W124 water in passenger side front footwell

[swrural]

Hello, I think this is my first post. I have discovered water collecting in this footwell and it has caused a rust through to the underside. The garage replaced with a metal patch and sealed underneath, but warned me I needed to find the leak They had sealed up a couple of potential places in the front engine compartment but since then it has rained very heavily and the footwell collected water again.

Any tips as to where I should start looking please? There is also an oblong channel that runs aft in the footwell and through a hole in it, I espied water gathering in there too. I drained that using cloths using capillary effect and then a hair dryer. I have covered the car as it is kept outside and is at the mercy of the elements but of course I have to go out in it in the rain sometimes!

 

[grober]

Usually this is down to blocked drains somewhere. If you have a tilt/slide sunroof there are 4 small drain tubes that can get blocked or leak.
https://forums.mbclub.co.uk/threads/w123-230e-swimming-pool.94298/

 

[DREAMER NO2]

swarural check the sliding roof .If the car is on a slope the drains in the front of sun roof will over flow if they are blocked. Put some paper over the seats just below the front of the opening for the sun roof then look on the paper after a rain storm . But if you dont see a leak on the carpet in the foot well i would plug for bloked drain in the screen area .

 

[DREAMER NO2]

grober is the W124 drain hole locations the same as the W123 ?

 

[grober]

BASICALLY THE SAME LAYOUT-the front ones run down the inside of the screen pillars and emerge inside the rear of the front wing if memory serves correctly they can block or perish and leak- difficult to get at! Test is to locate them with the roof open and pour a little water down them with the aid of a filler funnel/tube and see where/if the water drains? can't find a picture sorry. Other favorite blocking point are the two drain ducts at each end of the bulkhead trim below the front of the windscreen

 

[DREAMER NO2]

Right .Last year we had a bad storm and my carpet in the passengers foorwell was holding a puddle of water .Found out the hard way,, and yes the front drains were blocked with bits of dirt and leaves ..

 

[swrural]

BASICALLY THE SAME LAYOUT-the front ones run down the inside of the screen pillars and emerge inside the rear of the front wing if memory serves correctly they can block or perish and leak- difficult to get at! Test is to locate them with the roof open and pour a little water down them with the aid of a filler funnel/tube and see where/if the water drains? can't find a picture sorry. Other favorite blocking point are the two drain ducts at each end of the bulkhead trim below the front of the windscreen

Thanks to all for replies. First of all, I forgot to say that the carpets and seats were bone dry, so I assume the sun roof is OK (I do have one). However the floods were hidden underneath them! On the W124, the front passenger carpet has foam filler pieces under the carpet to shape to the footwell. These foam pieces were soaking wet. I removed these to let the garage see the problem, having dried everything out. After I got the car back from the job, it rained cats and dogs and I had not covered the car, and as I had not replaced the carpets, the footwell was swimming again.

Following your tip about the bulkhead trim, I have looked at that. The drain pipe on the driver's side was secure but - oh dear - the drain pipe on the passenger side was nowhere near the duct from that side! (about an inch away).

So I have now maneuvered the pipe to enclose the duct protusion totally, I am doubtful it will stay in place by itself so may tape it up to make sure. What a vital part to be hanging loose like that! I am suspicious that a previous owner or garage may have fiddled in that area as some of the plastic trim is missing, that envelopes the metal lip of the engine compartment.
I may take some photos to show what I am describing, meanwhile I will report back whether this is the answer. Thanks. Howard

 

[DREAMER NO2]

Might be from the window seal but go in to that if nothing else works . Check them all out in the manual i think you have more under the wiper motor . Also another way it can,, and will get in thats if you have corrosion under the battery tray . Lots of rain water pruns down inside the bonnet .Even a gromet missing will let it in so realy go to town in the area of the drains and battery tray ... good luck .

 

[d215yq]

Right .Last year we had a bad storm and my carpet in the passengers foorwell was holding a puddle of water .Found out the hard way,, and yes the front drains were blocked with bits of dirt and leaves ..

Is it a W124 design flaw? I park in the street so in different places mostly not under a tree. Every 6 months I think I must check the front drain channels under the screen and they're often mudded solid with sand/dirt - the leaves are easy to get out, but I need a coat hanger to clear the dirt out.

