style of Putin but less extreme and often more discreet.
Infiltrate, discredit, accuse. Before they get going they are caused to turn on themselves, shown to us as extremists, corrupt or deviants.
At home we've seen the Tories use some very anti democratic tactics to see off opposition, and the penalties encourage this.
 

Craiglxviii

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I think there is an increasing chance that subversive methods will be used to squash up and coming political threats, a little in the style of Putin but less extreme and often more discreet.
Infiltrate, discredit, accuse. Before they get going they are caused to turn on themselves, shown to us as extremists, corrupt or deviants.
At home we've seen the Tories use some very anti democratic tactics to see off opposition, and the penalties encourage this.

That's as old as the hills. It's not discreet either, it's done in literal full public view in the House every day. In Australia they occasionally have fistfights in the Commons. Incidentally, this whole question is at the heart of Trump's movement... bringing the US back to the Constitution and its freedoms. It's what the people want, and one of those things is freedom of speech & expression.

Politicians can only keep the people silent for so long before there is bloodshed. October 1917, Germany 1918 are good examples of this.
 

Yugguy

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And in shocking news, May's Brexit speech is praised by the Tories and rubbished by Labour. Who'd've thunk it?

****** politicians, what is the point of them?
 

keefysher

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Well that was a load of waffle. Are they staying for Pizza in Firenze, or popping down to Sienna for the weekend on expenses?
 

Frontstep

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The media have whipped up a none story over Boris and the 100 million exit bill, then theres the simply daft hard/soft brexit, why not report the news rather than the fiction ?
How many times has the red bus line been mis- reported they even tried the same with Boris's newspaper article.
 
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