tera lean or injector clean

[MICHAEL31]

my e class now just over the 100k, has anyone used this systems advertised for cleaning out injectors, pipes etc etc, I can have mine done for 100-00 since they did my re-map. any information welcome. thanks

 

[Craiglxviii]

Terraclean do you mean?

 

[Wighty]

my e class now just over the 100k, has anyone used this systems advertised for cleaning out injectors, pipes etc etc, I can have mine done for 100-00 since they did my re-map. any information welcome. thanks

Have a look at Archoil AR6400d , it's a lot cheaper than £100 and should leave enough change for a full fuel tank so you can do a decent motorway run in a lower gear (higher revs ) in the form of an Italian tune up . That should get the old girl back to 100% .

 

[V6Matty]

Personally had it done on the E270 and it did make a difference but not the £120 it was advertised for (I had it free as the garage had just got the kit so wanted to test it out) I'm sure there were benefits but I ran mainly on motorways so it probably wasn't bad anyway.

 

[bembo449]

I cant say I feel its worth the cost either matt , if you drive your derv properly it should never get to the point where it needs anything cleaning

 

[Botus]

I cant say I feel its worth the cost either matt , if you drive your derv properly it should never get to the point where it needs anything cleaning

I disagree.

The air intake on a tractor engine allegedly only allows in air, however its not quite like that, fine dust goes straight through the air filter, this mixes with oil mist from the engine breather system and possibly from the turbo which then meets the soot and hot filth from the EGR, as NO ONE ever cleaned it the whole intake system by the swirl flaps is clogged with soot and oil debris that's baked on till there no room for the air to actually get in the engine, plus whatever filth might be stuck on the inlet valves


good as new ?

this video suggests the dirt breaks the drive for the swirl flaps and induces an idling fault (let alone all the other impact of them not working correctly)

 

[bembo449]

thanks botus for the example of what they look like when they are blocked

 

[Botus]

I never thought about it being an issue until recently.

In fact I remember wondering why in USA all the dealers keep taking off inlet manifolds and walnut blasting them clean. Its "normal in usa" on a 335d to have it done a few times under warranty.

Recently I read the right fix is to mix 50 50 water methanol and "spray" the mist into the inlet (minus air filter) with revs at 1500 / 2000 rpm for 5 mins at a time. Keeps it good as new. Keep meaning to try on old mans 280CDI with 115k on the clock.

Safety warning don't get hands or skin near air inlet on any tractor engine - might suck skin off (I'm not joking - tractors suck for many reasons)

 

[Wighty]

I never thought about it being an issue until recently.

In fact I remember wondering why in USA all the dealers keep taking off inlet manifolds and walnut blasting them clean. Its "normal in usa" on a 335d to have it done a few times under warranty.

Recently I read the right fix is to mix 50 50 water methanol and "spray" the mist into the inlet (minus air filter) with revs at 1500 / 2000 rpm for 5 mins at a time. Keeps it good as new. Keep meaning to try on old mans 280CDI with 115k on the clock.

Safety warning don't get hands or skin near air inlet on any tractor engine - might suck skin off (I'm not joking - tractors suck for many reasons)

That does sound interesting , if you do the old mans car can you do a thread with pics . Then I can try it on my E320cdi after you have ironed out the kinks .

 

[MICHAEL31]

Have a look at Archoil AR6400d , it's a lot cheaper than £100 and should leave enough change for a full fuel tank so you can do a decent motorway run in a lower gear (higher revs ) in the form of an Italian tune up . That should get the old girl back to 100% .

thanks, tried the ar6400, and yes it made a good improvement I am sure, would advise anyone to try it. thanks guys

 

[om613]

Water / steam injection frees up stuck rings well.
Inlet manifold carbon crap, deposited by the EGR system over time, cannot be removed simply.
It is a dirty job with no short cuts.Unless one wants to buy a new inlet manifold...

 

[oigle]

Water injection isn't that hard to set up using a boost based switch to activate an electric pump. Very small dollars involved. Have done dozens on petrol turbos to eliminate detonation at higher boost levels. No downsides.

Ian.

 

[Frontstep]

My 320 cdi certainly has had the Italian tune ups but the inlet manifold was still filthy (and the flaps) it got cleaned out last year.
Certainly better.
The EGR valve was stuck as well causing a lot of black smoke.
I could delete it but am conscious that I drive a dirty diesel as it is.
A dribbling injector is the next job.

