Oil labelling explained

wrenchmoto2

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Is there really any material difference between the oil specs from BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Vauxhall, etc.?

Provided the engine oil is Fully synthetic, and of the right viscosity (ie 5W-30)

So the following specs, are they materially the same oil.

1) ACEA C3 , API SN, MB 229.31/229.51/229.52, BMW LL-04

2) ACEA C3 VW 504.00/507.00, Porsche C30.

And can I use say a LL-04 oil in a car that specifies say 507.00?
 

Bay Leaf

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identifying when oil has passed its use days

PSMart, you asked 'identifying when oil has passed its use days'

In the days before technology we used to drop a drip of oil from the dip stick in the middle of a piece of bog paper.

Then come back a bit later and look at the way the blob spread out.

We reckoned:

If



    • the stain spreads evenly the oils OK.
    • If there's a dark ring, somewhere on the stain, around the centre, you should have changed the oil by now.
It's called ring chromatography (annular planar chromatography).
It's a bit of a rough and ready guide.
But it's served me well for many years.
I think it's unwise to put the words bog paper and ring in the same sentence:D
 

Gazwould

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Is there really any material difference between the oil specs from BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Vauxhall, etc.?

Provided the engine oil is Fully synthetic, and of the right viscosity (ie 5W-30)

So the following specs, are they materially the same oil.

1) ACEA C3 , API SN, MB 229.31/229.51/229.52, BMW LL-04

2) ACEA C3 VW 504.00/507.00, Porsche C30.

And can I use say a LL-04 oil in a car that specifies say 507.00?


You could but 507.00 is the better for antiwear , widely available and not expensive as a VAG staple universal diet.

Material differences are hard to find out because their 'secret recipe'.

507.00 however does contain group 3 , 4 and 5 oil basestock groups .
 

wrenchmoto2

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You could but 507.00 is the better for antiwear

.
Is there any independent evidence to show that 507.00 spec oil has better anti-wear properties. Has it been proven.

Or is it just marketing hype to charge a higher price for the oil?

I would of thought Merc spec oil is as good as Audi spec oil.
 

Gazwould

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Not quite as good as VW spec because of the high anti wear needed for the PD camshafts that see high loadings due to their narrow camshaft lobes because of room taken up by the wider unit injector lobes .

Here's 504.00 507.00 Vs the older spec 505.01 .

54a6a7cs-960.jpg
 

Gazwould

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All things relative..

On another entities scale the two oils are respective.

20200624_230158.jpg



20200624_230629.jpg



MB
20200802_191538.jpg



VW 504.00 507.00 is the more complete oil and is the families cars staple diet .
 
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Bay Leaf

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I've changed the oil and filter (using a Mann filter ) about 1000 mls ago. But I used 229.3 rather than 229.5 Will this be detrimental to the engine and should I drain it out and put in 229.5
 

Gazwould

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229.3 is definitely a lesser spec .

20201005_181227.jpg

20201005_181149.jpg
 

Bay Leaf

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Thank you. But what I can't get to the bottom of is will it do any harm to my engine. I'm grateful for the graphs.
 
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Gazwould

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You should never put a lesser oil in , but you can go higher...

I'd treat it as a short term flush .
 

gredonsax

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This is a very useful information. Thanks for sharing. But I'll like to add that like regular oil, synthetic oil is made from refined crude mineral oils and is comprised of a base oil, powder additives, and a carrier oil. When comparing the two, the main difference between them is the amount of refining involved. Synthetic oil is refined, distilled, purified, and deconstructed at the molecular level. This level of refinement gives it several advantages over conventional oils.
 
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O

oilman

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  • Thread Starter
  • Thread starter
  • #155
Not all synthetic oils are made from hydrocracked mineral base oil, group IV synthetics have to have a PAO base and whilst I agree the bulk on the market are Group III or Group III+ it is not all of them and there is quite a difference between the two.

Cheers,

Guy
 

Blobcat

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Found the below earlier today, some useful info on MB Specification fluids - You can click on the ">" on the right side of the page to get more info on them :)

 

mercmancdi

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Oil again // I have surplus of 2 oils in attached photos. Want to do change on 2017 2,2 d gls start stop 4 matic. Engine M651 R4-DIESEL.
I assume either is ok but is 229/51 better option as I change every 5000 mls BUT which is best.
Advise please , forgive if asked before can’t find it. 1st and last photos are the Castrol start stop 2nd and 3rd are cheaper brand .
Thanks.
 

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mercmancdi

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If it doesnt say meets MB 229.xxx...... Then. I dont use it.
I’ll prob use the 229 one suitable it states on LL04 for bmw / Mercedes’ etc. although does not name start stop and it’s cheaper brand than the castrol.
it’s just I have 15-20 ltrs of each and don’t want to buy more oil if avoidable at the minute.
 


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