Brexit

[jonthetourist]

Into a TOTALLY different organisation. Had people known what would happen, they would not have been such enthusiasm.

Maybe. I reckon Britain in the 70s would have jumped at any club that would let us join. People forget how cr6p we were.

(Except Allegro owners. We never forget!)

 

[jp williams]

A quick but serious question if I may.

Who are we to trust to provide us with the FACTS about whether to leave or stay on 23 June?

We can't trust DC or his acolytes - they want us in no matter what
We can't trust Corbyn or his muppets - they believe that being in will further their federalist aims
We can't trust Galloway or some of the other loons promoting out - they want anything that upsets the status quo
We can't trust Frau Merkel or other Euro leaders who have just generously given us meaningless concessions that can be overturned by the faceless and non-representative European Parliament (after we have voted)
We can't trust big business - they are only interested in their own interests and bonuses
We can't trust Joe Public (you and me) as we know nothing

So who are we to trust? Maybe the BBC but they will no doubt (thinking of their Charter renewal) be leaned on by the Govt to toe the party line.

All of the above (excluding possibly the BBC if they are brave enough) are going to feed us lies (or versions of lies), misinformation and scaremonger stories to promote the fear factor.

Since DC came back from Brussels I've been racking my brain on this one but so far have failed to come up with an answer. Any suggestions anyone or will we all be as wise as we are today when we make the decision in June and place our mark on the ballot paper?

Help!!

In 1939 we stood largely alone. No facts could be available,only the certainty that tough times lay ahead. We chose not to be dominated by others and we accepted the consequences.They were hard to take and had devastating effects. The easy decision would have been to have others govern us and tell us what to do. Matters of principle require courage to be shown.
I wish to determine my own future. The consequences of my decision, I will have to bear.

Regards

John..

 

[LostKiwi]

In 1939 we stood largely alone. No facts could be available,only the certainty that tough times lay ahead. We chose not to be dominated by others and we accepted the consequences.They were hard to take and had devastating effects. The easy decision would have been to have others govern us and tell us what to do. Matters of principle require courage to be shown.
I wish to determine my own future. The consequences of my decision, I will have to bear.

Regards

John..

You weren't alone. You had the Commonwealth back then. An entire Empire to fall back on.

 

[AMGeed]

You weren't alone. You had the Commonwealth back then. An entire Empire to fall back on.

You are right. And I hope they are still our friends and allies.

Out for me. Impossible immigration influx and UK taxes wasted propping up less wealthy countries are more than enough for me to vote no.
Cameron has gone the same way as Tony Bliar having a great first term and now going downhill faster than a bob sleigher.

 

[Frontstep]

Do we really have to hide behind the EU's skirts have we really fallen that far, how sad that people think we are so helpless.

It makes you wonder why would so many want to come here if that were true ?

 

[peterdh]

I have just seen an article in the Daily Telegraph which makes interesting reading and have copied a link to it here http://tinyurl.com/hxfc4ra
I thought it was a good starting point in my quest to find more information and guidance on the vexed question facing us all.

PS I always thought the DT was a true Blue paper. Not so, in this case, it seems.

 

[prwales]

It makes you wonder why would so many want to come here if that were true ?

Isn't it about the desire for a better life, how many of us have Irish antecedents who came here to escape famine or to feed the Industrial Revolution. Where's the difference other than 150 years or so twixt them and Romanians/Bulgarians or people from South Asia who come here to work and to better themselves.

 

[LostKiwi]

I have just seen an article in the Daily Telegraph which makes interesting reading and have copied a link to it here http://tinyurl.com/hxfc4ra
I thought it was a good starting point in my quest to find more information and guidance on the vexed question facing us all.

PS I always thought the DT was a true Blue paper. Not so, in this case, it seems.

Lots of emotive phrases but no substance.

 

[LostKiwi]

Isn't it about the desire for a better life, how many of us have Irish antecedents who came here to escape famine or to feed the Industrial Revolution. Where's the difference other than 150 years or so twixt them and Romanians/Bulgarians or people from South Asia who come here to work and to better themselves.

Its not often I agree with you but this is one time.
If we don't want immigrants instead of shutting borders and adding to the have/have not resentment surely its better to improve their country and bring all of Europe to a common level and make it less attractive to move as a result?
If that means that for some time we pay more in than we get back then so be it. In the end all benefit.

 

[nicholas15]

Belief before trust

A quick but serious question if I may.

Who are we to trust to provide us with the FACTS about whether to leave or stay on 23 June?

