Mot failure regulations.

[Xtractorfan]

just the read the last posts, surely if it fails a psv/taxi test, then the only restriction is that they cannot carry paying passengers or work? esp if it still has a valid mot or is less than 3 yrs old?

Yes true, but this is where the cops decided that it now wasn't insured, and subsequently impounded the car, it didn't matter if it was Mot'd until the end of the world....

 

[dieselman]

Yes true, but this is where the cops decided that it now wasn't insured, and subsequently impounded the car, it didn't matter if it was Mot'd until the end of the world....

Where they wrongly decided it was uninsured.

It was and still is insured, they were just ignorant of the rules.

 

[Quick Silver]

But aren't we talking about a PSV as opposed to an MOT..This vehicle was too young for an MOT, So in effect I would suspect that a PSV can be withdrawn at any infringement. I have known of cases where cars have been put off the road because they need washed and cleaned...Taxis.. I may add. and apparently it wasnt unknown for inspectors to even ask the drivers to clean up as well...

NO ! all hackney carriages have to have an MOT FROM 1 YEAR OLD PSV is something else and it now called PCV AND APPLIES TO VEHICLES WITH more than 8 seats other than the driver for hire and reward.
Taxi enforcement officers are employed by the local licensing Authority and are usually retired police officers, they have quite a lot of power and can issue summonses to taxi operators and the general public.
Yes taxis can be ordered off the road if they are dirty but that comes under compliance regulations
My taxis are spotless, allways have been and so is myself and driver. Allways a clean shirt and smart trousers or tailored shorts in summer.
Yes I know there are unkempt vehicles out there, I do have most of the trade publications so know what goes on.

To be fair to the drivers and taxi owners in my licensing area they are well kept both driver and vehicle.

 

[dieselman]

Having just been in exactly the situation described in the first post of this thread I thought it would be good to provide a definite conclusion.

As well as VOSA sending me an email to say the original MOT Certificate is still valid until the end date, it also says the same on the back of the failure notice.
"If you intend to use your vehicle on the road you should have it repaired without delay and have it retested before the existing test validity expires"

It also clearly states that you may drive the vehicle to or from an MOT test and to or from a place of repair.

I don't actually have an existing certificate as the car has been off the road for seven years.

As far as insurance goes, I insured this car this morning and made a special note of telling the insurer the situation regarding the car having no MOT, but taking it for one today. Their answer was that I am insured whatever once the policy is in force.

Unfortunately my car failed on a split steering gaiter and rear lights having earth contact problems, but they will be rectified by tomorrow evening and a pass will ensue soon.
DVLA have also said they will send me a V5 now and remove the scrapped marker...so all is looking good.

 

[Quick Silver]

Well got this back from the trade legal boffins today,

1. You CAN DRIVE A VEHICLE WITH NO MOT or a FAILURE to an MOT Station, YOUR INSURANCE WILL COVER YOU AS IT IS LEGALLY PERMISSABLE providing it is PREBOOKED.

2.You CANNOT drive FROM an MOT STATION with a FAILURE to a place of repair or home legally as you are KNOWINGLY driving a vehicle that does not meet VOSA Standards and therefore your insurance is void as the insurance Co will take the Easy way out in the event of an ACCIDENT, irrespective of whether you STILL A HAVE A VALID MOT OR NOT.

3. This type of offence is getting picked up more and more as it is recorded instantly now.

 

[The mallard]

Your insurance will not be void, but may be reduced to road traffic cover.
If an insurance company issue a certificate of motor insurance they are legally obliged to accept liability for basic road traffic cover, regardless of the condition of the driver or vehicle.They are aso entitled to then claim their costs from the driver, but you are insured to a minimum legal level,

 

[Alex M Grieve]

This is an interesting debate

given that hundreds of people every day must drive away from an MOT centre with a failure certificate.

Surely if doing so was illegal, the centre would give advice to that effect, the fail certificate would bear a prominent stern warning, and there would be large poster prominently displayed in the test centre, probably surrounded by entrepreneurial adverts from men with low loaders?

 

[Quick Silver]

given that hundreds of people every day must drive away from an MOT centre with a failure certificate.

Surely if doing so was illegal, the centre would give advice to that effect, the fail certificate would bear a prominent stern warning, and there would be large poster prominently displayed in the test centre, probably surrounded by entrepreneurial adverts from men with low loaders?

