squealing, tyre rubbing

[flagstaff]

a few weeks ago i had my e220 coupe into the local indy to have springs and shockers replaced. now i'm getting a squeal from the offside when i turn the wheel, along with vibration felt through the track rods and shocks, and on inspection it appears that the tyre is rubbing on the shocker (paint worn off shocker, marks on tyre) ... anyone any ideas?

if nothing else, i want to be armed with as much info as i can when i go back to the indy.

 

[clive williams]

a few weeks ago i had my e220 coupe into the local indy to have springs and shockers replaced. now i'm getting a squeal from the offside when i turn the wheel, along with vibration felt through the track rods and shocks, and on inspection it appears that the tyre is rubbing on the shocker (paint worn off shocker, marks on tyre) ... anyone any ideas?

if nothing else, i want to be armed with as much info as i can when i go back to the indy.

I can't see how this can have happened with a spring and shocker replacement?? Are the marks on the tyre consistantly around the circumference? If its in only one place then I would have said that the wheel was not mounted on the hub properly, which would have cerainly accounted for the rubbing and vibration. When you checked it did you take the wheel off - if so then you might now have put the wheel back on properly!

W124s use the central hole to centre the wheel on the hub. If the wheel and/or the hub is corroded then seating it can be a pain. I always apply a small smear of coperslip to the hub to prevent that.

Have you tried to see how the wheel is rubbing? Jack the car up with a bottle jack under the suspension arm and spin the wheel. This should direct you to the cause.

Clive

500E
E320CDIT210

 

[television]

I have been thinking about this one this morning, and like you Clive I cant see how it can happen, the wheel fulcrums around the shock obsorber, so cant make any difference going lock to lock, I cant think of how you could do it wrong.

Malcolm

 

[clive williams]

I have been thinking about this one this morning, and like you Clive I cant see how it can happen, the wheel fulcrums around the shock obsorber, so cant make any difference going lock to lock, I cant think of how you could do it wrong.

Malcolm

Hi Malcolm, my only thought was that the wheel was not seated on the hub properly so that once every revolution the top of the wheel would lean in rubbing on the shocker and effectively lean out when it moved around 180 degs. That would give a wobbling sensation, which would translate to a vibration at speed. I suspect the wobble would not be noticeable at slow speed. On most macpherson style suspensions the tyre is quite close to the strut so any mis-seating would result in the rubbing.

Clive

500E
E320CDIT210

 

[Sprint'n'Go]

I have done a bit of head scratching on this problem too. If the wheel wasn't mounted on the hub straight wont the car be almost undrivable above about 20mph?

The only other possibility I can think of is that the top of the strut has been turned during re-assembley. depending on how many bolts secure it into the turret this could either be by 90 deg, 180 deg or 120 deg. I am not familiar with the car but it could be a possibility and worth looking at?

Thinking a little more if it was 120 deg out this could account for the rubbing on lock and probably only one way or the other.

 

[markmerc]

Are your wheel bearings any good? Have you had tracking done lately? Especially toe in ,toe out:?

 

[television]

Here is the lay out.
http://www.detali.ru/cat/oem_mb2.as...GM=717.413&CT=F&cat=15T&SID=32&SGR=015&SGN=01

malcolm

 

[flagstaff]

thanks for your input, guys. yeah, the whole thing was baffling me also. when i took the wheel off, all bolts seemed torqued up normally. and of course i always take care to reseat the wheel correctly when refitting. as to whether this was done at the indy, i couldn't say. the car tracks slightly (very slightly) to the left, but every merc i've had has had this to some degree or other, so i didn't think it was an issue. the marks on the tyre are not consistent or regular, quite erratic in fact. they do go round the whole circumference, though, in a kind of spidery untidy way. the car has only just passed its MOT, couple of weeks back, so i'm guessing that bearings etc cannot be the cause. it's really got me stumped. anyway, it's going back into be looked at early next week, so i'll post back with what the indy reports.

 

[kth286]

Clive

Mercedes of that era did not use Macpherson type suspension.

It is a strut with seperate spring system.

Flagstaff

Did you have shorter springs installed to lower the car. Is the car now lower anyway ?

I ask this because I suspect it is the camber angle of the wheel that is causing rubbing when the wheel is turned.

The reason is that Mercedes have an unusually high castor angle which causes massive changes in wheel camber when the front wheels are turned.

If you look, you will notice on full lock how the top of one front wheel is leaning outwards whilst the other front wheel is leaning inwards.

If you have lowered the suspension this will be exacerbated.

Also if you have non standard wheels with the wrong offset (ET) this again will adversely exagerate the position.

Regards

Regards

 

[clive williams]

Clive

Mercedes of that era did not use Macpherson type suspension.

It is a strut with seperate spring system.

Regards

Regards

David,

I picked my words carefully. I said Macpherson style suspension, by which I mean that the hub is attached to the suspension strut that rotates with steering input. The difference between a true Macpherson strut and the MB supension we are discussing is that the spring is separated from the strut and therefore does not rotate with the strut.

I do take your point about the lowering springs but when the springs and shockers were replaced the whole assembly should have been aligned to comply with manf. figures and ought to have been if carried out by a competent fitter.

Clive

500E
E320CDIT210

 

[flagstaff]

Did you have shorter springs installed to lower the car. Is the car now lower anyway ? I ask this because I suspect it is the camber angle of the wheel that is causing rubbing when the wheel is turned.

No - standard springs and shocks. i did, however, expect that the new parts would cure the car's tendency to appear to be leaning back on its rear ... and this has not happened. am going to raise this issue as well as the above with the indy when the car goes in on tuesday.

 

[flagstaff]

update: strange - it's stopped making the noise. everything just sounds normal. typical, when it's just about to be looked at by a garage.

 

[Sprint'n'Go]

update: strange - it's stopped making the noise. everything just sounds normal. typical, when it's just about to be looked at by a garage.

I believe this is called SOD'S LAW or sometimes MURPHY'S LAW and usually occurs when you have sworn blind that you know what you are talking about and called everyone else complete imbiciles :Oops: .

Could it have been a spring not sat correctly which has reseated with use?

 

[flagstaff]

latest breaking news. so the car went to the indy the other day. i said, Sorry - but it's stopped making the noise .... but could you check it anyway? he's a good guy, and did a full check over (for nothing, i might add). result? nothing amiss. i wonder if the first few replies to the orginal post were correct, and the wheel was simply put on wrongly (last person to put on the wheel would have been the indy, so i guess the free check isn't so much of a bonus).

thing is, though: i took off the wheels to see if i could find the source of the noise, and without the wheels the noise was still there (if anything, in fact, worse) ... so the noise couldn't have had anything to do with the presence of the wheels in the equation (if that is an equation).

all seems well at the moment, so i can't complain .... but still. think i might take the wheels off again soon and see what gives; don't want that old thing to be still getting rubbed away. damn car. i do love it though. perhaps more than is justified by its essential lack of emotional feedback.