Kompressor failure warning/ advice

[G MAN]

S202 200K (01 Y)

The usual poor running, flat spots , roughish idle , pinking, MAF RELATED ISSUES( changed recently) so I bobbed along to local indie( MercCare Pudsey ) for a squint. Very genuine & really helpful, no hard sell , listened to all I could describe.
Had a good few of these in lately, says he,so pulled of the air intake, wiped finger inside loads of oil floating around obviously clogging mas and leading to usual symptoms BUT DIAGNOSIS IS FAILING KOMPRESSOR UNIT!! Says this is all too common on this age of car & although units are now cheaper & available from Mercedes( £580+vat) previously £1100 +vat - exchange) and whatever labour -it seems to be a known & regular fault.
Any ideas ,help or advice appreciated.

Other owners beware could be you next!!

Mines just turned 70k by the way & I do tend to drive it hard (where permitted) There is a unit on e-bay £250 supposedly from a low mileage ,damaged car, no ancilliaries What do you think I would need?
Otherwise a great car so likely to grimace & stump up before it gets terminal.

 

[television]

Sadly in many other contries there people around who rebuild turbo's and compressors, not over here, the main problem as pointed out is the oil seal,and it cant be that hard to replace, I know there are mods on this car for the vacuam system that should remove the excess oil that finds its way down onto the MAF.


Malcolm

 

[G MAN]

Thanks Malcolm ,whilst crying into my Peroni & deciding what furniture to sell to fund the repairs , what is the mod. you referred to to prevent oil seeping through & is it something I could tackle or do you think it would have been done as this is one of the last of that type 202 087... ;111 956....
Called MB was quoted £1001.01 +vat & no exchange....
No luck on BBA Reman
Wondering about this on e-bay 200004775143
Running out of road here quite literally.If I ignore the advice on replacement but change my driving habits could I survive or will the unit eventually cause terminal engine damage/failure?

 

[G MAN]

So the next step is does ayone know if an eaton supercharger can be repaired /reconditioned? If so who & where? All tips welcome!!

 

[psmart]

G-MAN, I bought a Brand New original Mercedes Turbo-Charger from Ebay Germany (just short of 300quid). You have more chances there. Either have a look yourself at www.ebay.de, or post the part number and I'll have a gander when I get back from work tonight (no ebay access here!!!!) and either PM you and URL I find, or post it here.

MercCare are a good company, Ive let them take sole care of my ML since new, but only started to do some of the work myself when a problem which was occurring was going to cost 'tons' because workshops dont have time to in-depth analyse.

 

[G MAN]

That would be great if you could have a snoop for me, not too clever with european languages except irish! part no.A111 09 09 80 The one on e-bay here looks to be right but has come from a damaged 203 ,( although mine is a 202 its a run out model,with the engine 111 956 being carried over to the 203) Hope that's accurate & your help very much appreciated.
Merc-care are as you say very accomodating with help & advice though I do get regular servicing & labour intensive work done at Stadium Garage at Dudley Hill B'ford exactly for the reason you said....cost!

 

[psmart]

Hi G MAN,

Nothing directly for the given part number. Below are current Eaton superchargers for sale, most are new or nearly new units. There are also a number of complete engines for sale, ranging from 40,000 miles upwards for around 800 quid!!!!! If you want those links, I can post them. The UK site looks good, exact part number, good reputation of seller, email the guy to find out how many miles its done, if 40K or less, go for it.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MERCEDES-EATO...ryZ10398QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem



A1110901080 CLK Currently EUR251
http://cgi.ebay.de/Der-Hammer-Eaton...ryZ40187QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

A271 090 2080 EUR271
http://cgi.ebay.de/Eaton-Kompressor...ryZ40187QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

A 271 090 26 80 C Class W203 Estate Currently EUR181
http://cgi.ebay.de/Eaton-Kompressor...ryZ33597QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

A 2710902180, A2711400787 Currently EUR211
http://cgi.ebay.de/Neuer-Eaton-Komp...ryZ33597QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

A2710902080 Currently EUR71
http://cgi.ebay.de/Eaton-kompressor...ryZ40187QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

A271 090 20 80 Currently EUR 106, NEW!
http://cgi.ebay.de/mercedes-eaton-k...ryZ61308QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

[124coupe]

Also worth trying KMS and GSF plus dronsfield mercedes and partsgateway.co.uk

Plus a ring round the breakers who take accident write-off cars?

