Timing chain problem

mercuser2

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C220
Hello everyone, first time poster here.

I have a 2004 reg C220 Kompressor. Bought brand new back then. Single owner (me). Has had regular servicing at MB dealerships. No accidents/crashes. During servicing or MOTs required components have been replaced with genuine parts. It has been working well and the ride is smooth. AC etc works perfectly.

When I recently started the car up, I noticed the engine seemed to be 'misfiring' and jerking when idle. I also noticed some thick white smoke coming from the exhaust for a few seconds, which eventually cleared up.

With running it and driving along the road, this shaking seemed to improve to a degree but was still noticeable.

I brought the car back into the driveway and called AA. They checked the computer and said it seemed an air sensor was not functioning per the diagnostic, and that this could be replaced at any mechanics, not necessary Benz. He said it did not seem to be anything serious, and there was no risk of the engine just breaking down on the way to any dealership or mechanic.

I drove the car to the Benz dealership that I have always taken it to over the past several years. I got a call back a few days later saying the car would not start up, and that they thought the problem was related to the timing chain, and that this would need to be replaced. They said it should cost about £2000 to fix, and I initially agreed to this.

However a couple of days later they called back and said that they haven't fully opened up the engine itself, but they think that the timing chain had broken while the car was being moved to the repair area from the on-site parking area, and that they think several injectors, pistons, sprockets etc had all been damaged when the chain snapped.

They estimated 25 hours of work to repair everything (at 200+ pounds per hour), excluding the cost of parts. The lowest estimate they can give me is £9000, but they have said (several of their staff) that it could be more than this.

The day before taking it to the dealers (before this juddering/shaking began) I was able to use the car fine and even drove it a long distance for a meeting and back. On the day I drove it to the dealers too, the car was turning on fine and working. It was obviously not a perfect car, given that it is quite old (and has 150,000+ miles on it), but it was at least running. They told me that they tried replacing the air sensor first, but that didn't work and the engine was still shaking, so they then put back the original air sensor, and had a look briefly without removing all the top part of the engine off and were able to see some damage to or slackening of the timing chain.

I have found out that there have been several reports of faulty timing chains being used on 2004-5 Benz car engines, and wonder if there is any responsibility on the part of MB regarding this. I just cannot believe that the car engine has undergone what sounds like a catastrophic damage while it was at the MB dealership! Have they damaged something while it was in their care?!

I am confused by the chain of events they described. The car was due for a service also so I booked it in for both service and to investigate this shaking engine problem. They completed the service apparently, and then moved it to the repair area for the shaking, and apparently the timing chain broke, and the car engine won't even start, and they've opened up the engine part way, but not fully, and believe that several components are broken.

Are they telling the truth or taking me for a ride??
 

John Laidlaw

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Land Rover Discovery 4
Unfortunately sounds all too familiar, albeit unusual for a diligently maintained engine to have given up so catastrophically. The sprockets are very weak so when the chain flies it would certainly cause a large amount of damage.
Will MB take any responsibility for this amazingly poor design? Doubtful to say the least in the UK sorry to say
I wish you luck....but sounds like you have a financial write off
 

Gazwould

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C250 CDI
Make sure they don't charge you a dime.

Don't think CLK's are much money now so a replacement won't be too hard on the pocket .
 

Gazwould

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Didn't they do the better twin chains
( Duplex ) back then ?
 

star

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Smart + others :)
Common problem, most likely need chain, sprockets, tensioner and some valves. Only seen a piston crack once. Mb will not help and don’t think you can blame the dealer as they wouldn’t have known the state of your engines internals, could have been a coil?? So unless they push every car into the workshop with a problem, then strip it without running it??
 

Donald McPherson

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c180 komp elegance se a 2005
Would be far cheaper sourcing a good second hand from scrappes and have an indi swap it. Otherwise its a new car for you.
 

star

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Would be far cheaper sourcing a good second hand from scrappes and have an indi swap it. Otherwise its a new car for you.
No it’s not, the engines not that far gone and you would still have to change chain and sprockets on secondhand engine to be safe.
 

sonic

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E350CDI, SLC250d, FJR 1300
Hello everyone, first time poster here.

I have a 2004 reg C220 Kompressor. Bought brand new back then. Single owner (me). Has had regular servicing at MB dealerships. No accidents/crashes. During servicing or MOTs required components have been replaced with genuine parts. It has been working well and the ride is smooth. AC etc works perfectly.

When I recently started the car up, I noticed the engine seemed to be 'misfiring' and jerking when idle. I also noticed some thick white smoke coming from the exhaust for a few seconds, which eventually cleared up.

With running it and driving along the road, this shaking seemed to improve to a degree but was still noticeable.

I brought the car back into the driveway and called AA. They checked the computer and said it seemed an air sensor was not functioning per the diagnostic, and that this could be replaced at any mechanics, not necessary Benz. He said it did not seem to be anything serious, and there was no risk of the engine just breaking down on the way to any dealership or mechanic.

I drove the car to the Benz dealership that I have always taken it to over the past several years. I got a call back a few days later saying the car would not start up, and that they thought the problem was related to the timing chain, and that this would need to be replaced. They said it should cost about £2000 to fix, and I initially agreed to this.