 

[JBell]

There is another company called "Carbon Clean" they get very good reviews on social media and it is £99

 

[Craiglxviii]

Water injection isn't that hard to set up using a boost based switch to activate an electric pump. Very small dollars involved. Have done dozens on petrol turbos to eliminate detonation at higher boost levels. No downsides.

Ian.

Water injection was used on late WW2 Allied fighter aircraft (and some bombers) to allow for stable increased power at very high boost settings... it does sound a good idea. Water/ methanol mix might increase cylinder head temperatures a bit too much and risk burning the piston rings out though.

 

[Pathfinder]

100k miles is nothing on this engine and unless you have a definate noticeable problem, there is no need to splash £ out on anything. Don't fix something that aint broke.

 

[LostKiwi]

Water injection was used on late WW2 Allied fighter aircraft (and some bombers) to allow for stable increased power at very high boost settings... it does sound a good idea. Water/ methanol mix might increase cylinder head temperatures a bit too much and risk burning the piston rings out though.

I don't think there is any increase in cylinder head temperatures due to the high cooling effect when methanol vapourises.
On direct injection engines (diesel or petrol) the methanol will also clean deposits on the back of valves preventing clogging of the port and reduced performance.
The usual mixture is 1:1 water:methanol for optimal results for road use.

 

[Craiglxviii]

I don't think there is any increase in cylinder head temperatures due to the high cooling effect when methanol vapourises.
On direct injection engines (diesel or petrol) the methanol will also clean deposits on the back of valves preventing clogging of the port and reduced performance.
The usual mixture is 1:1 water:methanol for optimal results for road use.

Odd, on the engines used (DB605 for the Me.109 and 410, BMW801 for the F-w190) it had a running limit of around 10 minutes; after that the engine required a full rebuild due to localised piston/ cylinder overheat- the piston rings used were beefed up but began to crisp after that time- and overstress (25% beyond max WEP)... (which means, effectively it was scrapped).

That was the MW50 system which is 1:1 water- methanol.

Just out of interest, if one subjects this to systems analysis (which the Heereswaffenampt were rather crap at) one sees that the performance with the MW50 kit installed but not running (e.g. not killing the engine) was around 5% lower in almost every case to an aircraft without it installed. Seeing as the requirement behind MW50 was that Allied aeroengine power was rapidly making Axis aircraft non competitive, what they ended up doing was to make their aircraft even less competitive for 90% of their flying time and then, even if they survived combat, were left with a useless engine at best.

 

[LostKiwi]

Odd, on the engines used (DB605 for the Me.109 and 410, BMW801 for the F-w190) it had a running limit of around 10 minutes; after that the engine required a full rebuild due to localised piston/ cylinder overheat- the piston rings used were beefed up but began to crisp after that time- and overstress (25% beyond max WEP)... (which means, effectively it was scrapped).

That was the MW50 system which is 1:1 water- methanol.

Just out of interest, if one subjects this to systems analysis (which the Heereswaffenampt were rather crap at) one sees that the performance with the MW50 kit installed but not running (e.g. not killing the engine) was around 5% lower in almost every case to an aircraft without it installed. Seeing as the requirement behind MW50 was that Allied aeroengine power was rapidly making Axis aircraft non competitive, what they ended up doing was to make their aircraft even less competitive for 90% of their flying time and then, even if they survived combat, were left with a useless engine at best.

Very odd. Current testing suggests that for cars for every 10 degrees you can lower inlet tract temp you get 1% more power. Water has a very high latent heat of vapourisation hence when it changes state from liquid to gas it has a very significant cooling effect. Its possible to get inlet air temperatures below ambient even on vehicles with forced induction using MW injection. Methanol is very high octane so behaves as an octane booster - Methanol may be as high a 120 RON.

This cooling effect is also true for nitrous oxide injection systems. Part of the benefit of NOS is the vast cooling effect of the nitrous oxide as it changes state from liquid to gas. In the case of nitrous this is a secondary effect and the main effect is from the additional oxygen carried by the NOS.

I suspect the effects observed in WW2 aircraft were related to running increased boost, hence cramming more fuel into the cylinder and using MW injection to prevent detonation. It was more likely the increased temps were as a result of increased fuelling rather than the MW injection itself.

Interestingly when Renault ran the Gordini 1500cc V6 in F1 many years ago they were burning pistons at 450bhp. They added WM injection and the power went up to 550bhp.

 

[Craiglxviii]

You may very well be onto something with the boost thing; power increase on the DB605 went from 2000 to 2500hp typically too.

Conversely, Allied aircraft ran (pure) water injection to delay detonation at increased boost. This added 200hp on a 2000hp engine and didn't wreck it.