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C63 Head Bolts?

Discussion in 'Engine, Drivetrain, Fuel and Exhaust' started by Jonathan Schofield, Oct 11, 2017.

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  1. Jonathan Schofield

    Jonathan Schofield New Member

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    Your Mercedes:
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    I am now the proud owner of a 2008 C63 Estate. It has full MBSH and as far as I can tell has been quite well looked after. The car is original, not chipped, messed up or buggered about with but, as always with my cars, bought with a rush of blood....
    However, I have read on here and elsewhere about "head bolts" on earlier 6.3lt engines and would like to know more about the problem from a new owners perspective. I think it's a M156 engine, where do I find the engine number? The one on the log book is not realted to thenumbers seen in these threads.

    So the car is 9 years old and has covered 73000 miles, what is the danger period for head bolt failure, what are the warning signs and what may be done to prevent it.

    Incidentally, when I bought the car a few weeks ago I of course checked the oil filler cap for 'sludge' (there was none) but this evening having another check I managed to break the plastic oil filler cap and now have the car off road until JCT600 deliver a new one.... Friday with luck.

    The car is currently my daily driver, I've already put 3200 miles on it and is shaping up to be one of my all time favourites.

    More info here: www.betterbangers.com

    Best

    Jonathan
     
  2. John Laidlaw

    John Laidlaw Senior Member

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    Engine numbers ending 60658 and onwards had modified engine bolts fitted.
    Post your VIN number on here and we can get you your engine number....
     
  3. Steve@Avantgarde

    Steve@Avantgarde Forum Supporter Authorised Forum Supporter

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    Sadly I have seen some after that prod number fail too.

    It's no big drama really, you remove the rocker covers and replace the headbolts one at a time, unless there has been sludge then its recommended to lift the heads to replace the gaskets.

    You will likely have more issues with rattly tappets on the early 63's rather than headbolts.
     
  4. John Laidlaw

    John Laidlaw Senior Member

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    Really Steve? Didn’t realise there had been issues with the modified head bolts too- but yes as you say it’s not a big drama and certainly not the blown out of proportion issue some folks created. Certainly the 156 is a great engine apart from the tappets as you say
     
  5. Big Cheese

    Big Cheese Senior Member

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    Also the oil rings on the end of the camshaft are prone to failure.Both mine on my ML63 W156 have gone in the last 6mhts causing the housing to badly score & need replacing.Luckily the camshaft sensors are magnetic so there were no bits of oil ring floating about the engine.Tappets as mentioned are also a issue but are relatively inexpensive but just be aware that if you are doing the job yourself that a special tool is needed for retiming.
     
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  6. AMGeed

    AMGeed Senior Member

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    I don't think its the modified head bolts causing problems John, more that engines later that 60658 have been found to have failing original head bolts.

    For the OP, there are a few threads about this issue if you have a search around. Here is one you may find interesting.
    http://forums.mercedesclub.org.uk/index.php?threads/c63-head-bolt-issues.137876/#post-1227361
     
  7. OP
    Jonathan Schofield

    Jonathan Schofield New Member

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    Thank you all for your replies, I am sure that my engine is below(?) 60658 as the car is 2008 vintage, quite an early one. However the chassis number is : WDD2042772F166081 so it may be useful to know it's number.

    However my original question still stands, how worried do I need to be, what can I do to mitigate any risk and what are the warning signs.

    Bought a new oil filler cap, £16.50 from JCT600 in Harrogate, arrives tomorrow.
     
  8. AMGeed

    AMGeed Senior Member

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    There have not been many posts on either UK MB forums where the bolts have failed on this engine, I would imagine that after 9 years, the bolts would have failed by now so I wouldn't wory too much. I don't know if a Tier 1 MB warranty covers this or not but it might be worth investigating for peace of mind.
    Unfortunately, your engine number does come under the list for possible failure as you can see from the datacard attached 027356

    Main data
    Parameter Value
    Ident. number (FIN) WDD2042772F166081
    VIN WDD2042772F166081
    Baumuster 204277
    Sales name C 63 AMG

    Order number 0 8 537 17611 (Destination: Great Britain)
    Delivery date 25 04 2008
    PAINT1 775U BRIGHT SILVER METALLIC CLEAR COAT PAINT
    Interior color 201A LEATHER - BLACK/ANTHRACITE
    Engine 156985 60 027536
    Gearbox 722907 01 751673
    General data for model code 204277

