A Service @ £900 !!

Seeker_UK

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Actually, looking at it, there's a lot of double charges:

Service Replace fuel filters @ 47.28
Fuel filter @ 17.80

Service Replace brake fluid @ 78.80
Brake fluid @ 32.34

Not sure what's going on. Are they suggesting that brake fluid costs £32 and approx 45-50 minutes of labour to replace?
 

jberks

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Well, looking through that list, breaking it down & adding VAT
I get £422 for a B service - ok - you should have got a discount but that is list price so no real argument there.
£103 for "Aircon work" - almost certainly an unnecessary extra. I was offered this by my dealer once. I asked if it was really necessary and he replied 'was there a smell?' - no - then you don't need it. It was also quoted at around half what you paid.
A brake fluid change - £127.81 - maybe I'm out here and perhaps others can correct me but I'm sure I paid a main dealer less than £60 to do this a couple of years ago. Interestingly this was done at the same time as a coolant change. I see no mention of that so maybe they missed a trick. From memory the 2 cost me around £100.
Gearbox oil change - very necessary and at £200 about right.
Rear pad change £68 - not too far out really.


So my comment would be -
1) ask for a discount - that £422 should have been closer to £350 with very little haggling.
2) Aircon service - one of the biggest cons going at the moment - if it works ok and doesn't smell - utterly unnecessary.
3) It seems to me that they ripped you off on the brake fluid change - uncertain here though - wait for others to comment.
4) They replaced your rear pads. Possibly they needed doing but all too often they change them way too early, supposedly because they may not make it to the next service but with intervals of around 10,000, thats nearly 50% of their life. All 4 of mine needed doing officially at the last service, plus disks - I refused and they're still fine, I checked them myself a couple of weeks ago and I reckon I've got the best part of a year in them yet so I'll wait for the warning light.
Strangely - other charges not too far out of the way.
 

truthfindergeneral

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This bit about ' changing brake pads because they won't make it to the next service ".
Anything to stop you taking a car in between services for such items ?
 

Alex M Grieve

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This bit about ' changing brake pads because they won't make it to the next service ".
Anything to stop you taking a car in between services for such items ?

Absolutely TFG. I have had that advice more than once, and as I rarely brake, the pads have never failed to make it to the next service, and sometimes even the one beyond.
 

television

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We had a post recently where it was advised that the disc and pads were due for replacement, I have the original figures from ne, and those on the car and the pads and disc were no more than one 1/3 rd worn, and the OP was worried that they need to be changed so soon. The truth was that on the mileage done, at that same rate of wear then he another two years before they needed doing.

I find it a rotten practice, its not just the hard times bit, its like bullying by saying "we know best"
 

Hertfordshire Merx

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I will say is that its expected of a dealer to charge this. I've seen hundreds of bills go out over recent times with similar charges. Its a part of the reason I want to be independent as a lot of the bills were quite frankly, an embarassment.

The trouble is I know how long jobs take within a bit and I also know what parts cost. I have been privvy to that information for the last 20 years.

To stick up for dealers they are entitled to charge those job times, as they are laid out by MB, afterall thats why they are in business. The rebound is their overheads. All those staff on horrendous wages for their positions, particularly mid and higher management earning £50k-£100k p.a (who incidentally are predominantly from sales backgrounds and havent a clue how to replace a bulb let alone anything indepth) need paying off the back of Technicians who are productive as Managers are not productive themselves, although they all like to think they are! Then there are running and building costs. They run into the millions of pounds per annum. For instance, MB Milton Keynes, the dealer, their overheads are £1m per year. MB Stevenage cost in excess of £7m to buy the land and build the property stood on it. They need to get a return without question to keep the business' viable. This is why they are charging £100+ per hour (£85 for Smart) and £150 per hour within the M25.

So, theres me shortly going to be in my little unit, able to perform a better job as I am not battling against the clock and being moaned at for my efficiencies and productivity levels to keep my Service Manager in his realms of bonuses and make them back their £M's for a pittance...

Gone for me are the days when a team manager gives you a 1.3hr job and starts moaning at you that your taking too long when all you want to do is give the customer a good service like their entitled to. Afterall for those of us who love Mercedes-Benz take pride in our work, we want to give the best you can when you know the customer is paying a fortune to keep the above, let alone pay for my training, care and my expertise.

Sorry, I'm going off at a tangent here - excuse me!!

Back on track.

An Air con service is debatable. In my opinion they are only needed if there is something on the system not working properly, or the 'sweaty sock' odour that occurs when bacteria developes on the evaporator due to condensation. If the A/C service was really thorough, I would have expected to see a receiver dryer in there as well as a regas as the receiver dryer contains a dessicant to absorb moisture and make the system more efficient.