I've heard of other cars having problems if you don't ever clean drains in 8 years or something but never anything that needs it every 6 months. The tubes/drains themselves aren't particularly small either so not sure how/why they block up. I'm glad the 300D manual needs no electrics whatsoever to run so atleast I won't be stranded if I forget to clear them and we have a huge rainstorm here.

 

[swrural]

Yes, at the moment we are enjoying winter monsoon weather here in Dorset (as everywhere else I believe in England) so awaiting a dry period to work on it, as I have no garage. Yes, the battery shelf is heavily rusted so I shall be having that one out and investigating below it, as that may be where any hole or dodgy seam would enable flooding of the footwell. It will probably mean sheering off the nutted clamp that holds the battery in place, as I don't think WD40 will have much effect on that one! Will report back.

 

[DREAMER NO2]

Dont use hard steel to poke the bit out it will dislodge the rubber drain tube .Always use a good penetrating oil for rusty nuts, WD is ok as a water repelant ..but you need a good penetrating oil to do the job.

 

[swrural]

I enclose a photo of the scene of the problem. As can (hopefully) be seen, the rubbery pipe now fits snugly around the downward plastic drain duct. It was at least 3cm completely distant from it when I found the problem! I have no idea what the loose hanging duct alongside it is, by the way.

It was very difficult to achieve, as the duct was firmly against the inner wing and I had to hold it away from that with a tool while my lovely wife shoved the rubber pipe up around it. Still, pure tension should hold it firmly in place from now on. I shall keep an eye on it though.

It will be noted that the rubber seal (top left in photo) no longer stretches along to the end of the rim and it would appear someone snapped it off for some reason. I tested the drain and the water flowed down and out of the wheel arch, so hopefully I have a cure.

Now to deal with the damp inside. The front will be easy,as the carpet lifts out, but I am pretty sure water went through and under the seat to the rear carpet, as it feels a bit damp there and there is a seam under the front seat which exude water from coating that someone had applied to the footwell. The problem is that the rear carpet does not just lift out like the front one does. I am afraid I will ruin the close fit of the rear carpet if i attempt to prise it out. Has anyone ever had the rear carpet out please?

 

[DREAMER NO2]

swrural i hope your right but i dont see how the water can get inside the car with just the drain hose away from the outlet like it was.Water runs inside the bonnet of these cars anyway .I would still take a good look for other ways it can get inside the footwell .Did you remove the battery tray to inspect it .If its like me i look for the easy things first ,,and when i find one i think its it but find its not .And i end up with the biggest problem in the end .Another item in the footwell that can let water in -but not rain water but coolant from your heater system .You will tell if it is coolant it will be blue or yellow .Thats is you have inhibitor in there to stop it freezing up.Let us know what you find .

 

[LostKiwi]

Now to deal with the damp inside. The front will be easy,as the carpet lifts out, but I am pretty sure water went through and under the seat to the rear carpet, as it feels a bit damp there and there is a seam under the front seat which exude water from coating that someone had applied to the footwell. The problem is that the rear carpet does not just lift out like the front one does. I am afraid I will ruin the close fit of the rear carpet if i attempt to prise it out.

If you have a dehumidifier put that in the car and run it for a few days. Nice dry interior with minimal hassle.

 

[DREAMER NO2]

SWR Your worrying me now.

 

[swrural]

If you have a dehumidifier put that in the car and run it for a few days. Nice dry interior with minimal hassle.

Thanks for the tip; I don't have one but will consider acquiring one, as I expect it could be useful in other ways, in the house. I am a bit further with the rear carpet. I removed the rear seat and saw that the carpet was only held down with those little plastic thingys that press in. I knew they would probably break off when I pulled but these are easily obtainable on Ebay. The lip of the sill cover pulled off with a bit of effort. I was then able to raise the carpet up sufficiently (about 20 cm gap) to be able to feel the foam underneath it - and it was soaking wet, as i suspected.

I have drained off the water out of the foam blocks using old cloths and squeezing them down by placing heavy bricks on top of the carpet. I have then elevated and propped open the carpet with the brick and then inserted a hair dryer underneath to play on the space. Hopefully that should dry it out quickly.