 

[G MAN]

Thanks for all that psmart( & I had a good laugh with the google translation- takes me back to a role model in my youth, the great Prof. Stanley Unwin)
the info. was valuable research( but all those numbers & squiggly marks in felt pen??!!??) & as you say it all points to the one here on e-bay u.k. I'll follow it up & let you know the outcome Thanks again for time & trouble.
Could try the breakers also,Steve , but with the amount of time in labour to replace the thing I might have to consider a new one with warranty for peace of mind.It'll teach me to not red line it with 4 adults a roof box & a couple of bikes on top........too often!

 

[jimsinessex]

Oh dear! Here we go again

S202 200K (01 Y)

The usual poor running, flat spots , roughish idle , pinking, MAF RELATED ISSUES( changed recently) so I bobbed along to local indie( MercCare Pudsey ) for a squint. Very genuine & really helpful, no hard sell , listened to all I could describe.
Had a good few of these in lately, says he,so pulled of the air intake, wiped finger inside loads of oil floating around obviously clogging mas and leading to usual symptoms BUT DIAGNOSIS IS FAILING KOMPRESSOR UNIT!! Says this is all too common on this age of car & although units are now cheaper & available from Mercedes( £580+vat) previously £1100 +vat - exchange) and whatever labour -it seems to be a known & regular fault.
Any ideas ,help or advice appreciated.

Other owners beware could be you next!!

Mines just turned 70k by the way & I do tend to drive it hard (where permitted) There is a unit on e-bay £250 supposedly from a low mileage ,damaged car, no ancilliaries What do you think I would need?
Otherwise a great car so likely to grimace & stump up before it gets terminal.

This thread surfaced again as a link about misfiring W208 CLK Kompressors and is perpetuating the myth that oil in the air intake system points to a kompressor failure. IT DOES NOT, the only oil in the komp is a small amount in the sealed gear chamber. There is no external oil supply to the kompressor so this cannot be the source of oil contamination of the air intake and more importantly the MAF sensor. Both dealers and indies must have made fortunes over the past few years replacing kompressors unnecessarily at our expense.

Oil in the air intake of high mileage, early C class and CLK class compressors is due to a failure of the low load to upper part load crankcase breather system located under the intake manifold.

The following is my submission on the cause and solution to the problem which worked for me. Since writing this I have done a further 40,000 miles with no more oil in air intake problems.

"The following applies specifically to my car, a 1999 CLK 230k Coupe with a 208347 chassis no. and a 111975 engine, I believe the info applies to all 202 C class and 208 CLK class kompressor engines.
At 97,000 miles I became aware of oil in the air intake but it was then only a minor irritation, cleaning the MAF sensor sorted it. By 140,000 miles the amount of oil in the pipework to the MAF sensor was becoming alarming although it only caused a misfire and was solved again by cleaning.
Examination of the air filter housing showed the oil was entering the system from the Crankcase Breather System.

My understanding of the Crankcase Breather System:-
It operates in two modes, an upper partload to full load system and an idle to upper partload system.

The idle to upper partload system works directly off the crankcase and feeds into the cylinder head just before the inlet valves. The high load system from the cylinder head cover feeds into the air filter housing AFTER the the filter element.

The highload system is mounted on the cylinder head cover and consists of a black plastic oil separator and three hoses,it is very accessible and cheap to replace all components. Beware, get the parts first as the hoses are brittle with age and at least one will probably break. Changing all this did not solve my problem although it was clear that the oil was coming from here!