This type of offence is still picking up speed ,as its only in the last couple of months that the database has been updated instantly and similarly ANPR.
I would think it is less expensive to have the vehicle repaired than to get a profesional tow/lift/transport

A tow is suffice as long as the towing vehicle is providing the steering and braking I think.

 

[The mallard]

So what happens at the dedicated vehicle testing stations, includung lgv test stations with no repair facilities, I don't see rows of failed vehicles parked outside awaiting recovery.

 

[whitenemesis]

The advice in post #85 seems at odds with that from the directgov website

From the directgov website

"It is generally an offence to use on a public road, a vehicle of testable age that doesn’t have a current test certificate, except when:

• taking it to a test station for an MOT test booked in advance.
• bringing it away from a test station after it has failed the MOT test, to a place of repair.
• taking it to a place, by previous arrangement, where problems that caused the vehicle to fail its MOT test, can be repaired.
• bringing it away from a place where the problems with the vehicle have been repaired.

Even in the above circumstances you may still be prosecuted for driving an unroadworthy vehicle if it doesn’t comply with various regulations affecting its construction and use. Your car insurance may also be invalid."

 

[Alex M Grieve]

The advice in post #85 seems at odds with that from the directgov website

From the directgov website


"It is generally an offence to use on a public road, a vehicle of testable age that doesn’t have a current test certificate, except when:

• taking it to a test station for an MOT test booked in advance.
• bringing it away from a test station after it has failed the MOT test, to a place of repair.
• taking it to a place, by previous arrangement, where problems that caused the vehicle to fail its MOT test, can be repaired.
• bringing it away from a place where the problems with the vehicle have been repaired.

Even in the above circumstances you may still be prosecuted for driving an unroadworthy vehicle if it doesn’t comply with various regulations affecting its construction and use. Your car insurance may also be invalid."

Sadly it does not make for a very snappy poster!

 

[The mallard]

That is because the advice in post no 85 is incorrect, or possibly incorrectly quoted.

 

[Mic]

I do not claim to be knowledgeable in this area under discussion but it seems to me that there can be a substantial difference between MOT failure and unroadworthy.
Emissions failure hardly constitutes a reason not to be able to drive to a place of correction in that it would not be potentially dangerous. There could well be MOT failures when best advice is that the vehicle is potentially dangerous and should not be driven again on the public highway.
This is not a legal observation but one which asks......why cannot an MOT failure have more than one category with regard to whether or not the vehicle is SAFE to be driven to a place of correction? Maybe they do?

Mic

 

[Quick Silver]

"Knowingly drive" on the highway a vehicle that doesn't conform to "VOSA regulations"

This is where the smart arced Crown Prosecution Service will get you if you get picked up.

 

[Quick Silver]

So what happens at the dedicated vehicle testing stations, includung lgv test stations with no repair facilities, I don't see rows of failed vehicles parked outside awaiting recovery.

This is where the problem started, at least we have won the right to have our vehicles tested now at a place of our/my choosing ( This a local issue with local authority)

 

[Miffy]

Ok guys, I have a better understanding of the situation now.

I asked the police this question, and I received the following reply.


Mark
The original MOT has effect until it runs out which is why you can MOT your
car a month before . This gives you an overlap to cover this.
However it should be remembered that many of the faults for which the MOT
is failed would make it illegal to use the vehicle on a road in any case
regardless of whether there is an MOT.
Defectives tyres, steering, brakes, exhaust, lights etc would all make it
illegal to drive the vehicle on a road even when there is a current MOT.

www.askthe.police.uk


So, the original MOT still stands, subject to the fault not actually making the car un roadworthy. Theres a fine line here on what side your sitting, but I think the case is, your car has an MOT, but in most circumstances, it will be illegal to drive it.

 

[whitenemesis]

Thanks Mark, pretty much what directgov is saying on it's website. It matters very little really if one still has a valid MoT cert, if the ol' Bill spot you. Except now you don't have the excuse (never valid anyway) that you didn't know!!

 

[The mallard]

and then we can open the arguement about deferred tests and authorised Police examinations.
Application and interpretation of the law has to be practical and in the public interest

 

[Miffy]

I am trying to work out now what faults you could fail on, and still be legal to drive ?

I guess a blown indicator / sidelight would not get you nicked?

 

[The mallard]

Defective passenger seat belt ? It depends on the common sense of the Plod who stops you,some defects are regulation specific, then there are the 'catch all' regulations about all parts must be in a satisfactory condition, not likely to cause danger to any person type offence.
As i said before, the prosecuting authorities/courts generally apply the law in a practical manner, of course there are always exceptions.