Brake Judder

Botus

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I always use the parking brake when stationary in traffic or at junctions as it doesn't use the pads to hold the car in position. It should hold the car stationary when idling in drive.
Only on the steepest of roads do I use the foot brake, as well as the parking brake, if I detect that its not holding the car stationary.

that is bad driving and will ruin the gearbox - auto's are supposed to be left in D with your foot on the brake
 
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I ran this past Mercedes. Fella said always use the hold function or just hold.your foot on the brake . That's what it is designed for, this putting in neutral to stop supposed disc warp is nonsense. Just use hold or electric park brake.
 

EmilysDad

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that is bad driving and will ruin the gearbox - auto's are supposed to be left in D with your foot on the brake
HTF are you going to damage a gearbox by using the parking brake? Brandwooddixon is using the brakes ... not PARK
 

Botus

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HTF are you going to damage a gearbox by using the parking brake? Brandwooddixon is using the brakes ... not PARK
thought it said uses park. its been on the forum before people sliding it in to N or P

anyway there is no way a german car gets brake judder under normal abuse - have you seen how they drive in the busy bits of europe - 120mph to 50mph every other 100 yards - so long and you indicate its OK to pull out on someone doing 150mph in their strange minds
 

DSK

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Ford Capri 280's used to get this - it was nothing to do with the brakes

tyres
steering rack
suspension bushes

I had some on one of my Volvo’s, albeit quite minimal but was only solved either by new wishbones or suspension top mounts, can’t remember which.


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brandwooddixon

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that is bad driving and will ruin the gearbox - auto's are supposed to be left in D with your foot on the brake
Please reread - shown with bold for emphasis.
I always use the parking brake when stationary in traffic or at junctions as it doesn't use the pads to hold the car in position. It should hold the car stationary when idling in drive.
 

JAMJ

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Hi All... Had brake Judder on my car, so just naturally changed discs and pads all oem from Mercedes. All seemed ok, now 5 weeks later Judder is back. The car in question is A250 4 matic 39k on clock.... Only seems to happen under light braking. Now this is my 3 Merc and previous cars had no issues with brakes with such low miles. Any ideas. Have been reading online but no one seems to have a definite answer. Lol. Cheers
My brake judder on my 2016 w205 300h estate is a constant thorn in my side. We have again changed the discs (at MB Lookers Gatwick) and just after 500 miles they are juddering again.

On extended warranty, MB denied my claim saying its the way I drive and the very low mileage. Then they claimed that a replacement wheel I bought off ebay was the problem (out of balance?).

Is any of this true? No one mentioned a lazy brake calliper before. Could anyone recommend a good garage (in the south-east UK) with an understanding of these issues. Each replacement of discs and pads costs £1100 so I must get this sorted for once and for all.
 

brandwooddixon

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My brake judder on my 2016 w205 300h estate is a constant thorn in my side. We have again changed the discs (at MB Lookers Gatwick) and just after 500 miles they are juddering again.

On extended warranty, MB denied my claim saying its the way I drive and the very low mileage. Then they claimed that a replacement wheel I bought off ebay was the problem (out of balance?).

Is any of this true? No one mentioned a lazy brake calliper before. Could anyone recommend a good garage (in the south-east UK) with an understanding of these issues. Each replacement of discs and pads costs £1100 so I must get this sorted for once and for all.
How do you bed them in?
Often judder is caused by uneven friction or slightly raised areas due to pad material being embedded in one location.

I have found that following the "brake gently for 200 miles" routine always ends up with brake judder at some stage.

Instead I use the following routine to bed in the brakes to work best - you'll need to find a quiet section of road with good visibility so that you can easily check for traffic approaching from behind.
First stage - to put friction material from the pads onto the discs in an even coat - brake from 30mph to 10 mph applying firm/medium pressure. Repeat 6 times.
Second stage - to heat treat the disc, binding the friction material into the iron and burn off volatiles in new pads - brake from 60mph to 10mph applying firm pressure (not emergency stop pressure). Repeat 6 times (you'll really smell them at this stage). Then drive for 5 minutes without braking (if possible) to cool the brakes down .
For both stages don't brake to a stop, but if you must ensure that you release the foot brake and use the parking brake to hold the car in position.

After that I use the parking brake whenever I pull to a stop (not the foot brake or HOLD function) to prevent further addition of pad material in one location on the disc. Also I brake hard at least once a week to ensure that calipers and pads, especially the rears don't seize up.
 

JAMJ

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How do you bed them in?
Often judder is caused by uneven friction or slightly raised areas due to pad material being embedded in one location.

I have found that following the "brake gently for 200 miles" routine always ends up with brake judder at some stage.

