A160 New Engine - Problem

[aliddle]

Over the last month I have replaced my buggered (can't spell beleagered) engine on my 1999 A160, replacing it with a 2nd hand post 2001 engine. See previous posts "dirty engine / oil" & "crankcase breather" and last night I took the car for a drive. The engine seems to be operating fine, however there is a problem in logic: When I get the engine revving up to 4th all is well and sweet, however on lifting the foot off the accelerator it appears to change something and the car goes into a mode where not all cylinders are firing. As soon as I turn off the ignition and then start up once more all is well again until the same rev changes occur. After some initial thought I have come up with some possible reasons and would like your comments:

Possibility 1: There is a problem (say) in the ATF fluid level that is somehow being detected at certain revs and the ECU is tripping into "Limp Home Mode" I have never experienced this mode so do not know what it involves! (I lost some ATF in doing the engine swopped and until I get it to the MB agent to check the level I have just estimated a replacement volume).

Possibility 2: The Fuel Injection rail and injectors are from the 2nd hand engine, which I think is a post 2001 model whereas my car (and ECU) is a 1999 model; I understand that at certain stages in operation (revs) the fuel injectors open and close in different cylinder sequences - perhaps I should put my (19991) inlet manifold & injectors on this engine...?

Possibilty 3: It may be something to do with the different head on this 2nd hand engine that has the air pump shutoff valve on the gearbox end of the head. I have merely disconnected the vacuum hose and left the shutoff valve in place on the head. This is an ex Japan engine and they have different emissions laws so Aussie motors don't seem to need this fitting.

 

[Aussie Nick]

Crikey Mate! I know we have the Parrot of Doom on this forum but you should be renamed the Aussie Of Doom.

 

[Aussie Nick]

Hey it looks like me mate from the old country is on line . Hey Dec stop chatting with them little peoples and provide some input on member Allidle's problem.

 

[mattkh]

Over the last month I have replaced my buggered (can't spell beleagered) engine on my 1999 A160, replacing it with a 2nd hand post 2001 engine.

Hi
Is the jap engine a 160.
Which ecu is in the running engine, the old one or the jap one?
Sounds like the ecu needs to learn some settings.

 

[Aussie Nick]

I think member Aliddle should be congratulated on the refitting of the new engine. This was a gutsy move. A lot of other people would have thrown in the towel and written out the cheque long ago. I am sure the current teething problems will be sorted out shortly.


Again I repeat I am glad to see members taking control of the situation into their own hands and not succumbing to the temptation of allowing themselves into being frightened into submission both to Benz and the Dealer cronies.
I have to say that Benz has behaved shamelessly in this matter. There is no point producing fine cars and forgetting about the people that drive them.
One of my posts was recently censored when I claimed that not all American machinery was crap, as it was put by someone quoted by another member.


I dont know too many American car manufacturers who have produced even one motor car without a dipstick for the motor. But guess what one European manufacturer has . I wonder who that could be????????????

 

[aliddle]

Ok,

The Jap engine is in the Aussie car with the Aussie ECU. The Jap engine has its Jap inlet manifold with Jap injectors, but the Aussie wiring loom and Aussie ignition module. Sounds a bit like an Irish joke!

I drove the car around a fair bit tonight and if I drive reaonable gently - not going above say 2500rpm all is well - the engine is sweet.

I am taking it in to the MB garage tomorrow to connect the ECU to the computer and just wanted to run things / possibilities by you before I did.

 

[aliddle]

Just to re-itterate, working on the A160 (in hindsight) is not a mammoth task. Once I had put the pick handle across the garage rafters and strung the car up high enough I could lower the engine, gearbox, suspension etc down on a homemade stand fitted to a trolley jack the bulk of the work was done - it is just 8 bolts and the whole lot pops down. I have the day off tomorrow and will pull some photos together.

Putting it back together was really simple (no exageration), there is no carb, no timing strobe, no nothing - just bolt together. The real challenge will be to make sense of this ECU tomorrow and try to figure out whether the MB garage really know what they are talking about or whether it is bull! That is where you chaps come in!

 

[aliddle]

What does "emergency mode" feel like?