The guy presenting the bill has tried to be thorough as a dealer is meant to show, but has somewhat shot himself in the foot. A lot of things could have been put in under sundries rather than waste his printer ink. I think it would have been more acceptable. There are no environmental disposable charges on there either which most garages put on, and quite rightly too. Again this could be listed as a sundry item.

I dont think the customer has been charged double for things, unless I am looking at his presentation wrong. I think the top bullet points are for labour charges and the second is for materials and parts.

It is expensive again in my opinion, and for the state of things in the trade at the moment with regards to dealers of all marques, where Service Managers are beginning to pressurise their Technicians to work harder under an iron fist environment, they are limited to perform a good service anymore without having the whip cracked across their behinds in order to keep the management and shareholders of the dealers happy.

My God, I'll shut up now! Apologies if you're asleep!!
 

Parrot of Doom

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You've been ripped off. I wouldn't let that invoice stand, and that dealer would never see my face again.
 

truthfindergeneral

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No body asks dealers to build s****y premises on the most expensive sites they can find. Merc do that because they think it will impress customers and make them look better than they are.
The time is long gone when the punter was coerced by such things. The punter now understands it is they who are propping up these flash palaces by paying over the odds for labour and parts.
 

Hertfordshire Merx

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No body asks dealers to build s****y premises on the most expensive sites they can find. Merc do that because they think it will impress customers and make them look better than they are.
The time is long gone when the punter was coerced by such things. The punter now understands it is they who are propping up these flash palaces by paying over the odds for labour and parts.

Yes, I 100% agree with you!
 

discoking

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Actually, looking at it, there's a lot of double charges:

Service Replace fuel filters @ 47.28
Fuel filter @ 17.80

Service Replace brake fluid @ 78.80
Brake fluid @ 32.34

Not sure what's going on. Are they suggesting that brake fluid costs £32 and approx 45-50 minutes of labour to replace?

The 1st line is the charge for time taken to do the job.The 2nd line is the cost of the part.
 

Seeker_UK

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In that case, I make that nearly 30 minutes to replace fuel filters.

Seems a bit slack....
 

television

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You cannot look at job breakdown times for doing jobs,and try and comparing them to your own times. just take a 203 bottom swivel,,I have seen one changed in 2½ mins, its down to how many times you have done these things, I could look at the times for stripping out the 230 boot linings and covers, I can get them all out and back in 20 mins max,,the first time it took 2 hours. Just knowing how far and adjoining component needs to moved and know how things clip together makes a huge difference. You could play around with a 208 track rod ass; for hours before you turn the wheels to the correct angle to get it in
 

hawk20

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Sorry, but to me the bill looks pretty reasonable as Jberks eloquently argues.
Just as I predicted when we get the full facts this was not just for a service.
But for numerous other jobs too including brakes and changing the ATF.

ATF is done after 40/50k miles? Cost per mile is trivial. Brakes -well pads are 30k miles and discs 50k for many and again the cost per mile is small.

We need a sense odf perspective. Servicing costs only a few pence per mile; fuel is 15 pence or more, but depreciation on most modern cars is several thousands of pounds per year. But go to any forum and most spend their lives worrying about servicing costs.

I grew up with cars being serviced every 3,000 miles and then 6,000 miles. Now we go 15k miles or more between servicing. The A service on my car at my excellent local MB dealer is around £200 and the B service is about £320. So over 30k miles servicing will cost under 2p per mile. Trivial.

Brakes and ATF changes and so on are not part of the basic services. And if you work out what they cost per mile they are still pretty trivial.

But servicing comes in lumps so we notice it more than we should.
 
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Rory

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Sorry, but to me the bill looks pretty reasonable as Jberks eloquently argues.
Well, he argued that it looked reasonable *at list prices* for a B service. In fact the basic service performed was an A.
The A service on my car at my excellent local MB dealer is around £200 and the B service is about £320. So over 30k miles servicing will cost under 2p per mile. Trivial.

It would certainly also need a brake fluid change too - it's in the service schedule (every 2 years) so that surely counts as servicing? We know that if you don't have it done many dealers won't stamp the book as the car hasn't been fully serviced. Would you really say "good value" to the dealer when he tells you the bf change is £120+ (instead of the £60 or so that would be reasonable)?

Love that you dismiss the charges as "trivial". Look after the pennies etc....
 

The Crooner

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I don't think he did dismiss the charges as trivial, and that is his whole point - servicing comes in chunks, depreciation comes in one massive hit, and fuel costs us every day/week. His argument is that the cost per mile of servicing is trivial compared to the life costs of running a car.

It helps to read and understand what the OP is actually saying.