However a couple of days later they called back and said that they haven't fully opened up the engine itself, but they think that the timing chain had broken while the car was being moved to the repair area from the on-site parking area, and that they think several injectors, pistons, sprockets etc had all been damaged when the chain snapped.

They estimated 25 hours of work to repair everything (at 200+ pounds per hour), excluding the cost of parts. The lowest estimate they can give me is £9000, but they have said (several of their staff) that it could be more than this.

The day before taking it to the dealers (before this juddering/shaking began) I was able to use the car fine and even drove it a long distance for a meeting and back. On the day I drove it to the dealers too, the car was turning on fine and working. It was obviously not a perfect car, given that it is quite old (and has 150,000+ miles on it), but it was at least running. They told me that they tried replacing the air sensor first, but that didn't work and the engine was still shaking, so they then put back the original air sensor, and had a look briefly without removing all the top part of the engine off and were able to see some damage to or slackening of the timing chain.

I have found out that there have been several reports of faulty timing chains being used on 2004-5 Benz car engines, and wonder if there is any responsibility on the part of MB regarding this. I just cannot believe that the car engine has undergone what sounds like a catastrophic damage while it was at the MB dealership! Have they damaged something while it was in their care?!

I am confused by the chain of events they described. The car was due for a service also so I booked it in for both service and to investigate this shaking engine problem. They completed the service apparently, and then moved it to the repair area for the shaking, and apparently the timing chain broke, and the car engine won't even start, and they've opened up the engine part way, but not fully, and believe that several components are broken.

Are they telling the truth or taking me for a ride??
How many miles has it done?
 

Jim2

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1st Merc 2010 E Class W212 2.1 CDI. 2nd Merc 2014 E Class W212 220 CDI
Was the 100'000 Miles mark on those engines that was the "normal" mileage to replace chains, tensioners etc?
 

LostKiwi

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'93 500SL-32, '01 W210 Estate E240 (RIP), 02 R230 SL500, 04 Smart Roadster Coupe, 11 R350CDi
Didn't they do the better twin chains
( Duplex ) back then ?
No.
The only W203 to use duplex chain was the base C180 and then only for a couple of years. All Kompressors use the M271.

Was the 100'000 Miles mark on those engines that was the "normal" mileage to replace chains, tensioners etc?
There is no normal mileage.
Some have failed at 80k and some like the OP have lasted much longer.

The only thing I would query is whether MB were negligent is running the engine on a car with suspected timing chain failure after it was brought in given timing chains are a known issue on the M271.

I'd also query why they did a service without diagnosing the fault first given the repair of any problem may require oil changing again.
 

Jim2

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1st Merc 2010 E Class W212 2.1 CDI. 2nd Merc 2014 E Class W212 220 CDI
No.
The only W203 to use duplex chain was the base C180 and then only for a couple of years. All Kompressors use the M271.


There is no normal mileage.
Some have failed at 80k and some like the OP have lasted much longer.

The only thing I would query is whether MB were negligent is running the engine on a car with suspected timing chain failure after it was brought in given timing chains are a known issue on the M271.

I'd also query why they did a service without diagnosing the fault first given the repair of any problem may require oil changing again.

Yes, that would be logical thinking, under the circumstances. But when timing chains go, they go in a split second, and generally, the result's can be very bad. Prior to this, would the chain not make a noise at startup? or give any other audio warning before failure?
 

LostKiwi

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'93 500SL-32, '01 W210 Estate E240 (RIP), 02 R230 SL500, 04 Smart Roadster Coupe, 11 R350CDi
Yes, that would be logical thinking, under the circumstances. But when timing chains go, they go in a split second, and generally, the result's can be very bad. Prior to this, would the chain not make a noise at startup? or give any other audio warning before failure?
Only if the chain has stretched and then only on first start of the day.
If the sprockets wear but the chain doesn't stretch too far there will be little warning.
It's unusual for a chain to break without something else causing it.

A well designed chain and sprocket set will outlive the rest of the engine.
Sadly these days they seem 'engineered' to do about 100k.
 

HERBIEMERCMAN

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97. E300.TD. 7 SEAT.ELEGANCE. EST.TOYOTA SUPRA MK4. RS. VAUX. CORSA.GLS AUTO. SPORT.
Hi LostKiwi, Long time no see, I have three cars and the MK4 Supra has been taking up most of my time, had an engine, ECU, clutch and gearbox,etc, rebuild, now running 450BHP at the back wheels. The Merc has been a work horse and at 270K from new is still running very well, my current concern is for how much life will be left in my timing chain? but the problem for me is listening to the engine which gives me a rottling noise coming distinctly from the front of the engine and this has not changed for the past years and circa 10,000 miles, even at cold starts i cannot distinguish any change in the noise. It would be ideal if i could listen to another engine with my set up and a much lower mileage.
I am going to order a full chain replacement kit and if you or any other member could recommend the best maker, may be an "aftermarket" kit would be OK considering that i may only get a few more years with the car. I will go on youtube and see if there are any Merc examples.
 


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