Conclusion - idle to upper partload system was blocked and forcing the highload system to accept the oil residue at low airflows.

The lower load system is hidden under the inlet manifold and consists of an oil separator built into the crankcase with a hose leading to a valve and tee-piece which in turn leads via two small bore hoses into two brass restricter nozzles in the cylinder head just before the inlet valves. The valve is spring loaded and NOT (in my case) the electric valve suggested in earlier replies. This system was blocked on my car and causing the problem.

After replacing all of it the problem seems, after a further 1000 miles, to be sorted.

Part numbers were:-
Main hose - MA111 018 15 82
Valve/Tee-Piece complete - MA111 010 00 91
2 small bore hoses - MA 002 094 01 82
2 Nozzles MA202 270 33 96

Again the hoses were brittle with age so order before disturbing them.
The nozzles have a very small bore but are a press fit in the head so unless the head is off best to just poke them through. They are only 97p each so order them anyway in case.

I would strongly suggest the Kompressor outlet pipework and intercooler is cleaned as well as a lot of oil could be lying here and still cause problems even after the breather systems have been renewed."

To conclude, oil contamination of the MAF sensor is NOT a sympom of kompressor failure.

Jim

 

[star]

This thread surfaced again as a link about misfiring W208 CLK Kompressors and is perpetuating the myth that oil in the air intake system points to a kompressor failure. IT DOES NOT, the only oil in the komp is a small amount in the sealed gear chamber. There is no external oil supply to the kompressor so this cannot be the source of oil contamination of the air intake and more importantly the MAF sensor. Both dealers and indies must have made fortunes over the past few years replacing kompressors unnecessarily at our expense.

Oil in the air intake of high mileage, early C class and CLK class compressors is due to a failure of the low load to upper part load crankcase breather system located under the intake manifold.

The following is my submission on the cause and solution to the problem which worked for me. Since writing this I have done a further 40,000 miles with no more oil in air intake problems.

"The following applies specifically to my car, a 1999 CLK 230k Coupe with a 208347 chassis no. and a 111975 engine, I believe the info applies to all 202 C class and 208 CLK class kompressor engines.
At 97,000 miles I became aware of oil in the air intake but it was then only a minor irritation, cleaning the MAF sensor sorted it. By 140,000 miles the amount of oil in the pipework to the MAF sensor was becoming alarming although it only caused a misfire and was solved again by cleaning.
Examination of the air filter housing showed the oil was entering the system from the Crankcase Breather System.

My understanding of the Crankcase Breather System:-
It operates in two modes, an upper partload to full load system and an idle to upper partload system.

The idle to upper partload system works directly off the crankcase and feeds into the cylinder head just before the inlet valves. The high load system from the cylinder head cover feeds into the air filter housing AFTER the the filter element.

The highload system is mounted on the cylinder head cover and consists of a black plastic oil separator and three hoses,it is very accessible and cheap to replace all components. Beware, get the parts first as the hoses are brittle with age and at least one will probably break. Changing all this did not solve my problem although it was clear that the oil was coming from here!

Conclusion - idle to upper partload system was blocked and forcing the highload system to accept the oil residue at low airflows.

The lower load system is hidden under the inlet manifold and consists of an oil separator built into the crankcase with a hose leading to a valve and tee-piece which in turn leads via two small bore hoses into two brass restricter nozzles in the cylinder head just before the inlet valves. The valve is spring loaded and NOT (in my case) the electric valve suggested in earlier replies. This system was blocked on my car and causing the problem.

After replacing all of it the problem seems, after a further 1000 miles, to be sorted.

Part numbers were:-
Main hose - MA111 018 15 82
Valve/Tee-Piece complete - MA111 010 00 91
2 small bore hoses - MA 002 094 01 82
2 Nozzles MA202 270 33 96

Again the hoses were brittle with age so order before disturbing them.
The nozzles have a very small bore but are a press fit in the head so unless the head is off best to just poke them through. They are only 97p each so order them anyway in case.

