W126 problems SOLVED !

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jacob@senderovitz.dk

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Please find enclosed what appears to be the solution to some problems, that I have been having for almost 4 months with my 260 SE, during which time I have not dared drive the car on a dayli basis, from the fear of it not being quite in a healthy state.

The car:
260 SE (W126), produced November 1985 (the 1986 model). 290.000 kilometers.

The problems/symptoms:
After having run for 15-30 kilometers, the car would start to play tricks on me. It would not react to gas being given; instead of accelerating, it would kind of “cough” and not really react. After this had happened a couple of times (almost always when waiting for a green light at a busy intersection !), it would die completely, and not be easy to start up again.
Another problem was when standing still in “P” or “D” with the brake applied, the engine would start to run unevenly, and eventually start to shake quite a bit, and subsequently die alltogether.

What did I do ?:
As I did not feel I had the time to DIY diagnose and resolve, I sent the car off to the official MB garage. They had it in twice, without resolving the problem.
I then sent the car off to an unofficial MB-specialist shop, who also had it twice. They were also not able to resolve the problem.
During these 4 visits, a large number of hours were spent ($$$), and a lot of components replaced.
Apparently they all had problems reproducing the problem, so they believed it to be fixed every time, they had replaced a component…….

What was done to the car, and which components replaced ?

1) The O-rings around the injection valve-holders were replaced. (did not resolve).
2) Spark plugs, ignition cords, ignition coil (I think the term is) were replaced. (did not resolve).
3) A valve which is part of the fuel-evaporation system was replaced. (did not resolve).

I then had a talk with a third MB-specialist, as well as reading some posts on this forum, which proposed to me that I replace a couple of items, which had not yet been replaced. I purchased these items, and installed them myself.

The following items were replaced:

a. Air filter [003 094 54 04]
b. Active charcoal filter [124 470 03 59] (sitting behind the left front wing)
c. The over voltage relay for the fuel pump [201 540 08 45]
d. 2 sensors located on the engine block (I believe they give data to the injection system on coolant temperature) [they are located at the top of the block, at the rear of the engine], and the temperature sensor, sitting at the pipe which leads air into the air filter. [005 542 10 17, 006 542 77 17, 007 542 21 17]
e. I also replaced the coolant water.
f. I also drilled a very small hole in the gas-filler cap, because very often a vacuum would build up in the tank, which appeared to be somewhat excessive.

The car now works OK again, and I have started to use it regularly on a dayli basis :razz:

I hope that the above can help someone, who may have the same problems.

Brgds Jacob
 

anyweb

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thanks Jacob for the excellent documentation and detective work, I'm sure it'll help others !

cheers
anyweb
 

television

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Great feedback, and thank you for posting it, also welcome to the forum. The joke is that the bits you replaced don't cost that much.

As time goes on and engineers snuff it, it does get hard to find someone who can fix them, so often the faults are Basics
 

kth286

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Brgds Jacob

Good description, but my immediate question is, so what was the real problem and what was the real solution ????????????

You should always do one repair item and test, before doing a second repair
item, because otherwise you cannot really know what the fix was.

Please buy yourself a new petrol filler cap as they must be sealed and can be an MOT failure if not properly sealed. (Assuming in UK) It is a closed circuit evaporation emissions system via the charcoal filter.

The problem sounded like some sort of fuel starvation or the contents of the charcoal canister were being fed into the inlet manifiold whilst the car was idling which it should not have been. The contents of the charcoal canister should only be fed back to the engine when the engine is above a certain revs to stop it stalling and exhibiting symptoms such as yours.

So it sounds as if it was connected to the petrol emissions system failure, possibly due to a combination of blocked charcoal canister (which you changed) and the replacement of the valve within this circuit (which the dealer changed).

Where are you based as I was not aware that engine was available in the 126 cars I thought they started at 3 litres sizes.
 