I don't know why DREAMER_NO2 is worried about me. Perhaps he would care to "expand and discuss"!

 

[LostKiwi]

Thanks for the tip; I don't have one but will consider acquiring one, as I expect it could be useful in other ways, in the house. I am a bit further with the rear carpet. I removed the rear seat and saw that the carpet was only held down with those little plastic thingys that press in. I knew they would probably break off when I pulled but these are easily obtainable on Ebay. The lip of the sill cover pulled off with a bit of effort. I was then able to raise the carpet up sufficiently (about 20 cm gap) to be able to feel the foam underneath it - and it was soaking wet, as i suspected.

I have drained off the water out of the foam blocks using old cloths and squeezing them down by placing heavy bricks on top of the carpet. I have then elevated and propped open the carpet with the brick and then inserted a hair dryer underneath to play on the space. Hopefully that should dry it out quickly.

I don't know why DREAMER_NO2 is worried about me. Perhaps he would care to "expand and discuss"!

If you do get a dehumidifier get a compressor type - we have can Ebac Powerdri we leave in our 2nd home. Runs for months at a time and greatly reduced dampness over winter months.
They're also useful for drying plaster, paint and clothes.

 

[swrural]

swrural i hope your right but i dont see how the water can get inside the car with just the drain hose away from the outlet like it was.Water runs inside the bonnet of these cars anyway .I would still take a good look for other ways it can get inside the footwell .Did you remove the battery tray to inspect it .If its like me i look for the easy things first ,,and when i find one i think its it but find its not .And i end up with the biggest problem in the end .Another item in the footwell that can let water in -but not rain water but coolant from your heater system .You will tell if it is coolant it will be blue or yellow .Thats is you have inhibitor in there to stop it freezing up.Let us know what you find .

Yes, I have removed the battery and tray and yes it had, understandably, been flooded underneath on the 'shelf'. I did not mention this before. I cleaned and dried it all out on that shelf. Luckily the rust had not taken hold on that area. Now that the drain no longer is free to flood that area, I am fairly sure the chief cause has been dealt with but time (and rain) will tell. Yes I did look at the water in the footwell and it was not other than colourless. I have just had a yearly service so the new coolant would have shown up, I am sure.

I am still concerned how the water got into that channel in the footwell, which, if you remember, I espied because there was a small hole in the top of it. Of course that may be how some water got into it (through the hole) but more likely, I think it is that the channel is seamed to the footwell. There is rust along that seam on two sides for about 10 -20 cms, and I think that may be how it got in there. But I still have not identified where the leak entrance to the footwell is, through which the water came originally.

I will enclose a photo of the footwell, showing where the damage occurred.

 

[swrural]

The labels on the photos are hopefully explanatory. Note we have a right hand drive car here. This is the front passenger footwell. I was able to poke a screwdriver through the right hand damage and the garage has welded a new plate underneath and you can see that in the second photo if you blow it up. I told them that I would deal with the interior of the footwell, so now I am about to start doing that. I have ripped off the coating that someone had applied to the footwell. It came off just like a sheet of plastic and exposes the folly of these coatings, once water and thus rust gets under them. The American Kent Bergsma on Youtube recommends you avoid these products and use something like his 'Miracle Paint' which does not seem to be available here in the UK.

So I will now be busy with cleaning off rust and then I hope to discover a decent UK version of Miracle Paint. Useful tips anyone please? I will report progress. Hope this is useful to some of you. I imagine colleagues racing out to lift up their carpets, hoping not to see these horror shows!

 

[js190d]

I have had good results on surface rust like that using a product called Vactan. It is a water based rust treatment so no need to clean the area up first.
http://performance-chemicals.net/vactan/
As an example of how good it is i had some surface rust above my rear number plate on my s210 and applied vactan and then topcoat brilliant silver touch up and over a year later it has no rust coming through.
You can buy it on ebay, its British made and not expensive at all.
Does your w124 have a sunroof? They have been known to leak and water can dribble from various places if they do. Also for a 29 year old car that is not bad at all for rust.