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Driver Power Manufacturers - Mercedes 26/30

Discussion in 'Motoring Related Discussion' started by Srdl, Apr 24, 2019.

  1. Srdl

    Srdl Senior Member

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  2. JBell

    JBell Senior Member

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    They wont bother, people will still buy them
     
  3. Craiglxviii

    Craiglxviii Senior Member

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    Surveys like this make me highly suspicious of their control methodology. What was the sample size? What questions were asked and in what context?

    I say that because Alfa did so well.
     
  4. LostKiwi

    LostKiwi Senior Member

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    These surveys don't take into account expectations.
    If you spend £5k on a car you'll be far more tolerant to faults and niggles than if you spend £100k.
    You can clearly see this in the VAG group results where the lower priced sub brands score better than premium for what is essentially the same car.
     
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  5. d215yq

    d215yq Senior Member

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    I'm not so sure. How many people do you hear having lots of niggles on Range Rovers and Mercs always in and out of the garage but they'll go and buy them again because "they love how they make them feel".

    If you buy a Kia/Toyota you probably have no interest in how nice it is and therefore want it to work and if it breaks a lot will happily switch brands. The marketing depts aren't stupid and the cheaper cars have longer warranties and the expensive have the shortest, which would suggest customers of cheaper cars care more about reliability than the others.

    Also the VAG brands may be the same car but they introduce newer engines/technology on Audi then VW then Skoda and also they have more complex kit so it makes sense that although the same manufacturer the premium brands are less reliable. The taxi drivers across Spain ordered thousands of Octavias when they were about to move from 1.9tdi to 2.0 tdi. The newer engine had already been in VWs/Audis for a few years, enough for them to realise it was nowhere near as reliable/long lasting as the 1.9 one.
     
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  6. John Laidlaw

    John Laidlaw Senior Member

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    However well researched it’s at least interesting- Alfa second?
    And BMW almost pinned at the same level as Mercedes....as LK above it’s a lot to do with expectation in almost every case, maybe with the exception of Lexus who are consistent....
     
  7. McDonald

    McDonald Senior Member

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    Most readers of this forum wouldn't want anything from the top ten. Not because we don't want affordability and reliability, but because we want something more.
     
  8. MalcQV

    MalcQV Senior Member

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    Having owned a few Alfas and met many other owners, I can tell you that they are one of the most enthusiastic petrolheads I've ever come across as a whole.

    As for reliability, I don't believe they're really any worse than the next brand. Although I suspect the enthusiasm I mentioned has helped push the brand near the top.

    I had a 1997 Alfa Spider Twin Spark from 2011 - 2018. It had one engine failure (due to a crap mechanic) and a partial engine issue (started knocking) due to the owner (me). A part from an MX5 my Ex owned, it is the longest I have ever owned a car. I miss it dearly.
    The other two were oil burning clatterboxes. A 2005 1.9 GT which IMO is lovely to behold but the diesel engine is awful. Only fault was a regularly clogged DPF and suspension squeaks. They wear out quickly. That car had the best seats I've ever sat in in my life.
    Then a 2006 159 5 - pot diesel. For a choker that was not half bad of an engine. Front end to die for.
    The aux belt snapped on that one time and I had to nurse it to the garage.

    Only the 20 years old Spider required a breakdown service but that was a bad mechanic.

    The BMW Z3 I have my other half does not really like. I'll have it a couple of years and replace it. Possible with an 939 Alfa Spider (159, Brera) but with a proper petrol engine.
     
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  9. rf065

    rf065 Senior Member

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    Lexus may be number one, but look at the photo, could you buy a car with three great big gaping holes at the front? I'm being really kind when I say it looks hideous! Don't mention the Honda Civic either, that's design gone mad.
     
  10. John Laidlaw

    John Laidlaw Senior Member

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    Don’t get me wrong the ? Was meant as a compliment to where Alfa have gotten to.
    The Quadrifoglio was a serious contender in my last change......
     
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  11. Craiglxviii

    Craiglxviii Senior Member

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    But how how picky will they be about it?

    Marketing departments aren’t stupid. However, it’s more that less premium OEMs have to work harder to sell more cars of a lower profit than more premium brands do. So, they have to incentivise the sale; increased warranty provision is the cheapest way of doing that. Also, the likes of Kia, Nissan, Toyota etc experience an 80-85% customer retention rate. People tend not to switch brands too much.

    VAG introduce new tech or content dependent on the already planned engineering change points laid out by model, whatever they may be. Audi doesn’t get the new engine first. The A4 might get it first if in its engineering release schedule, it has a powerplant change point earlier than any other car. What tends to happen is that Audi release styling changes earlier than their cousins.
     
  12. John Laidlaw

    John Laidlaw Senior Member

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    Craig, you used ‘Audi’ and ‘Styling’ in the same sentence....:rolleyes:
     
  13. Craiglxviii

    Craiglxviii Senior Member

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    Too right John. Their DRLs are a thing of beauty. They’re even called “mascara lines” in Audi Design...
     
  14. John Laidlaw

    John Laidlaw Senior Member

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    Only thing I truly like is the sweeping indicators, those to be fair are pretty trick and very practical
     
  15. Craiglxviii

    Craiglxviii Senior Member

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    They’re a really simple trick, the on-cost is about £0.80 per lamp and they (again) set lighting styling standards. Audi really know what they’re doing in that arena. It’s thanks to them that we have the current tech level of lighting class LEDs.
     
  16. John Laidlaw

    John Laidlaw Senior Member

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    Is it patented Craig, don’t recall seeing other manufacturers adopting it yet (I think)
     
  17. Craiglxviii

    Craiglxviii Senior Member

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    Nope, all it requires is enough addressable LEDs or chains of them linked into a driver with enough output channels to fire them sequentially.
     
  18. John Laidlaw

    John Laidlaw Senior Member

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    Just this morning I answered myself as I saw a Peugeot 5008 with them ( just before I was violently sick ):p
     
  19. Craiglxviii

    Craiglxviii Senior Member

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    Now that’s an odd car. Never have I ever seen more lashings and lashings and advisedly dare I say it lashings of poorly applied mastic sealant on a car. And the bumper beam, 6mm wall thickness aluminium extrusion with bending and all sorts of machining in it. And they wonder why they’re not making much money on the car...
     
  20. LostKiwi

    LostKiwi Senior Member

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    Now I just think they look tacky....

    It was something found on American cars of the 60s originally. Developed by Ford and phased out in the 70s before being reintroduced on the 2010 Mustang (Not UK versions).
     

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