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television

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Just to say that it was good that Kth286 pointed out the fuel cap, you can of coarse put a self tapping screw in the hole or seal it by other means.
 
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jacob@senderovitz.dk

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Brgds Jacob

Good description, but my immediate question is, so what was the real problem and what was the real solution ????????????

You should always do one repair item and test, before doing a second repair
item, because otherwise you cannot really know what the fix was.

Please buy yourself a new petrol filler cap as they must be sealed and can be an MOT failure if not properly sealed. (Assuming in UK) It is a closed circuit evaporation emissions system via the charcoal filter.

The problem sounded like some sort of fuel starvation or the contents of the charcoal canister were being fed into the inlet manifiold whilst the car was idling which it should not have been. The contents of the charcoal canister should only be fed back to the engine when the engine is above a certain revs to stop it stalling and exhibiting symptoms such as yours.

So it sounds as if it was connected to the petrol emissions system failure, possibly due to a combination of blocked charcoal canister (which you changed) and the replacement of the valve within this circuit (which the dealer changed).

Where are you based as I was not aware that engine was available in the 126 cars I thought they started at 3 litres sizes.


Hi kth286

You are of course correct, that one should only replace 1 component at a time. But I have to admit, that since the last many months have been one array of towings to the garage(s), replacement of items, etc etc I was at a point where I was getting a bit fed up (understatement) - thats why all the last components were replaced in one go :)

Concerning the engine size, I too have noticed that there are relatively few 2,6 liters W126 around. I live in Denmark, where I know of a few 2,6 in operation. In Germany (where I bought my spare-parts W126) the 2,6 liter is/was also faily normal.

I am considering trying to put a gas filler cap back on the car, without a hole in it - just to see if problems arise or not. However, I think I will wait a bit, and savour the joy of my now functioning car !! (I have just had the car "Synet" [The Danish MOT equivalent], so it will be a while before I have to make it 100% legit again). What kind of vacuum should one expect in the gas tank ?

Brgds Jacob
 
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jacob@senderovitz.dk

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Great feedback, and thank you for posting it, also welcome to the forum. The joke is that the bits you replaced don't cost that much.

As time goes on and engineers snuff it, it does get hard to find someone who can fix them, so often the faults are Basics

Hi Television,

You are quite right. The bits cost me about the equivalent of 2 MB-mechanic hours at the MB garage...... The MB garage BTW has 40 mechanics working there. Only 3 of them know the W126 model......

I read in a magazine the other day, that you should preferably know an MB mechanic, who was born BEFORE 1960, if you intend to run a W126 :D

Brgds Jacob
 

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560 Fuel Starvation

I have a 560 SEL which will start and run well up to 40 mph when it will hunt and surge and try to stall.

We have:
overhauled the fuel distributor.
New plugs .leads/ dizzie etc (not coil).

New twin pumps and filter.

I have disconnected the linkeage to the cruise control actuator also,.

Does this sound like a fuel or electrical problem?

Is the fuel pump relay responsible for fuel delivery beyond at starting.?

KE control unit possibly at fault?

Help
 

r129co

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Could the internal strainer in the tank be at fault?
 

television

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The correct fuel pump relay is important, do check the number on it, they all look the same but your fault is consistent with one that I worked on where the wrong one was fitted.
 

r129co

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Thanks Malcolm...they have a role in engine performance on the road then.
..not just when starting?
 

television

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Thanks Malcolm...they have a role in engine performance on the road then.
..not just when starting?

Yes they are the engine speed limiter as well, the car that I had here was missing and cutting out at 3krpm or under.
 

Yuhang

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Hello Jacob,

Thank you for sharing the information and experience on your 126.

