Got the ULEZ letter today from MoT

[Mr Greedy]

I'm pretty sure @Botus is not suggesting we start living a basic and unbearable existence. His point is at the stark end, but I believe still valid. We as a species have been incredibly wasteful of the planets resources in the past couple of centuries and there is a chance the bleep is about to get real.

There are plenty of ways things we can do differently without a 200 year reverse in living standards. Instead of blueberries and asparagus in February from the other side of the planet, we could eat fruit and veg grown in the UK, more suited to our climate. The tech to keep growing 'summer' crops is massively improved, but the range of crops would indeed be less. Could we live without turning on the jet engine to stuff that cheap out of season produce in our increasingly obese faces? I'm suggesting we could.

Lockdown has shown that a lot of people can, today, work from home a lot more. Yes, we can start going back into the office, but could we encourage the use of WFH more so that we don't turn on the key to our car? I'm suggesting we could.

I live 4 miles from work and cycle any dry day. Half the site of 200 live significantly less than 2 miles from work. They nearly all drive. Could they get to work pretty easily by waking for less than 30 mins and not turn on the car engine? I'm suggesting they could.

So to the stark point from Botus, yes, basically doing what we can to stop turning on those engines is something that is very feasible, without massive and unbearable changes and costs to our quality of life today. But it won't be sacrifice free either.

Of course there are a lot of 'necessary' (I'm not defining what that means) journeys that today will still need engine transport, but we could choose to make significant difference today as well.

This of course depends on whether people think everything is fine and can carry on as is, or whether people think our actions are unsustainable and damaging.

 

[Monday]

Both my cars are ULEZ compliant. They are however subject to the Central London Congestion Charge (£15/day) which I knew BUT did not realise that the charge now applies every day of the year except Christmas Day.
Not that I ever drive into central London these days.......
Note that ULEZ applies up to but not including the North and South Circular Roads.

 

[Botus]

Are you parking up your S500 permanently?

I've done less than 1000 miles in the last year in this car, and I contribute in road tax £600 for it, which should go toward initiatives that remove congestion (not build in more and more as they do) and to help the environment

the pair of us have paid £1129 in road tax to do less than 3k miles in the last year on 5 vehicles, four of which are ULEZ compliant and one heading to be a classic bike. And indeed paid much the same the year prior for less mileage. I try to never get in congestion and always cycle to work where operating costs over the last 10 years have been less than £30. In my youth in all my schooling I walked or cycled with the exception of less than 10 journeys by car. Twice in a taxi that had to take my brother due to his broken leg and a few times home with a neighbour when her grandfather got a day off and picked her up as a treat.

I find it both utterly stupid and irresponsible our government allows hundreds of thousands of diesel death machines to cause congestion on the M25 every day for 5 hours, then drive in to London and murder children and yet pay only £20 a year, when my clean safe car has to pay £600 !

Well done Boris our saviour

 

[Hotspur]

Botus I agree with you - i have done less than 5000 miles over the last 2 years in my 4 cars which are all insured, taxed and maintained...similar boat.

We get Tesco to deliver our food, I use taxi's which are invariably Prius's to go out due to wanting to have a drink or two, I use the train to go to London, I manage a school rota for 4 parents/families (inc ourselves) to taxi 4 kids to school to reduce the school run by 75%...

Whilst I am not anti-government, what I object to are there crazy theories and policies....when they themselves break their own rules like that Health Secretary fool caught breaking Covid distancing rules with his pants down with his mistress, and the other expense frauds & the rest of the orangutans hanging from the chandeliers during prime minister's question time.

 

[Paul Garrett]

Are you parking up your S500 permanently?

I know i won't be parking up my S500, ive made it as emission friendly as it can get,to be honest even if every single person in the UK did reduce their carbon use it would be a speck compared to the massive pollution put out by other countries who talk the talk but have no interest in doing so because there is no money to be made?, Man will destroy the earth because greed comes before everything else, i cannot afford a electric car and once again if everyone had electric cars, more power stations will have to be built to supply the power needed, and guess what? How will they be powered?, Coal?? Errr no! Nuclear?....oh the nimby's will kick off! See where im going with this, hydrogen is surely the best way, but im sure there would be arguements about that source of power too?

 

[00slk]

If you live rural or semi rural you need a car, simple, we use a car for all journeys.

Also difficult to carry £170 of supermarket shopping in a back pack!

Sent from my SM-G988B using Tapatalk

My Dad and his brother and sister went to school on the back of a horse, Grandma walked to the food shop and grandad walked to his Barbar shop, admittedly only 4 miles each way but still. They didn't buy a car until the late 40's and it was a real luxury and went everywhere in it, school and back, grandma was driven to the shops, but grandad still walked, liked the exercise, but died at 67, grandma lived till 93.
The moral of the story here is........