Instead I use the following routine to bed in the brakes to work best - you'll need to find a quiet section of road with good visibility so that you can easily check for traffic approaching from behind.
First stage - to put friction material from the pads onto the discs in an even coat - brake from 30mph to 10 mph applying firm/medium pressure. Repeat 6 times.
Second stage - to heat treat the disc, binding the friction material into the iron and burn off volatiles in new pads - brake from 60mph to 10mph applying firm pressure (not emergency stop pressure). Repeat 6 times (you'll really smell them at this stage). Then drive for 5 minutes without braking (if possible) to cool the brakes down .
For both stages don't brake to a stop, but if you must ensure that you release the foot brake and use the parking brake to hold the car in position.

After that I use the parking brake whenever I pull to a stop (not the foot brake or HOLD function) to prevent further addition of pad material in one location on the disc. Also I brake hard at least once a week to ensure that calipers and pads, especially the rears don't seize up.
I've always been super gentle and cautious - you reckon that is all wrong? Is it too late to try your method now?
 

EmilysDad

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How do you bed them in?
Often judder is caused by uneven friction or slightly raised areas due to pad material being embedded in one location.

I have found that following the "brake gently for 200 miles" routine always ends up with brake judder at some stage.

Instead I use the following routine to bed in the brakes to work best - you'll need to find a quiet section of road with good visibility so that you can easily check for traffic approaching from behind.
First stage - to put friction material from the pads onto the discs in an even coat - brake from 30mph to 10 mph applying firm/medium pressure. Repeat 6 times.
Second stage - to heat treat the disc, binding the friction material into the iron and burn off volatiles in new pads - brake from 60mph to 10mph applying firm pressure (not emergency stop pressure). Repeat 6 times (you'll really smell them at this stage). Then drive for 5 minutes without braking (if possible) to cool the brakes down .
For both stages don't brake to a stop, but if you must ensure that you release the foot brake and use the parking brake to hold the car in position.

After that I use the parking brake whenever I pull to a stop (not the foot brake or HOLD function) to prevent further addition of pad material in one location on the disc. Also I brake hard at least once a week to ensure that calipers and pads, especially the rears don't seize up.
What if your parking brake is electric & uses the pads on the disc? ;)
 

brandwooddixon

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What if your parking brake is electric & uses the pads on the disc? ;)
Is that really a thing? I'd be interested to know of a vehicle that uses pads on the disc for a parking brake.
As far as I'm aware the parking brake (even the electric ones) use shoes within drums as it's the most reliable mechanical system to implement.
 

EmilysDad

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Is that really a thing? I'd be interested to know of a vehicle that uses pads on the disc for a parking brake.
As far as I'm aware the parking brake (even the electric ones) use shoes within drums as it's the most reliable mechanical system to implement.
Yes .... it's really a thing at the back of my W166 ML350. ;)
 

brandwooddixon

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Yes .... it's really a thing at the back of my W166 ML350. ;)
Well I guess as most road cars have a bias of 60-80% of the total braking force being to the front wheels the fronts will develop issues long before the rears as the discs get hotter.
 

alexanderfoti

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My brake judder on my 2016 w205 300h estate is a constant thorn in my side. We have again changed the discs (at MB Lookers Gatwick) and just after 500 miles they are juddering again.

On extended warranty, MB denied my claim saying its the way I drive and the very low mileage. Then they claimed that a replacement wheel I bought off ebay was the problem (out of balance?).

Is any of this true? No one mentioned a lazy brake calliper before. Could anyone recommend a good garage (in the south-east UK) with an understanding of these issues. Each replacement of discs and pads costs £1100 so I must get this sorted for once and for all.
W205's have a hub design that is easily bent by overtorquing. This will cause brake judder very quickly.

Runout needs to be measured on the hubs, then replaced if required. The wheel bolts then need to be torqued correctly.
 

ajlsl600

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I hav never used any procedure after fitting discs n pads. Old ones off. Pistons pushed back in calipers, all properly cleaned reassembled. Wipe new discs with thinners. Pump pedal to get pads in contact with disc. Off u go. I did once 30 Yr ago forget to pump pistons out. Hopped in reversed out. F, no brakes to late bang... Back of boss car 4 inch shorter, never forgot again.
 

EmilysDad

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I hav never used any procedure after fitting discs n pads. Old ones off. Pistons pushed back in calipers, all properly cleaned reassembled. Wipe new discs with thinners. Pump pedal to get pads in contact with disc. Off u go. I did once 30 Yr ago forget to pump pistons out. Hopped in reversed out. F, no brakes to late bang... Back of boss car 4 inch shorter, never forgot again.
Though I never hit anyone, I too have reversed out of the drive after working on brakes & had the pedal sink to the floor .... it's something you only do once! :rolleyes:
And I've never done anything specific with new discs ... just brake gently & avoid emergency stops!
 


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