I too recently have very similar situation on me 126 and got towed to the garage, however it has been running fine and it is just serviced a week before.

with 6 months old parts I have done on it and I still have no idea why it is having the same problem as yours.
Parts that are not older than 6months below:
ignition coil
spark plugs
fuel filter
fuel pump
fuel cap
air filter

If you or anyone have any thoughts please leave a comment. really hope I will be able to sort it out with your knowledge.
I am new here by the way, Hello everyone. :)
Huge thanks in advance.

cheers,
Ian
 

LostKiwi

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Most of the thread contributors haven't been seen for at least 12 months..... This is a 6 year old thread after all!

That said, welcome and start with the basics....a basic service.
So plugs, air filter and fuel filter.
Remove the distributor cap, inspect for cracks, spray liberally with WD40 and wipe out. Some cars are known to suffer condensation in the distributor that gives a 'hard' misfire after a few minutes running eventually causing the car to stall.

Next step would be check ignition leads - if they are old they can break down giving poor spark (you can also check spark using an old spark plug - connect the lead to the plug and rest the metal body against the metal parts of the engine, crank and look for a regular bright blue spark).

If you haven't already done so check the fuel pump relay as mentioned above.
 
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Flyinspanner

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Any model, if it cuts out after a few miles, but starts again after a while....

Next time it happens, go take your fuel cap off.... if there is a lot of vacuum, (Whoosh- as you take cap off), try the car, if it works, drive it for a while with the cap off, if it’s ok, it may be best to check out your fuel tank breather system also buy a new cap. (They are designed to allow air to be drawn in).

if the breather system is blocked, excess vacuum builds in the tank, and the fuel pump cannot draw fuel,......your car dies after a few miles....whilst you are sat scratching your head, and waiting the AA, pressure drops, and you can get going for a while again.

it can lead mechanics to suspect an electrical component “failing” when the car is up to temp. But they can’t replicate at tickover when warm, as the demand is much less.

hope this helps someone
 

star

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Back to basics,
You need to check to see if you have a fuel or spark, then follow down the missing line.
 

Yuhang

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Most of the thread contributors haven't been seen for at least 12 months..... This is a 6 year old thread after all!

That said, welcome and start with the basics....a basic service.
So plugs, air filter and fuel filter.
Remove the distributor cap, inspect for cracks, spray liberally with WD40 and wipe out. Some cars are known to suffer condensation in the distributor that gives a 'hard' misfire after a few minutes running eventually causing the car to stall.

Next step would be check ignition leads - if they are old they can break down giving poor spark (you can also check spark using an old spark plug - connect the lead to the plug and rest the metal body against the metal parts of the engine, crank and look for a regular bright blue spark).

If you haven't already done so check the fuel pump relay as mentioned above.
Hello lostkiwi,
Thank you very much for your reply.
I will follow your opinion to do a check up with my guys in the garage.
Appreciate!!!!
cheers,
Ian
 

Yuhang

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Any model, if it cuts out after a few miles, but starts again after a while....

Next time it happens, go take your fuel cap off.... if there is a lot of vacuum, (Whoosh- as you take cap off), try the car, if it works, drive it for a while with the cap off, if it’s ok, it may be best to check out your fuel tank breather system also buy a new cap. (They are designed to allow air to be drawn in).

if the breather system is blocked, excess vacuum builds in the tank, and the fuel pump cannot draw fuel,......your car dies after a few miles....whilst you are sat scratching your head, and waiting the AA, pressure drops, and you can get going for a while again.

it can lead mechanics to suspect an electrical component “failing” when the car is up to temp. But they can’t replicate at tickover when warm, as the demand is much less.

hope this helps someone
Hello Flyinspanner,
Appreciate for you comment mate!
It actually ran for a 1xx km after the normal service, and got to a choking-to-stop situation. and once it got towed-and-relax for about 35mins. got it started right the way after a short period of cooling down.
I will take your advice and go through the car again.
Again, thank you for your information.
thank you,
Ian
 

Yuhang

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Back to basics,
You need to check to see if you have a fuel or spark, then follow down the missing line.
Hello Star,
Thank you very much for your reply and information.
I will take a look according to your opinion with me guys this weekend.
cheers,
Ian
 


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