Refusal of a refund for £3,100

[curly]

Hi.

I’m not sure if this is the right place or if it is of interest, but I bought a Smart car a few weeks ago that had a 12 months MOT put on it two days before it was delivered to me from Great Yarmouth, I believe the MOT was clearly fraudulent, I messaged the dealer who took it back, once it was in his possession he refused to give me a refund.
This is not the same fortwo I have bought since.

 

[ajlsl600]

Do you have invoice and proof of payment? If so go to ur local police station

 

[DSK]

As it’s a dealer it’s great news and sadly he’s playing the usual game most do which is wave 2 fingers at you hoping you’ll disappear and feel he is entitled to perform day light robbery!

Sadly there is such a thing called the consumer rights act and the law.

First thing I would do is as suggested, record this with the police as, he has your money and also the car back, it’s theft.

Immediately after I would say contact trading standards and get it logged with them who will offer you the right advice. Usually the next step may be a short letter quoting the trading standards and police references but, I think best to go direct to a solicitor and get them to send something official.

Cheeky fookaz these car dealers!

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[Blobcat]

As per above, police, trading standards and small claims / solicitor.

If any payment made (even a deposit) on credit card they will also help.

 

[curly]

I have the bill of sale on his headed invoice paper, with my name, address and the card payment receipt on it in full.

I have the green slip from the dealer that I taxed the car with so the car should be in my name now, even though I have not received the new V5C.

I have the new [fraudulent] 12 months MOT.

He said he was not going to give me a refund unless he has all the paperwork as above.

So he has had both the car and my money since 22nd August.

As regards theft, I think he will press the point that he wants the paperwork back as part of the return of the car even though they are only copies of what he has already.

I did speak with Citizens Advice, they took the details and sent them to Trading Standards, as I understand it, but the police were not mentioned.

I have not received the new V5C, I suspect that he has already contacted DVLA for a replacement V5C that may have cancelled the one for me by default.

Pictures attached.

 

[Rotorhead500]

Perhaps a call to the DVLA too? (With the green slip to hand).

 

[DSK]

Hmm not sure about the v5 but, if you have paid and he has the car and the V5 was applied for, chances are that the V5 will have to come to you via process, and you then hand that to the dealer.

You mention the dodgy MOT and whilst I do not doubt you, what is the proof or evidence that it’s dodgy/questionable? - ignore this I just saw the post with the pictures!

Clearly such faults were present at point of sale and as a result they are the dealers problem, not yours.


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[Frontstep]

I don't think its as clear cut as assumed.
He surely can be given what he has asked for can't he?
You can take copies.

 

[DSK]

Even if he was reasonable he could give you all but say £500 back until he has the V5.

I’d also write a Google review just sticking to the facts to help others avoid this con artist trader.


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[davidsl500]

Might be worth a call to VOSA about the fraudulent MOT as well.

 

[00slk]

As Above, clearly these were missed by an incompetent MoT inspector, VOSA love these people
Maybe it was a phone through MoT?
You should be able to see who has issued the MoT with a green slip document number, not sure which number but one of them will gain you access to the garage who carried out the inspection, presuming it was inspected??

 

[ajlsl600]

I have the bill of sale on his headed invoice paper, with my name, address and the card payment receipt on it in full.

I have the green slip from the dealer that I taxed the car with so the car should be in my name now, even though I have not received the new V5C.

I have the new [fraudulent] 12 months MOT.

He said he was not going to give me a refund unless he has all the paperwork as above.

So he has had both the car and my money since 22nd August.

As regards theft, I think he will press the point that he wants the paperwork back as part of the return of the car even though they are only copies of what he has already.

I did speak with Citizens Advice, they took the details and sent them to Trading Standards, as I understand it, but the police were not mentioned.

I have not received the new V5C, I suspect that he has already contacted DVLA for a replacement V5C that may have cancelled the one for me by default.

Pictures attached.

If ur sure on mot. Contact mot people and advise them. Keep good copies of all paperwork. If mot is fake fraudulent I wud say they will soon sort that out. Also advise police of same. Then ask them to go to car place with you and sort it out .