 

[AnthonyUK]

The moral of the story here is........

Don't rely on very small, unrelated data sets to make your decision??

 

[00slk]

I know i won't be parking up my S500, ive made it as emission friendly as it can get,to be honest even if every single person in the UK did reduce their carbon use it would be a speck compared to the massive pollution put out by other countries who talk the talk but have no interest in doing so because there is no money to be made?, Man will destroy the earth because greed comes before everything else, i cannot afford a electric car and once again if everyone had electric cars, more power stations will have to be built to supply the power needed, and guess what? How will they be powered?, Coal?? Errr no! Nuclear?....oh the nimby's will kick off! See where im going with this, hydrogen is surely the best way, but im sure there would be arguements about that source of power too?

Hydrogen cars are coming watch this space.
Speaking of space, be on the look at for land being prepared for Hydrogen filling stations......I've said my bit

 

[00slk]

Don't rely on very small, unrelated data sets to make your decision??

Exactly, still trying to work out why the government listen too small unrelated data to tell everyone diesel was good back then, now electric is good now when it's not really because of the emissions to build the things, water powered cars has been invented many many years ago and brought out by the fuel companies, electric cars have been produced for many many years too, not been bought out, why, because the government want all petrol and diesel cars stopped. Half the reason for the media hype about driver/fuel shortages, which there wouldn't have been if numb brains hadn't flocked to fuel stations sucking the tanks dry, by going every day to put 12litres in their cars and fill Jerry cans!
The world has been experiencing huge environmental problems since day 1, since the dinosaurs, there was supposedly floods, fires, ice, you name it, the planet has had it, no cars or industry to ad to the atmosphere pollutants back then.
In the last 150 years man has progress tenfold and there is so much more advanced science and technology to monitor things and also social media hype that things are forced on everyone and opinions are so divided it makes the truth totally thrown out of texted. The greenies have caused the government to put things in place on little evidence of their so called findings. Okay yes the planet is according to media warming up, everyone says we need to do something about it, but what, no one is going to do what will help the planet, we'll still drive machines, burn harmful gases. As we have advanced so much, why can't these scientists sort out this so called problem, or anyone with common sense for that matter. Oh yes, things are in the pipe line.....Hydrogen....
By 2030 I am not going to be able to heat our bungalow or cook at home because we've been told our system want be legal and we have to change it for a more economical system. Our heating system has just been serviced and is more efficient than a 2 year old eco government approved system, go figure. Our system is 12 years old! I'm not interested in saving the planet, as far as I'm concerned there's no proof! I've got 3 V8 cars 3 6cylinder ones and diesel lorry a motor bike and use them All!
This however is all my own opinion and mine only

 

[LostKiwi]

Hydrogen cars are coming watch this space.
Speaking of space, be on the look at for land being prepared for Hydrogen filling stations......I've said my bit

Hydrogen is a big white elephant.
In theory it's fantastic but the realities are very different.
How is hydrogen produced commercially?
One method is steam reformation of hydrocarbons which releasing huge quantities of CO2.
One method is electrolysis of water, which is only about 70-80% efficient.
Then once you have your hydrogen how are you going to transport it? Existing pipeline material isn't suitable as hydrogen leaches through the steel. That means it needs to be carried in large tankers (pretty inefficient).
Then having fuelled your hydrogen car what do you do with the hydrogen? Combust it in an engine? If you're lucky it's 40% efficient.
Use it in a fuel cell? Better but still only 60-70% efficient.
So looking at the efficiency the best you can hope for is 56% but it may be significantly less (and the CO2 output could be as bad as ICE).
Bit saying electric is the answer but at least the efficiency is better. Lithium batteries are 95% efficient and electric motors typically over 90% efficient giving a typical efficiency of 81%. CO2 is totally dependent on how it's generated but can be zero.

 

[ajlsl600]

So when I now do drive into London, I will leave the economical Blue Motion Golf and Blue Efficiency Mercedes at home and take my Noise and Air polluting gas guzzling M5 into the city...I would rather spend the extra money in fuel in the M5 than give it in a daily ULEZ charge to Khan and his cronies....

I make a point of only Goin to London to get in or out of uk. Never for anythin esle. And if practical I use brisol
And I sure as hell wud never pay to take a car there. We get fd enough on car tax inss tax petrol or diesel tax. Am I Goin to pay those twxxs up there to be stuck in their road works and traffic jams. Sure as hell no. Ulezfo

 

[mioba]

Hydrogen cars are coming watch this space.
Speaking of space, be on the look at for land being prepared for Hydrogen filling stations......I've said my bit

Hydrogen has been talked about for 30 years. I recall we studied it in Geography at school.

