If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

[rayhennig]

Well, I've agonised over that old adage and completely ignored it!

Not only that, but I've bored rigid everyone on these boards describing my policy of cleaning every electrical contact I can find in order to keep my old 300ce-24 Coupe running sweetly after 200K miles.

For years, I've been looking at the coaxial connector on the camshaft position sensor and have convinced myself that the contacts must be filthy. For years it's resisted all my attempts to unplug the thing. Until now, that is!

A combination of grim determination and brute force was rewarded with movement. Sadly, it wasn't the plug moving in the socket! It was 18 year old plastic giving way under an unprovoked assault. The entire sensor body fell apart and I've just ordered a new one! And, yes, you've guessed it, the contacts were clean and shining. Why did I not leave well alone?

Now to the point.

I've just ordered a Hella part from a distributor in France for €146.

I saw one manufactured by Facet, listed in the US at $US70 - less than a third of the price.

Anyway, given that this thing actually pokes into the engine, I bit the bullet.

So, have I allowed branding to triumph over common sense?

What about other brands? Are they of lower quality?

I've got a distributor cap and rotor arm from Bremi. They seem fine after a year.

What about Facet? Italian, I learn. Anyone here have any comment?

Febi Bilstein. What about them for engine and other major parts (yes, I know we love Bilstein for their dampers)?

I think it would be interesting and informative if people discussed their use of, and attitudes to, the lesser known brands.

The best to all.

RayH

 

[Myros]

Good point well made Ray

I suffer from " what does this do " syndrome sometimes, but most of the time I talk myself out of it. As for brand names, I really don't care, as long as the part does the job. There's the nub though. You either need someone to recommend Brand X, or try it yourself. Most of the time, you give in to the subtle lure of the name and go well-known.
I'm prepared to commit myself to all sorts of endorsement here. I use Fuchs 5w40 oil or Carlube R in the mem's 210, I use Chevron 5w40 in the 202 and the 107 ( all synthetic). I used either Lidl's own or Chevron multigrade mineral 10w 40 in the 124. The only difference I can discern in all these is the price comparisons. Carlube R cost £90 for 10 litres, the Fuchs cost £75 for 20 litres( and is ostensibly what the factory fill it with). The Chevron costs £12 for 4 litres of synth and about £ 25 for 20 litres of mineral (costco) The Lidl oil was £8.95 for 5 litres.
Ferodo and Mintex pads were all I used on my old BMW, but with the Mercs I stick to MB as all others squeal. I bought a master cylinder for the 107 from ECP and it was a Teves original, the same as MB would sell me, but at a quarter of the cost.
I've gone off Bosch plugs, not because one of them broke costing me a fortune, but for the imperious and unsustainable superior attitude of their technical dept. Beru now get all my business, and funnily enough, cost me more as I buy their super-duper fancy plugs, rather than the plain Bosch i had been using.
Merc don't make all the bits that go on the car, and if you can find the same part made by the same manufacturer to the same spec, but without the MB or Bosch logo, I'd say use it. The knack is in the finding out of what is what. This forum is a goldmine of good info for that purpose.

 

[Richard Moakes]

Others may argue that even the OEM manufacturers have a two-tier system where parts of a lower 'quality' are sold under their own name, I don't know if thats true, but if it isn't, then it seems a shame to pay lots more money for that Mercedes star stamped into a component.

OEM brands I look for and have had no problem with, in fact they allow me to run two Mercedes for Ford money

Lemforder
Febi-Bilstein
Bosch
Beru
Fuchs
Eberspacher
Hengst
ATE
Textar

 

[jibcl500]

When parts dont meet MB specs or quality they end up for sale at GSF and euro.


jib

 

[jibcl500]

Also should you buy a part from MB and fit it yourself and it turns out to be faulty MB could have to replace the part and refit the part at thier cost.



jib

 

[Richard Moakes]

When parts dont meet MB specs or quality they end up for sale at GSF and euro.


jib

Jib, is there an official statement or evidence to substantiate that?