    Parameter Value
    200A LEATHER
    201A LEATHER - BLACK/ANTHRACITE
    205B OWNERS MANUAL AND SERVICE RECORD - ENGLISH
    220 PARKTRONIC SYSTEM (PTS)
    241 FRONT SEAT LH ELECTRIC ADJUSTABLE WITH MEMORY
    249 INSIDE AND OUTSIDE MIRROR AUTOMATIC DIMMING
    250B MOBILO LIFE/EUROPE SERVICE PACKAGE
    265 LINES-NO.PLATE DISCONTINUED
    275 MEMORY PACKAGE (DRIVER SEAT, STRG. COL., MIRROR)
    283B AIRBAGLABLE - ENGLISH
    287 THROUGH-LOADING FEATURE
    293 SIDEBAG IN REAR LEFT AND RIGHT
    294 KNEE AIRBAG
    297 ELECTRIC ROLLER SUN BLINDS IN REAR DOOR LH AND RH
    299 PRESAFE
    305B HEAD UNIT LANGUAGE - BRITISH ENGLISH
    310 DUAL CUP HOLDER
    335B INSTRUMENT CLUSTER/HU LANGUAGE - ENGLISH
    345 RAIN SENSOR
    386 UNIVERSAL TELEPHONY PACKAGE
    390 LINGUATRONIC-ENGLICH(BRITISH)
    414 ELECTRIC TILT/SLIDE SUNROOF IN GLASS VERSION
    427 AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION 7-SPEED
    440 TEMPOMAT (CRUISE CONTROL)
    461 INSTRUMENT WITH MILES IND. AND ENGLISH LEGEND
    477 TIRE PRESSURE LOSS WARNER
    500 OUTSIDE REAR VIEW MIRROR LH AND RH FOLDING
    512 COMAND APS WITH DVD CHANGER
    537 DIGITAL RADIO STANDARD DAB (DIGI. AUDIO BROADC.)
    551 ANTI-THEFT/ANTI-BREAK-IN WARNING SYSTEM
    581 AUTOMATIC CLIMATE CONTROL
    584 ELECTRIC WINDOW REGULATOR
    5XXL EUROPE
    600 HEADLAMPS - CLEANING EQUIPMENT
    619 CORNERING ILLUMINATION
    621 HEADLAMP WITH ILS, LEFT-HAND TRAFFIC
    666 PRODUCT PROT.F.TRANSPORT VEH. W/O TIE-DOWN HOOKS
    682 FIRE EXTINGUISHER
    690 EMERGENCY SPARE TIRE (MINI SPARE)
    739 TRIM PIECES - ALUMINUM
    73V SPEED- + LOADINDEX 94Y XL+95Y XL
    772 AMG STYLING PACKAGE-FRONT SPOILER, SIDE SKIRT
    775U BRIGHT SILVER METALLIC CLEAR COAT PAINT
    776 WHEEL ARCH ENLARGEMENT
    790 18" AMG SPOKED WHEELS WITH MIXED TIRES
    808 AEJ 07/1
    808 *1 156.9__ 20060905 AEJ 07/1
    808 *2 204____ 20050721 AEJ 07/1
    808 *3 722.9__ 20050822 YOM 17/1
    810 PREMIUM SOUND SYSTEM
    817 SIREN BRACKET FOR INCREASED THEFT PROTECTION
    873 SEAT HEATER FOR LEFT AND RIGHT FRONT SEATS
    875 HEATED SCREEN WASH SYSTEM
    882 INTERIOR SAFEGUARD
    885 HIGHTEN THEFT PROTECTION
    890 AUTOMATIC REAR-END DOOR
    954 EQUIPMENT PACKAGE FOR AVANTGARDE VEHICLES
    983 COC PAPER EURO 4 TECHNOLOGY W/O REG. CERT. PART II
    989 IDENTIFICATION LABEL UNDER WINDSHIELD
    A22 NEW CONVERTER GENERATION
    A24 JOINT FLANGE, 4-ARM 120
    A36 TORQUE CONVERTER HOUSING AGA
    A38 M - VALVE BODY ASSEMBLY WITH VGS 2
    A41 SOFTWARE 2
    A44 SOFTWARE 3
    A50 ENGINE BRACKET VARIANT
    F204 MODEL SERIES 204
    G907 TRANSMISSION CODE VERSION 07
    GA AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION
    HA REAR AXLE
    K11 ADAPTIVE STOP LIGHT FLASHING
    K14 CONTROL CODE FOR SERVICE INTERVAL 20000 KM
    M156 V8 GASOLINE ENGINE M156 - AMG
    M63 6.3 LITER DISPLACEMENT
    NB0 NEW VEHICLE DOCUMENTS: DAIMLER AG
    R RIGHT-HAND STEERING
    R01 SUMMER TIRES
    U01 REAR BELT STATUS INDICATION
    U18 AUTOMATIC CHILD SEAT RECOGNITATION (AKSE)
    U26 FLOOR MATS - AMG
    U37 FOGLAMP
    U72 DVD PLAYER WITH REGIONAL CODE 2, EUROPE, JAPAN
    VL FRONT AXLE HALF, LEFT
    VR FRONT AXLE HALF, RIGHT
    SPRINGS
    Parameter Value
    Front suspension strut A 204 320 68 66 ,
    Front springs A 204 321 42 04 ,
    Rear springs A 204 324 06 04 ,
    Rear shim A 210 325 04 84 ,
    Other information
    Parameter Value
    EU approval date 20071128
    EU approval number e1*2001/116*0457*01
    Additional info for engine
    Parameter Value
    Engine 156985 60 027536
    AGG_VAR A 156 010 12 00
    Variant A 156 010 12 00
     