We can't trust DC or his acolytes - they want us in no matter what
We can't trust Corbyn or his muppets - they believe that being in will further their federalist aims
We can't trust Galloway or some of the other loons promoting out - they want anything that upsets the status quo
We can't trust Frau Merkel or other Euro leaders who have just generously given us meaningless concessions that can be overturned by the faceless and non-representative European Parliament (after we have voted)
We can't trust big business - they are only interested in their own interests and bonuses
We can't trust Joe Public (you and me) as we know nothing

So who are we to trust? Maybe the BBC but they will no doubt (thinking of their Charter renewal) be leaned on by the Govt to toe the party line.

All of the above (excluding possibly the BBC if they are brave enough) are going to feed us lies (or versions of lies), misinformation and scaremonger stories to promote the fear factor.

Since DC came back from Brussels I've been racking my brain on this one but so far have failed to come up with an answer. Any suggestions anyone or will we all be as wise as we are today when we make the decision in June and place our mark on the ballot paper?

Help!!

Brexit is an issue about whether you want the UK to stand on its own two feet or as part of a European club. The views of others may be sincere, or not. You may trust them, or not. But this is not about a fitter advising you which tyre to fit. It is about what kind of country you want for the future.

Either way may be better or worse; in part it depends on what kind of UK you want to try and create.

 

[prwales]

Its not often I agree with you but this is one time.
If we don't want immigrants instead of shutting borders and adding to the have/have not resentment surely its better to improve their country and bring all of Europe to a common level and make it less attractive to move as a result?
If that means that for some time we pay more in than we get back then so be it. In the end all benefit.

broadly speaking that's the purpose of the EUs regional development fund

 

[Frontstep]

Its not often I agree with you but this is one time.
If we don't want immigrants instead of shutting borders and adding to the have/have not resentment surely its better to improve their country and bring all of Europe to a common level and make it less attractive to move as a result?
If that means that for some time we pay more in than we get back then so be it. In the end all benefit.

I haven't heard anyone wanting to shut borders just control the numbers.
The idea that the "hotel owner" should pay more taxes because some potential visitors to his hotel come from a duff place is amusing.

Immigration is good for the country but only when we know who is coming and for what and when.

My Doctor friends in immigrant hotspots are literally run ragged, the maternity units are groaning and the schools can have english as a second language for over half the pupils in some classes,

local authority housing is in meltdown, all could have been avoided by a measured approach involving letting people from all over the world have a chance of coming here on merit.

 

[LostKiwi]

I haven't heard anyone wanting to shut borders just control the numbers.
The idea that the "hotel owner" should pay more taxes because some potential visitors to his hotel come from a duff place is amusing.

Immigration is good for the country but only when we know who is coming and for what and when.

My Doctor friends in immigrant hotspots are literally run ragged, the maternity units are groaning and the schools can have english as a second language for over half the pupils in some classes,

local authority housing is in meltdown, all could have been avoided by a measured approach involving letting people from all over the world have a chance of coming here on merit.

Everywhere I go the doctors (and not referring to GPs) ARE immigrants....

 

[prwales]

local authority housing is in meltdown, all could have been avoided by a measured approach involving letting people from all over the world have a chance of coming here on merit.

When our council housing stock, which was a community asset was sold off for coppers this was a predictable result, not only in Thatchers time but its ongoing the current Council House right to buy discount for London is over £100k


https://www.gov.uk/right-to-buy-buying-your-council-home/discounts

 

[Frontstep]

Everywhere I go the doctors (and not referring to GPs) ARE immigrants....

What is your point they would still be welcomed in

 

[PovertySpec]

Everywhere I go the doctors (and not referring to GPs) ARE immigrants....

Says the immigrant

Most immigrant stories in the press are designed to wind up the readership and are full of selective and/or misinformation.

The NHS would collapse if it wasn't for migrant workers, the vast majority of whom do a fantastic job. I think the quality vs. quantity argument is valid. If wife and I were to move to Aus/NZ we would have to pass their tests for suitability, eligibility have a job to go to and be sponsored etc. We've thought about it, checked it out, it's doable for us.

The UK has almost no test for suitability. Eligibility for admission seems to be how adept you are at thieving your way from the 'stan and bunking in on an artic.

The fact that many people want to come here is a testament to how good it is here and who here, born elsewhere in some corrupt war-torn dump, wouldn't want to make a better life for their family elsewhere?

Can't blame the migrants, can blame the politicians for making it so easy with so few sanctions available.

 

[C350Carl]

This made me chuckle today.

 

[turbopete]

This made me chuckle today.

i saw that last night. whoever it is that thinks up these things to use on that spoof account is a genius IMO on so many occasions!

 

[C350Carl]

Just to briefly go off topic. This one is brilliant.

 

[V6Matty]

Love those Carl thank you, made mine and the wife's night