Birmingham Clean Air Zone - forcing to look at new car(s)

[LostKiwi]

If looking at LPG conversion look at liquid injection systems. Better power and economy compared to older gas vapour injection.

 

[Vx-Man-G]

Morning all,

Just resurecting an old thread of mine.
Birmingham CAZ coming into force soon my dad is going to have to replace his car once lockdown is out the way, and choices vs budget are limited.

Once we have shortlisted something, naturally I will venture onto their relevant user forums, but I prefer the independant advice everyone has to offer here.

So he currently drives a 2010 Mercedes C220D Auto. Loves it, great drive only really complains that its not overly economical and Road Tax price isnt all that pleasant. Oh and that fact that it is really low down to get in and out of.

Anyway, so with Birmingham CAZ coming in his next car needs to be either Euro 6+ Diesel (65-reg+) or Euro 4+ Petrol (I think 2009+).

He doesnt do enough miles to warrant a new Diesel with DPF issues becoming a common place, but wants economy. He does around 15 miles round trip a day for work, and just general short commutes on the weekend.

These are what we have shortlisted as potential options:
- BMW 2-Series Active Tourer (unfortunately majority of them are in Diesel form, very few in Petrol Auto and also heard that German aint very economical in petrol form). Can achieve a decent 65-reg for around £10k.
- Mercedes B-Class (again similar issue to above). Can achieve a decent 65-reg for around £10k.
- Nissan Qashqai 1.2 Petrol. Can achieve up to 66-reg for around £10k.
- Audi A4 TDI (again issue we have is Diesel and low miles), Can achieve a decent 65-reg for around £11k.
- Mec C Class (again Diesel issue). Can achieve a decent 65-reg for around £12k.

He would love a Diesel in any one of the above, but from a realsim perspective, I dont think this is the way to go for him anymore.

There isnt really much else out there. He wants something a little easier to get in and out of, economical, Auto, low tax and with the usual mod cons. Budget is really as much less than £10k as possible.

So, after some thoughts, comments and advice please.

Many thanks,
G.

 

[LostKiwi]

My first comment will be don't get too hung up on economy.
If you a petrol car is cheaper to buy that will account for a lot of fuel to recover the mpg difference.

Historically BMW 3 series petrols have historically been very fuel efficient.
MrsLK has a Mini Cooper S and that does 40 mpg with ease which is pretty remarkable for a 2 litre turbo petrol.

Likewise Hondas and the Ford Focus range.

 

[MBDevotee]

Petrol is definitely the way to go, no question.

I don’t have any view a on the actual car, although c-class estate based on your other choices, lot nicer than B class.

I saw also you mentioned in the post about LPG. Completely agree with everything said about liquid / vapour system, although the multipoint vapour systems were good (single point, utter cr*p).

I’ve converted a few cars to LPG, and the most important thing is make sure you get a really good installer. The only bad conversion I ever had was on a car my (now favoured) installer refused to do - he said he wouldn’t be able to make it run brilliantly on gas, and he was right.! Ironically I had that one converted up in Birmingham.....

Merc’s have historically converted well, never converted a very based car (Audi etc) a Vectra I once had converted brilliantly but the Omega was absolutely rubbish.

Plenty of filling points around you - but your Dad may not do the miles to justify.

 

[Vx-Man-G]

My first comment will be don't get too hung up on economy.
If you a petrol car is cheaper to buy that will account for a lot of fuel to recover the mpg difference.

Historically BMW 3 series petrols have historically been very fuel efficient.
MrsLK has a Mini Cooper S and that does 40 mpg with ease which is pretty remarkable for a 2 litre turbo petrol.

Likewise Hondas and the Ford Focus range.

Have looked at some Ford's <£10k, and the only really one that looks good as well as being family sized is the B-Max, but the claimed MPG on them is horrendous, officially around 32mpg, but I have friends who had had the B-Max and they say they are lucky to achieve 25mpg.

 

[MBDevotee]

My first comment will be don't get too hung up on economy.
If you a petrol car is cheaper to buy that will account for a lot of fuel to recover the mpg difference.

Historically BMW 3 series petrols have historically been very fuel efficient.
MrsLK has a Mini Cooper S and that does 40 mpg with ease which is pretty remarkable for a 2 litre turbo petrol.

Likewise Hondas and the Ford Focus range.

Petrol cars are now dearer secondhand than diesels - only 3 years ago was other way round.

 

[Vx-Man-G]

Petrol cars are now dearer secondhand than diesels - only 3 years ago was other way round.

Thats very true.
Its really a money making cash cow from the Birmingham Council, if they wanted to stop the polluting they would stop the polluting cars full stop.
The choices vs budget really are limted.