  9. OP
    Jonathan Schofield

    Jonathan Schofield New Member

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    Wow, that's a whole lot of info, thank you. I guess you're right about if it was going to fail it should have done by now. I will investigate a tier 1 MB warranty and see if it's worth doing. I have the remainder of a 3 month warranty from the dealer I bought it off, but I'm fairly cynical about those.
     
  10. AMGeed

    AMGeed Senior Member

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    Have a read of this too Jonathan. A couple of years ago one guy had his replaced as a precautionary measure. Cost him £1200 at the time for ARP studs replaced one at a time without the need to remove the heads. It was done at MSL in Birmingham.
    Let me know if you want any more details. I'll find that thread and post it here for you.
    http://forums.mbclub.co.uk/threads/m156-head-bolts.209517/

    Edit......Everything you need to know
    http://forums.mbclub.co.uk/threads/my-m156-engine-mods-future-proofing.176075/
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2017
  11. OP
    Jonathan Schofield

    Jonathan Schofield New Member

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    Once again, thank you, that was an interesting thread. I think I'll start by asking my local MB dealer what they may know and I may get a quote from an indy. Does anyone know of a good one in the Harrogate, North Yorkshire area?

    Subject to all that I'll make a decision on whether to go ahead or lie awake and worry....
     
  12. AMGeed

    AMGeed Senior Member

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    MSL did the head bolts on a few cars. They have a branch in Bradford if that is any help.
    I would head to the main branch in Birmingham if I were to need the work doing.

    I edited my previous post to include a really good thread on the work done if you haven't seen it yet.
     
  13. daveenty

    daveenty Senior Member

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    Your Mercedes:
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    Stan's Garage in South Shields may be a bit closer to you?

    Good bloke and he's done a few, including Lee's C Class and his own S Class, both supercharged versions
     
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  14. John Laidlaw

    John Laidlaw Senior Member

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    I get you,so the poor ones were still inadvertently fitted in later engines
     
  15. AMGeed

    AMGeed Senior Member

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    Revised head bolts were used in the later models, but according to Steve above, some of these have failed too.
    ARP studs seem the best fix.
     
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  16. OP
    Jonathan Schofield

    Jonathan Schofield New Member

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    Spoke to the local MB dealer here (JCT600) and the manager of the servicing said that in 10 years he'd never heard of it. I asked him for a price and he came back later with £1842 inc. So that's a starting figure, I need to consider whether to spend the money, I can't really afford to chuck it about.
    Daveenty, do you happen to have a contact for Stan's garage?

    Jonathan
     
  17. daveenty

    daveenty Senior Member

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    I know your dealership, bought my last car from them in fact, though it's not something I'd be letting them loose with to be honest as, and I don't mean this disrespectfully, they wouldn't have a clue where to start...

    A good independent is where you need to be and I'd usually suggest MSL for something like this though in this case I know that Stan is closer to you. He also knows what he's doing with them as he's done my mates for him and his own S Class is awesome.

    Stan's Garage is at: -
    140A Commercial Rd
    South Shields
    NE33 1RQ

    Tel: 0191 455 4114

    No website as far as I know, just ask for Stan ;)
     
  18. The_Don

    The_Don Active Member

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    Hi
    I would get the issue 100% out of your mind, IF it strikes deal with it, enjoy that fabulous engine.
     
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  19. Steve@Avantgarde

    Steve@Avantgarde Forum Supporter Authorised Forum Supporter

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    Probably because they have never had one in...?? If he cares to read his technical partnership and TIPs bulletins, he will find a considerable amount of paperwork dedicated to the subject.

    Nothing like knowing your product.
     
  20. OP
    Jonathan Schofield

    Jonathan Schofield New Member

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    Well I gave Stan a call this afternoon, what a nice chap. Next time I'm passing South Shields (once a month, maybe) I shall call in and admire his Supercharged S63. The upshot of our conversation is that I am much more relaxed about any potential head bolt problems, his considered opinion is that it is a rare enough event not to worry about.

    Still enjoying the car!
     
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