I would strongly suggest the Kompressor outlet pipework and intercooler is cleaned as well as a lot of oil could be lying here and still cause problems even after the breather systems have been renewed."

To conclude, oil contamination of the MAF sensor is NOT a sympom of kompressor failure.

Jim

glad you typed that, spot on. i also move the breather/ vac line from the rocker cover breather.

 

[Balal]

Dejavu!!!
CLKs (230 Kom) seems to have this problem alot...many threads about it ...jimsinessex's solution is the way to go ..... i think they should include this solution in owners manual

 

[philharve]

This thread surfaced again as a link about misfiring W208 CLK Kompressors and is perpetuating the myth that oil in the air intake system points to a kompressor failure. IT DOES NOT, the only oil in the komp is a small amount in the sealed gear chamber. There is no external oil supply to the kompressor so this cannot be the source of oil contamination of the air intake and more importantly the MAF sensor. Both dealers and indies must have made fortunes over the past few years replacing kompressors unnecessarily at our expense.

Oil in the air intake of high mileage, early C class and CLK class compressors is due to a failure of the low load to upper part load crankcase breather system located under the intake manifold.

The following is my submission on the cause and solution to the problem which worked for me. Since writing this I have done a further 40,000 miles with no more oil in air intake problems.

"The following applies specifically to my car, a 1999 CLK 230k Coupe with a 208347 chassis no. and a 111975 engine, I believe the info applies to all 202 C class and 208 CLK class kompressor engines.
At 97,000 miles I became aware of oil in the air intake but it was then only a minor irritation, cleaning the MAF sensor sorted it. By 140,000 miles the amount of oil in the pipework to the MAF sensor was becoming alarming although it only caused a misfire and was solved again by cleaning.
Examination of the air filter housing showed the oil was entering the system from the Crankcase Breather System.

My understanding of the Crankcase Breather System:-
It operates in two modes, an upper partload to full load system and an idle to upper partload system.

The idle to upper partload system works directly off the crankcase and feeds into the cylinder head just before the inlet valves. The high load system from the cylinder head cover feeds into the air filter housing AFTER the the filter element.

The highload system is mounted on the cylinder head cover and consists of a black plastic oil separator and three hoses,it is very accessible and cheap to replace all components. Beware, get the parts first as the hoses are brittle with age and at least one will probably break. Changing all this did not solve my problem although it was clear that the oil was coming from here!

Conclusion - idle to upper partload system was blocked and forcing the highload system to accept the oil residue at low airflows.

The lower load system is hidden under the inlet manifold and consists of an oil separator built into the crankcase with a hose leading to a valve and tee-piece which in turn leads via two small bore hoses into two brass restricter nozzles in the cylinder head just before the inlet valves. The valve is spring loaded and NOT (in my case) the electric valve suggested in earlier replies. This system was blocked on my car and causing the problem.

After replacing all of it the problem seems, after a further 1000 miles, to be sorted.

Part numbers were:-
Main hose - MA111 018 15 82
Valve/Tee-Piece complete - MA111 010 00 91
2 small bore hoses - MA 002 094 01 82
2 Nozzles MA202 270 33 96

Again the hoses were brittle with age so order before disturbing them.
The nozzles have a very small bore but are a press fit in the head so unless the head is off best to just poke them through. They are only 97p each so order them anyway in case.

I would strongly suggest the Kompressor outlet pipework and intercooler is cleaned as well as a lot of oil could be lying here and still cause problems even after the breather systems have been renewed."

To conclude, oil contamination of the MAF sensor is NOT a sympom of kompressor failure.

Jim

Hi Jim

Have you an estimate of the cost of your solution compared with a kompressor replacement?

REGARDS

Phil

 

[jimsinessex]

Hi Jim

Have you an estimate of the cost of your solution compared with a kompressor replacement?