 

[00slk]

Hydrogen has been talked about for 30 years. I recall we studied it in Geography at school.

So has electric and no further on either, still hydrogen will suddenly be a next government fiasco. Like Lost Kiwi says in his reply, basically how they going to do it? I have no idea either but got my information from a good source. If they can put this long wished theory into action there there is plenty of water about.
I always said, there's not substitute for good old fashioned petrol.....just like cubic inches

 

[Hotspur]

They will think of ways to charge you for entering a congestion zone when one develops warp speed?

Although they would have to find you first....

 

[sl500amgsport]

My Dad and his brother and sister went to school on the back of a horse, Grandma walked to the food shop and grandad walked to his Barbar shop, admittedly only 4 miles each way but still. They didn't buy a car until the late 40's and it was a real luxury and went everywhere in it, school and back, grandma was driven to the shops, but grandad still walked, liked the exercise, but died at 67, grandma lived till 93.
The moral of the story here is........

Buy a methane producing horse and take 4 hours to visit your children?

Sent from my SM-G988B using Tapatalk

 

[sl500amgsport]

I make a point of only Goin to London to get in or out of uk. Never for anythin esle. And if practical I use brisol
And I sure as hell wud never pay to take a car there. We get fd enough on car tax inss tax petrol or diesel tax. Am I Goin to pay those twxxs up there to be stuck in their road works and traffic jams. Sure as hell no. Ulezfo

I drive into London every few months to meet clients/deliver goods more so during Covid as it avoided trains full of coughing zombies.

But I do not pay ULEZ, congestion or any parking charges so it works out cheaper than the train as I borrow the wife (co-director) with her Sadiq Khan busting blue badge.

Unfortunately will always need a car as she cannot cycle or walk far, maybe the green government of the future will decree that for "green" reasons and to "save our NHS" all disabled need to be euthanized? Would not put anything past the current green zealots that are in charge!

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[Paul Garrett]

Buy a methane producing horse and take 4 hours to visit your children?

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Can you imagine the amount of horse poop everywhere if everyone went back to horse and cart!? Then their will be a health hazard to humans no doubt!....can't win really!!

 

[Frontstep]

Pseudo-green is all the rage each sector seeks to promote their green credentials but many are specious.


The tale of Drax Power station springs to mind and its conversion to wood pellets driven by some crazy thinking.

Forests are decimated pelleted and shipped from the US to us at an enormous environmental cost.

The very things that "hoover up" Co2 are burned and in the process release decades of co2 in minutes.

The only truly "green" thing that most of us will do is die.

 

[Botus]

Hydrogen has been talked about for 30 years. I recall we studied it in Geography at school.

more than 40 years ago.... BMW had a 7 series test rig running way back - the petrol chemical boys will have paid them to shut up
in the 1950's wind and wave power was all the rage but the nuclear fuel crooks lied and cheated and the silly gov went the wrong way
corporate / gov incompetence has been going for a very long time...

page 72 mentions the 80's https://www.wired.com/images_blogs/autopia/files/bmw_hydrogen_7.pdf
this one from 1973 still not in use as waves destroy our coast line ! https://www.theengineer.co.uk/stephen-salter-pioneer-of-wave-power/
25 years ago https://www.renewableuk.com/news/32...nergy-now-a-mainstream-electricity-source.htm

 

[Craiglxviii]

more than 40 years ago.... BMW had a 7 series test rig running way back - the petrol chemical boys will have paid them to shut up
in the 1950's wind and wave power was all the rage but the nuclear fuel crooks lied and cheated and the silly gov went the wrong way
corporate / gov incompetence has been going for a very long time...

page 72 mentions the 80's https://www.wired.com/images_blogs/autopia/files/bmw_hydrogen_7.pdf
this one from 1973 still not in use as waves destroy our coast line ! https://www.theengineer.co.uk/stephen-salter-pioneer-of-wave-power/
25 years ago https://www.renewableuk.com/news/32...nergy-now-a-mainstream-electricity-source.htm

I’ve worked on hydrogen powered cars. Only fuel cells can feasibly hold the power density requirements for range and safety, and they’re uneconomical to manufacture for another 20-30 years, from the last technology roadmap I saw.

I’ve also worked on wave power. It’s one of those things that works really well in the lab but doesn’t scale well. Or, in fact, at all.

Tidal power does scale, and we have some great areas to install tidal leccy barrages. However the environmentalists have successfully killed off the large scale planning applications as being bad for the wildlife.

Nuclear really IS the way to go only with the problem of high up front costs, and the whole NIMBY problem. Why do you think we import leccy from France- with its well-developed nuclear power programme using low enrichment fuel? Why do you think Germany- with its well developed wind power programme- has to import gas from the Sovi…. err Russians?