 

[ajlsl600]

Dump car with dealer. Get ur cash back. N. Then leave relevant authorities to sort situation.

 

[malcolm E53 AMG]

Did you pay with a credit card/bank card if so ring them up and they will sort the money side of things out for you? They have a lot of leverage on companies for obvious reasons

 

[peterws1957]

I doubt very much that the Police would have any interest in this. A couple of thoughts how soon did the EML light come on after you took delivery? Did you check the MOT history of the car before purchase? I find it hard to believe that the condition of the engine mount deteriorated so much between MOTs.

 

[curly]

Thank you guys, lots of good and helpful advice here,

I could not find a suitable number for DVLA so I have written to them now.

The reason I say my V5C may have been overtaken by default by the dealer is that the V5C for the second smart car I bought, two weeks after the faulty one, arrived last week, but I have not received the V5C for the first one, the faulty one.

Yes the faults must have been known about by the dealer and certainly by the MOT tester if indeed it had a test.

On my first drive of the car I knew immediately there was a number of serious problems, I was so suspicious that I drove it to my nearest MOT station, they took a cursory look at the car and said there was no point in a test because it would not pass from what they could see in situ, some of the faults they found are as below.
1. The engine was loose and rattled.
2. The brakes were ineffective and you had to stand on the brake peddle just to slow the car down.
3. The engine management light was on and never went off.
4. Underneath, the engine mount insert was split and all but gone.
5. There was a foreign piece of metal tube poorly welded up to form part of the faulty exhaust.
6. Some of the front lights were not working.
7. Clunking in the front, most likely to be broken springs and or associated parts.
8. The noise from the exhaust was the loudest he has heard from a Smart car.

The dealer and I both have the same paperwork in our respective possessions, I believe the case is that he is trying to remove any evidence of what he has done.

I did talk with ebay where I saw the listing but they say they can do nothing to assist.

I will call VOSA.

I cannot go to the dealer, they are in Great Yarmouth and I live in Plymouth, the dealer has already said “see you in court in Norfolk”.

I did pay with a credit card over the phone goods unseen, the company are looking into it, but they say nothing is certain, they are taking a long time and keep asking for information I have given to them a number of times already.

 

[curious]

I did pay with a credit card over the phone goods unseen, the company are looking into it, but they say nothing is certain, they are taking a long time and keep asking for information I have given to them a number of times already.

The credit card company are equally liable as the vendor. You are perfectly at liberty to go after who you think may yield the better result for less effort. Given the vendor's response I would push through on the credit card. They may say you have to exhaust all avenues with the vendor first, etc. Not true. There's no precedence with this.

 

[ajlsl600]

Aggro always I just paid 2780 for a camera d850 still not seen after 9 days originally told 2, 4 days and still no tracking info provided.

 

[rf065]

I will call VOSA.

I heard a similiar story last week, as soon as VOSA became involved, the offending garage was straight round to the guys house offering every penny of his money back if he withdrew his complaint to VOSA.

 

[tpn]

have the bill of sale on his headed invoice paper, with my name, address and the card payment receipt on it in full.

I have the green slip from the dealer that I taxed the car with so the car should be in my name now, even though I have not received the new V5C.

I have the new [fraudulent] 12 months MOT.

He said he was not going to give me a refund unless he has all the paperwork as above.

So he has had both the car and my money since 22nd August.

Are you saying that he will return your money on receipt of the documentation outlined above?

If that is so, why will you not go to the dealer with the documentation (keep a copy of course), bring a witness or two with you and simultaneously exchange the documentation for the money? obviously he wants to get back the "fraudulently" presented MOT to destroy that evidence.

OK, it is nearly 400 miles but he is playing on your reluctance to travel.

Stride couriers deliver documents, but I do not know if they would collect money on delivery.

A debt collection agency may deliver the documents and collect the money for you.

You could get a charge back on your card.
Lots of options, recovery of your money should be your first priority and exposure of the fraud can wait until later.