REGARDS

Phil

Phil,

To remove/replace inlet manifold and renew breather parts underneath was 4hrs labour + £20 for parts

A new Kompressor from MB was £1046 (inc VAT), the labour I think is about 2 1/2 hrs but this my estimate as my invoice included some other work I had done at the same time. Maybe someone in the trade can be more specific.

Remember if you go down the kompressor route and are wrong you will still have to do the breather.
Do the breather first as that will need doing on high mileage cars anyway so money is not wasted.
I still remain absolutely convinced that the kompressor is NOT the cause of oil in the air intake. My kompressor replacement was for other reasons and not connected with the oiling problem.

Jim

 

[Ultymate]

As Jim says the only oil present in the Eaton supercharger is in the small gearbox on the nose of the unit if it does leak it tends to leak outwards i.e. through the seal from behind the drive belt pulley, and even if it lost all it's oil internally there is insufficient oil to reach and contaminate the MAF, I think in total it holds around 6 or 7 fluid ounces

Sort your breather system!

 

[jamesmc]

As Jim says the only oil present in the Eaton supercharger is in the small gearbox on the nose of the unit if it does leak it tends to leak outwards i.e. through the seal from behind the drive belt pulley, and even if it lost all it's oil internally there is insufficient oil to reach and contaminate the MAF, I think in total it holds around 6 or 7 fluid ounces

Sort your breather system!

What's the method for checking the supercharger gearbox oil level and what type of oil?
If anyone knows I'd appreciate the input.

 

[jimsinessex]

Kompressor oil

There is a small bolt at the drive end of the kompressor which doubles as the oil filler and level check. It is clearly shown on the parts diagram at the Russian site. Look under "air cleaner" then "kompressor". It is item 11.

Unfortunately it is difficult to get to in situ without removing the kompressor discharge pipework and manifold. If there was any loss of oil it would leak outwards away from the kompressor body itself due to the positive pressure in the kompressor and show up as an oily film around the clutch.

I have no idea what oil is used. A firm called MagnaChargers.com in the States rebuild the M45 Eaton Supercharger for the US SLK which is very similar to the M45 used on the C and CLK class cars in europe. They may be able to identify the oil type.

SuperchargersOnline.com, also in the States have a useful exploded picture of the M45 on their website. Look under the "repair/rebuild" tab.

Jim

 

[jamesmc]

Jim

Thanks for the in depth reply and pointers on where to look for further assistance.

Much appreciated

.

 

[jamesmc]

Over at the SuperchargersOnline.com Forums.

Found this is response to someone asking how much oil and what type?

SC Oil:
GM part# 12345982;
Ford part# E9SZ-19577-A,
1 Oz bottle usually costs 8$ in US

2 Oz (+/-57gr) is usually enough to fully change oil in SC drive nose.

As for the validity of the information... not sure yet.
I'd like to find the official MB solution.
If I do I will add it.

 

[jamesmc]

As has been mentioned before... the research Jim (jiminessex) did on this was 1st class!

Just a small query on the part numbers quoted though.

I trotted off down to my local dealer yesterday... actually pulled up in our 1991 Renault Clio... I do that sometimes for amusement bacause I just like the looks you get at a MB dealer from the sales team when you arrive in a 16 year old Clio

Anyway...

Part numbers were:-
Main hose - MA111 018 15 82
Valve/Tee-Piece complete - MA111 010 00 91
2 small bore hoses - MA 002 094 01 82
2 Nozzles MA202 270 33 96

All of the above were fine except for the 2 Nozzles (MA202 270 33 96)
That number seems to be a line oil cooler hose of some sort.

For the Nozzles the number I settled on with my parts man was:

A 111 017 00 12 (.Nozzle, Part Load Breathing).

Shows as 2 fitted to the unit. I ordered them anyway as they were only just less that 2 Euros each.

Maybe if Jim sees this he can confirm one way or another.