 

[LostKiwi]

The other thing to think about is how often does he go into the clean air zone?
There are a lot of £8 per day in the cost difference between his existing car and replacing it. It really depends on the condition and expected life of the one has, especially if he likes what he has.

 

[Vx-Man-G]

The other thing to think about is how often does he go into the clean air zone?
There are a lot of £8 per day in the cost difference between his existing car and replacing it. It really depends on the condition and expected life of the one has, especially if he likes what he has.

For work purposes, he has to drive right through it every weekday.
In the short term, he would look at an alternative route, this would only add on abour 4 miles to his journey but those 4 miles can take an additional 30 mins.

 

[LostKiwi]

I work in the centre of Birmingham and in this respect Covid has helped me out as it's proved to management that we don't need to be in the office and can WFH. We're expecting to only need to go the the office one every 4 or 5 days once Covid is over.
If I still had to go in my plan was to drive to a carpark outside the zone then use an electric scooter or e-bike to cover the mile into the office. Obviously not an option for your father...

 

[MBDevotee]

Have looked at some Ford's <£10k, and the only really one that looks good as well as being family sized is the B-Max, but the claimed MPG on them is horrendous, officially around 32mpg, but I have friends who had had the B-Max and they say they are lucky to achieve 25mpg.

Mondeo estate, 2.0 power shift is an utterly brilliant car - beyond superb, however you have more chance of finding rocking horse do-do really as 99% were diesel.

Won’t be great on economy tho!

I’ve had the new shape focus estate 1.5 180bhp auto - that is also an excellent car, but 40mpg at tops, more likely mid 30’s

Neither really fit the sub 10k brief

C-class 250 petrol estate would seem to be a perfect fit?

 

[Vx-Man-G]

Loving your comments and advice guys. Being honest, not really a Ford family. Been life long Vauxhall drivers, only swapped Dad over to the Merc around 3/4 years ago, for some reason he keeps talking to me about Vauxhall's still , but I would prefer for him to stay Merc, B-Class is a real option, but with Covid lockdown he cant even go to like a motorpoint to check one out for size and practicality.

He will never buy a C250 Petrol, he didnt want a 2.1 Diesel but it is what it is. I do get it though, why has such a big engine for a person who drives at <30mph even in 40mph zones .

I wish there were a way I could map out the CAZ area and overlay it with his drive to work.

 

[A.J.]

Yeh, thats what we have been exploring, but economy suffers on petrol and hybrids are a bit out of price range at the moment.

I have a 2017 C200 petrol and it returns over 40mpg on a run, best I have had was 44mpg. Around town it is around 30mpg depending upon congestion, have seen 30+ on a quiet day, don't suppose Brum has quiet days though I don't do a huge mileage in normal times anyway but generally I am very pleased the the fuel consumption

 

[Vx-Man-G]

I have a 2017 C200 petrol and it returns over 40mpg on a run, best I have had was 44mpg. Around town it is around 30mpg depending upon congestion, have seen 30+ on a quiet day, don't suppose Brum has quiet days though I don't do a huge mileage in normal times anyway but generally I am very pleased the the fuel consumption

I guess that is failry comparable to his 2010 C220D, im sure he achieves around 35mpg around town so a Petrol wouldnt be so bad.

Hmm, food for thought, but we still have the issue of it being a lower down car. Im comparison to the W204, is the W205 slightly higher?

 

[MBDevotee]

There is the C200 as well, I just thought as there is little difference in price have the bigger engine.....

 

[A.J.]

I guess that is failry comparable to his 2010 C220D, im sure he achieves around 35mpg around town so a Petrol wouldnt be so bad.

Hmm, food for thought, but we still have the issue of it being a lower down car. Im comparison to the W204, is the W205 slightly higher?

I found the W205 to be about 10% better that the W204 I had previously

 

[Gazwould]

Mondeo estate, 2.0 power shift is an utterly brilliant car - beyond superb, however you have more chance of finding rocking horse do-do really as 99% were diesel.

Power



Avoid this gearbox like the plague .

 

[John Laidlaw]

He could lease a Nissan Leaf for c£250 a month, no road tax, nothing to pay Birmingham council, free parking (with the green plate), will suit his commute well with 160 miles+ range, c2p a mile. Plenty nippy motor, not low down (My wife moved from an XC90 and hasn't missed it)...just a thought from another angle

 

[Gazwould]

I found the W205 to be about 10% better that the W204 I had previously

The W204 220 CDI are not spectacular around town .
But elsewhere...

 

[A.J.]

The W204 220 CDI are not spectacular around town .
But elsewhere...

View attachment 65844

Never ever got anywhere that sort of figure on the W204 C220 I had a few years ago, if I remember rightly it was around the 50 mark