I am genuinely curious if this could be the case, it's not a dig at you, far from it.

Cheers,

 

[jibcl500]

Rich

I was told this by Mercedes, its like any product, not many companies now make the parts needed to produce the finished article. So one can assume that someone like Mercedes would have a spec for each part and should it not reach that spec then MB wouldnt supply it but the supplier has to do something with the parts other than chuck it in a skip.

I bought an OVP relay from euro for £46 half the price of one from MB, looked the same tasted the same but only lasted 6 weeks, fitted the MB supplied OVP and 2 years on it still works.

I buy and only supply parts from MB, I have 4 Mercedes and plan on a few more soon but will stop at 10. All my cars get parts from MB and Ive just bought a few bits for the CL and suprised at how cheap the parts where.

Its sometimes worth ringing MB first for a price and then compare the price with others for the sake of a few quid its worth buying from MB.

the only brands im not happy to see on a mercedes are Lucas and Hella but thats just me.


jib

 

[Myros]

Jib, interesting about Hella and Lucas

I was reading the 210 spec sheet theother day, and noticed the lights were Hella. I worked in the auto acessory trade for a few years as a younger man, and I always found Hella products to be first class in every way, easily as good as Bosch in the lighting arena.

 

[jibcl500]

I think it must just be me, Ive just pulled a Goodmans radio out of the TE ive broken and wanted to fit it to my other TE as it doesnt have a radio but the words Goodmans is pushing me towards yozzing it in the skip.

jib

 

[Richard Moakes]

I think it must just be me, Ive just pulled a Goodmans radio out of the TE ive broken and wanted to fit it to my other TE as it doesnt have a radio but the words Goodmans is pushing me towards yozzing it in the skip.

jib

I am with you there, in the skip it would go!

 

[Richard Moakes]

Rich

I buy and only supply parts from MB

jib

If I were working on someone else's car, then I would have the same policy.

MB parts are guaranteed to fit nicely, and you have the warranty to fall back on should they fail. Good business sense, makes for happy customers and a happy mechanic.

 

[jberks]

my sympathies - we'vce all done it. "I'll just have a look at this ............ bugger" and it would have given years of service of only I'd left it alone!

Part manufacturers and quality are a difficult thing to evaluate. My experience over the years has been that price rarely represents quality. Its a guide but little more. With car parts it becomes even more odd. When MB can reduce the price of a MAS from £250 to £60 on a whim you know the true cost was probably never more than £30, even when it was being sold at £250 but if someone had offered you one for £45 - making a decent profit, you'd have been suspicious.

The makes you mention sound ok to me but as for part quality sadly you can't really tell without physically handing each part in my experience.

 

[Blobcat]

I think it must just be me, Ive just pulled a Goodmans radio out of the TE ive broken and wanted to fit it to my other TE as it doesnt have a radio but the words Goodmans is pushing me towards yozzing it in the skip.

jib

Lettraset or Dymo gun :wink:

 

[jberks]

I think it must just be me, Ive just pulled a Goodmans radio out of the TE ive broken and wanted to fit it to my other TE as it doesnt have a radio but the words Goodmans is pushing me towards yozzing it in the skip.

jib

sometimes your first instincts are the right ones. A skip is probably the best location.

 

[jibcl500]

sometimes your first instincts are the right ones. A skip is probably the best location.

Ok I think I can take the hint........................... I do have a gen MB radio but I dont understand the wiring and every time I try to fit it I blow the fuse.

Ive take to singing to myself which isnt pleasant........................

jib

 

[rf065]

I think it must just be me, Ive just pulled a Goodmans radio out of the TE ive broken and wanted to fit it to my other TE as it doesnt have a radio but the words Goodmans is pushing me towards yozzing it in the skip.

jib

A long time ago, Goodmans made hi quality hi-fi seperates and were well respected. Unfortunately they were bought over by someone who just wanted the name to put on cheap electrical cr*p.