 

[aliddle]

Ok,

At MB today we hooked the ECU up and it appears that cylinders 1 & 2 fail (too lean) at about 2150rpm, which seems to the trigger a shut down somehow. I think I will swop the fuel injectors around (put my original ones onto the 2nd hand engine to run with my ECU). It appears that the problem eases a bit as the engine warms up.

What I thought was "limp Mode" was not - it seems that it is just 1 & 2 cylinders shutting down. Turning the ignition off then on seems to reset it.

I have borrowed the ATF dipstick and will make one of my own.

 

[Ellsy Tanners]

Have you tried swapping the coil pack and plugs from the old engine?

 

[aliddle]

Hi Ellsy,

I have solved the problem. The new homemade breather hose appears to be letting too much gas through into the inlet manifold causing the closest 2 cylinders to run too lean and the ECU cuts them out somehow. By switching the engine off then on it resets again. I have now restricted gas flow into the inlet manifold by constricting the pipe with a couple of cable ties and the engine is running fine. As a permanent fix I may need to put an in-line PCV valve from another engine in.

I will connect it up to the computer again next week at MB and tighten the cable ties until the cylinders are not failing at all.....

Regards....

 

[BlackC55]

New info.

- Crankcase ventilation not functioning correctly -
Topic number LI01.20-P-011588
Version 1
Group number 01.20 Crankcase ventilation, cylinder head cover
Date 06-24-2004
Validity Model series 168 with engine 166
Reason for change

Complaint
The following symptoms can point to a high condensate formation at engine full load breathing:
- Oil escape from valve cover.
- Oil escape from throttle valve actuator.
- Oil escape from oil dipstick.
- A white foam has formed in the oil filler neck.
- Oil level indicator and warning note "Oil level too low" appears in the instrument cluster.
- White smoke emitted from vehicle exhaust.

The following note applies in the case of complaint and reconditioned engines:
Frequent short-distance operation, particularly at temperatures below the freezing point, favors condensate formation; In this case install supply pipe.

Cause
Condensate formation can impair engine full load breathing.

Remedy
Check the engine full load breathing system, clean the engine full load breathing system.
Before installing the supply pipe, check/correct the engine oil level and if required carry out a pressure loss test; Mechanical wear on engine, as a consequence of oil starvation, not excluded, if necessary order exchange engine.

Install supply pipe.
A) Vehicles with heated windshield washer reservoir (code 875)
1. Up to VIN 443350 fit new heater heat exchanger (see AR83.25-P-1100GC).
2. Up to VIN 450543 install heated throttle valve (see AR03.22-P-1152GF)
(heated throttle valve heater - two tube connectors on the throttle valve, see picture 1).
As of VIN 450544 clean heated throttle valve with compressed air before connecting the supply pipe.
3. Modify the replacement part supply pipe as part 2 is already installed (see picture 2).
4. Pinch off existing hoses in the vehicle using special tool g 000 589 54 37 00 (see picture 3) and open the hose clamp on the supply pipe installed on the vehicle side at a suitable point and disconnect hose (see picture 4).
5. Remove existing hose part 1 from the vehicle and replace by a new hose part 1. Attach hoses to the throttle valve heater and the windshield detergent reservoir with screw-type clamps (part no. A005 997 01 90); Attach the hose to the connecting piece again using the clamp released previously (see picture 5 - hose clamps).
6. Assemble the "mussel" (top bracket and bottom bracket) together with the engine full load breathing hoses and throttle valve heating hose (bottom throttle valve connection). Insert hoses in bottom bracket and mount top bracket and press together. Insert the second hose (top throttle valve connection) in the clip of the top bracket. (see picture 6).
Note:
Route the supply pipe free of chafing and check for unobstructed movement relative to other components.
7. Check coolant level and correct if necessary


B) Vehicles without heated windshield washer reservoir (without code 875).
1. Up to VIN 443350 install new heater heat exchanger (see AR83.25-P-1100GC).
2. Up to VIN 450543 install heated throttle valve (see AR03.22-P-1152GF)
(heated throttle valve heater - two tube connectors on the throttle valve, see picture 1).
As of VIN 450544 clean heated throttle valve with compressed air before connecting the supply pipe.
3. Remove intake module (see AR09.20-P-1400GF).
4. Drain coolant (see AR20.00-P-1142GF).
5. Remove supply pipe installed and replace by a new supply pipe.
6. Assemble the "mussel" (top bracket and bottom bracket) together with the engine full load breathing hoses and throttle valve heating hose (bottom throttle valve connection). Insert hoses in bottom bracket and mount top bracket and press together. Insert the second hose (top throttle valve connection) in the clip of the top bracket. (see picture 6).
7. Assemble in the reverse order.
8. Check coolant level and correct if necessary.