Of course you can always do what I do, buy a cheap car, maintain it yourself/with some help, and put lots of miles on it.

My major cost is fuel, the rest is just about zero.

Also IMHO regular servicing is about looking after the pennies.

Tony
 

Alex M Grieve

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Speak as you find.

At one point in a post long ago, someone sensible said that we "speak as we find" - the best evidence is that which we see with our own eyes.

Everything is relative, and everyone's perception depends on their circumstances, and their means.

Let me give you some evidence. I bought a 2 year old W202 estate (200K) from a local dealer in September 2002. The service history is as follows:
May 2004 - A Service + change brake fluids and coolant - £374
Sept 2005 - 4 tyres - £318
May 2006 - B service - £234
June 2007 - sold.

Other than that, the car cost VED, MOTs and Insurance (£216 per year).

Fuel consumption 31.1 mpg, net cost per mile overall 0.67p

No need to change battery or exhaust.

When you are accustomed to running a car for the cost of VED, MOT and insurance each year (the fixed costs), and servicing 2 yearly at sensible prices, then a bill of the sort at the start of this thread would raise not one but both eyebrows, even on the most ardent MB supporter.

It should now become apparent that the change in the rules for ASSYST has had a dramatic and unwelcome impact on this picture when applied to the W 203 replacement I bought, but that is another story.

These are the facts. Any further comment on them is opinion.
 

television

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It should now become apparent that the change in the rules for ASSYST has had a dramatic and unwelcome impact on this picture when applied to the W 203 replacement I bought, but that is another story.

These are the facts. Any further comment on them is opinion.

This had a dramatic effect on most of us, when they changed the rules and took us back to 1990 service intervals, and as shown on all forums, they have been caught out, so why defend them, it comes under "rouge traders " in a way
 

television

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At one point in a post long ago, someone sensible said that we "speak as we find" - the best evidence is that which we see with our own eyes.

Everything is relative, and everyone's perception depends on their circumstances, and their means.

.


This applies to everything that we own, there are those that would never get their hands dirty, and just pay the bills, and those that like to know what is going on and why, and if they can fix a problem , then they will do so themselves.

I for one have never in my life called in anyone to do anything. I have never used a builder,roofer,Corgi man, or plumber. If my roof blew off, I would go up there and put it back on. And the same goes for motor cars. As Alex said "look after the pennies". We could break down down everything that we own into pence per hour, year or miles, but cumulatively all of those pence become £££ Had I just paid up for every that required attention in my life I would not have had the money to buy my SL in the first place. Why on earth should I give someone £1000 to change the brakes on my car, when I can sit outside in the sun for a few hours, do it all my self for under £250. I could push that £750 saving around all I like, break it down into pennies per mile, or what ever, but at the end of the day I would still be £750 worse off, and that £750 would have to come from somewhere, it is also relative to ones income and how much cash one has to spend on the motor car, many members have a ceiling of £1k for buying the car in the first place.

I looked back last night to the papers that I am sending out to members, so that they can fix their own cars. Last year almost all papers were for 123,124,126,201 and 202 cars cars. In the 3 months that has passed this year I have sent out over 800 papers, and most of these were for the 203,211,220,221 and 230, so thats 800 people that have had a go themselves and 99% have managed the job and posted back to say that how pleased they are.

Too many pence per mile, then it may no longer a viable proposition, everything has a value, everything can reach a point where one says, do we repair or replace.

What I do know is that when Olly is servicing a car he changes the brake fluid for £35, need I say more
 

Dosco

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Well said that man. :p:p
 

Gonzo

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Making up from somewhere !

My E280 CDI is about 2.5 years old with 47K on the clock. My fist service cost about £200, which was about right for a minor service. The second service was about £400, but as this was a major service (B), again, I think it was reasonable. The third service (minor A), I expected to be similar in cost to the first, but to my surprise, they presented me with a list of additional work (filters etc) the length of my arm and a bill to match:eek:.

Why are not all parts / consumables that need changing when they reach a mileage included in the service cost? As most buyers look at the service intervals to calculate approximate running cost, and most stats are based on 3 years / 36 K miles, I think Mercedes have deliberately left out the parts form the service and set the flags for changing the components until after 36K miles.

Shame on them if this is the case. I am happy to pay for quality, but being played for fool is a different matter. Maybe I am too cynical, what do you think?

By the way, the care is fantastic and the service is always fist class :D. I just do not like surprises or feeling I have been mislead:(.

With lots of different dealers, not just Merc, selling at near cost, many now are trying to get the money in any way they can !

I own trucks, and have seen the price of spares + any mechanical work shoot up. Having said that you paid too much !
 


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