Russ

 

[kth286]

Ray

It is nothing to do with which company makes the particular part.

It is ALL to do with which company was contracted by Mercedes to make that particular part to the specified Mercedes spec for a particular car model.

All the big well known sub contract companies are capable of making a part to a design spec, but it is the ONE company that is chosen by Mercedes for whatever reason, for that particular part that counts.

Mercedes will contract different companies in turn, to make different parts to spec, so that Mercedes are "spreading their eggs" for safety.

So, if the your cam position sensor as supplied by Mercedes is a Beru unit, you can be sure it will work first time and for many many miles as your original has done.

If you go to an alternative supplier that sell copy parts of that particular item, there is no such guarantee. In the UK the cam position sensor retails at £109 including tax. We would normally be able to get a discount from a Merc dealer.

So, why take the risk when there is hardly any difference in price between original and copy.

In addition car parts design is ALWAYS evolving as experience is built up of day to day performance of the product. The spec of the part is often modified to improve performance
or to lengthen life. Even for discontinued car models.

How do you know the copy part is up to date ?

And copy part it is. Do you think that a non contracted company can go to Mercedes and ask for the spec saying they want to sell that part cheaper and undermine Mercedes own sales ????

 

[rayhennig]

Mercedes OE or not?

David, I take your point but I wish I could have your confidence in Mercedes' ability to supply the correct parts. Here in France MB managed to sell me 2 lots of 6 spark plugs for a total of 200 Euro. Over a period of 6 years the car's performance was adequate so I left it at that. Only when I bought 6 Bosch 'plugs ordinaire' did the thing start running right.

My latest experience concerns the cam position sensor that I decided to trash. I have bought a Hella replacement. Much of my car's electrics are Hella so I'm assuming a consistent quality from that manufacturer.

An 18 year old car from a range of cars that used a lot of standard kit (Bosch KE etc) can expect a lively after-market market (is that right?). And it is that market that we can now choose from. Some of the prices are very competitive and my attitude is, "Why not?"

I will say, however, that I am very interested in quality and am prepared to pay for it. But to what extent are MB prices justified. The prices of their cars during the 1990s showed no signs of dropping. The quality, however, plummeted.

I started this thread in the hope that people would share their experiences of after market parts. My old motor is going like a dream (well, until I boll*xed it) using the following parts that I did not buy at MB:

Distributor cap & rotor - Bremi
HT leads - Beru
Plugs - Bosch
Fuel pumps - Bosch
Fuel accumulator - Bosch
Idle control valve - Bosch
EHA (governor) - Bosch - ancient, recovered from 1987 300TE 4-Matic to replace mine which was leaking.
Springs & Dampers - Bilstein B12 kit
Brake Discs and Pads - ATE
Air filter - Mann
Wiper motor - ancient, recovered - see above.
Gearbox oil - local garage for past 4 years - think he uses something recommended by Peugeot, he certainly does for coolant that I also have.
er ...
That's all I can remember.

Anyway, the old things going pretty well at over 200K miles so I'm happy. I'm particularly happy after a recent hot spell during which it started, ideled and ran around Bordeaux in 30+ temperatures. That is something that it refused to do until I completed my recent round of replacements.

I did have a failure recently. It was the fan bearing. The fan started fouling on water pump (I think). The whole fan assembly was pulled off centre by belt tension. Ghastly noises from Loire valley to Wimbledon where Steve Redfearn did an emergency repair for us. Brilliant job done, very quickly and (you'll be glad to hear, David) MB parts only!!

So, anyone else with some attitude on MB versus the rest?

RayH

 

[jibcl500]

Just for the record 100% all parts directly from MB Cambridge, that goes for my 4 Mercedes and all customers cars.
MB cambridge (robinsons) 100% happy with service provided always get the right parts (but I do use EPC online which helps)

AND....sometimes I think a parts going to be expensive and its not !!!! would suggest anyone in need of a part ring MB first!!!!

jib