Operation no. of operation texts or standard texts and flat rates:
Op. no.: G 07 1580 0
Op. text: Retrofitting supply pipe for heating engine full load breathing system.
Time: 25 WU
Op. no.: G 07 1581 0
Op. text: Retrofitting supply pipe for heating engine full load breathing system, vehicle with throttle valve heater.
Time: 24 WU
Op. no..: G 07 1582 0
Op. text: Retrofitting supply pipe for heating engine full load breathing system, vehicle with code 875.
Time: 17 WU
Op. no.: G 07 1583 0 Op. text: Retrofitting supply pipe for retrofitting engine full load breathing system, vehicle with throttle valve heater and code 875.
Time: 17 WU

Attachments
Allocation File Designation
Remedy Bild 3 - Klemme.JPG.jpg Use special tool to pinch off existing hoses(2 pieces).
Remedy Bild 4 - Schlauchpaket öffnen.jpg Open the supply pipe in the vehicle at the point shown.
Remedy Bild 5 - Schlauchschellen.jpg Fasten throttle valve heater with clamps.
Remedy Bild 6 - Muschel.jpg Insert hoses in "bottom bracket" and mount "top bracket" and press together.
Parts Bild 1 - Drosselklappe_Heizung.JPG.jpg Throttle valve heater (two visible tube connectors) must be present.
Parts Bild 2 - Schlauchpaket abändern.jpg Modify hose pack and use part 1 for the modification.

Symptoms
Symptom
Power generation / Engine lubrication/oil cooling / Engine lubrication/oil cooling function / Oil level too low
Power generation / Engine lubrication/oil cooling / Engine lubrication/oil cooling function / high oil consumption
Power generation / Engine lubrication/oil cooling / Engine lubrication/oil cooling indicator lamp / Engine oil level indicator lamp / lights up
Power generation / Engine lubrication/oil cooling / Engine lubrication/oil cooling leaks / has external oil loss
Power generation / exhaust system / Exhaust System Function / blue smoke

Parts
Part number Designation Quantity Note EPC Non-EPC
1685060640 Upper bracket 1 X
1685060740 Lower bracket 1 X
1688300661 Heating system heat exchanger 1 only fit up to VIN J 443350. X
1688303096 Feed 1 with code 875 (with heated windshield washer system). X
1688303196 Return flow 1 with code 875 (with heated windshield washer system). X
1688304996 Feed 1 without code 875 (without windshield washer system). X
1688305096 Return flow 1 without code 875 (without windshield washer system). X
A0059970190 Hose clamp 4 X

Operation numbers/damage codes
Op. no. Time Damage code Note
Operation text
09123B2


Validities
Vehicle Engine Transmission Major assembly (1) Major assembly (2) Major assembly (3)
168.031 166.960 * * * *
168.032 166.990 * * * *
168.033 166.960 * * * *
168.035 166.995 * * * *
168.131 166.960 * * * *
168.132 166.990 * * * *
168.133 166.960 * * * *
168.135 166.995 * * * *

 

[aliddle]

Mayonaise in my oil filler cap is not that big a problem; the car journeys are long enough to dry out the water droplets on the cap - and our temperatures in Sydney are significantly higher than 0 degrees C.

Cold weather certainly brings a whole load of different problems!

I love the last comment below though.....!

Remedy
Check the engine full load breathing system, clean the engine full load breathing system.
Before installing the supply pipe, check/correct the engine oil level and if required carry out a pressure loss test; Mechanical wear on engine, as a consequence of oil starvation, not excluded, if necessary order exchange engine.

Mind you though.... that is exactly what I ended up doing; buying a complete 2nd hand engine ex-Japan (<50,000km) for AU$1,900 - now I have a reference to look at whenever I have a problem!