A few words of warning about Insurance and Repairs

[drmw]

Buy the cheapest insurance and in case of a crash just use the damn approved repairer...life's too short and the different possible outcomes in the minefield that is insurance/repairers is too abstract to comprehend.

Doh!

I think you would bother, when the repair is sh*te

Were I more of a cynic I could believe your exchanges were part of an elaborate marketing plan for an insurance company.

The bottom line however is that virtually every one of your posts is entirely bereft of substantiable fact (indeed, any fact at all - only your opinion) and would not support that belief.

 

[Shezbo]

Someone in this thread said that we should all drive slower and or safer....Aviva have just launched this -

Aviva tests new RateMyDrive app
Tuesday, 14 August 2012
Motorists are being invited to help shape and develop a new driving app which could earn them a discount of up to 20% on their motor insurance.
Aviva is using smartphone technology to create individual driver profiles, which will be used to calculate tailored pay-how-you-drive premiums.
The driver behavioural app, Aviva RateMyDrive, will monitor motorists taking part in the test for 200 miles, including acceleration, braking andcornering. The data is then turned into an individual score which helps determine the motorist’s premium – with safer drivers earning up to 20% off their Aviva premium. The discounts are in addition to any other Aviva offers for which they are eligible.
Steve Treloar, Aviva’s retail director, said: We believe this innovative use of smartphone technology will benefit all safe drivers, regardless of age or gender.
‘Unlike traditional black box telematics solutions, Aviva RateMyDrive app only needs a small amount of data – typically 200 miles – to create an individual driver profile. And because the app is free to download and uses the customer’s own smartphone, there is no need for motorists to have a black box installed in their car.
‘For those who complete the RateMyDrive app trial, we will provide feedback on their driving and a quote – including any discount earned from safer driving – should they wish to take out Aviva insurance.
‘And while safer drivers could receive a discount up to 20%, we won’t penalise other drivers if their driving doesn’t come up to the standard set by the app. They’ll just receive the standard premium but won’t get a discount.’

This is how insurance will be written in the future, what it does not say here is that, any accident that occurs the insurance company will manage (away from you?) and into their network. So this is both good (rewards safety and bad - IMHO)

 

[Alex M Grieve]

Someone in this thread said that we should all drive slower and or safer....Aviva have just launched this -

Aviva tests new RateMyDrive app
Tuesday, 14 August 2012
Motorists are being invited to help shape and develop a new driving app which could earn them a discount of up to 20% on their motor insurance.
Aviva is using smartphone technology to create individual driver profiles, which will be used to calculate tailored pay-how-you-drive premiums.
The driver behavioural app, Aviva RateMyDrive, will monitor motorists taking part in the test for 200 miles, including acceleration, braking andcornering. The data is then turned into an individual score which helps determine the motorist’s premium – with safer drivers earning up to 20% off their Aviva premium. The discounts are in addition to any other Aviva offers for which they are eligible.
Steve Treloar, Aviva’s retail director, said: We believe this innovative use of smartphone technology will benefit all safe drivers, regardless of age or gender.
‘Unlike traditional black box telematics solutions, Aviva RateMyDrive app only needs a small amount of data – typically 200 miles – to create an individual driver profile. And because the app is free to download and uses the customer’s own smartphone, there is no need for motorists to have a black box installed in their car.
‘For those who complete the RateMyDrive app trial, we will provide feedback on their driving and a quote – including any discount earned from safer driving – should they wish to take out Aviva insurance.
‘And while safer drivers could receive a discount up to 20%, we won’t penalise other drivers if their driving doesn’t come up to the standard set by the app. They’ll just receive the standard premium but won’t get a discount.’

This is how insurance will be written in the future, what it does not say here is that, any accident that occurs the insurance company will manage (away from you?) and into their network. So this is both good (rewards safety and bad - IMHO)

It would be fascinating to know how that works. For example, I believe that if you corner smoothly you can do so very much faster than most drivers, and often easily exceed the speed limit for the road without appearing to go that quickly.

I wonder how the App interprets that?

 

[Shezbo]

It would be fascinating to know how that works. For example, I believe that if you corner smoothly you can do so very much faster than most drivers, and often easily exceed the speed limit for the road without appearing to go that quickly.

I wonder how the App interprets that?

I do know the black box version works off "g-force sensors" and can thus detect movement i.e. a car being stolen and lifted onto a recovery lorry for instance, but also can ascertain when you have a bump (front or back) this will allow the insurance company to manage income or manage cost?

 

[drmw]

It would be fascinating to know how that works. For example, I believe that if you corner smoothly you can do so very much faster than most drivers, and often easily exceed the speed limit for the road without appearing to go that quickly.

I wonder how the App interprets that?

Arbitrarily I would imagine .

So someone who drives at 40mph in a 60 would get a gold star - the fact that his vision is so poor / he is so careless / totally unaware of his surroundings, he continues at 40 in a 30.

There was an old joke about the "typical" OAP driver - been driving 50 years, never had an accident - but saw lots in his rearview mirrors though.

 

[d215yq]

Arbitrarily I would imagine .

So someone who drives at 40mph in a 60 would get a gold star - the fact that his vision is so poor / he is so careless / totally unaware of his surroundings, he continues at 40 in a 30.

There was an old joke about the "typical" OAP driver - been driving 50 years, never had an accident - but saw lots in his rearview mirrors though.

Whilst speed in no way shows the competence of the driver, given you as the driver are of a certain competence and this is a fixed parameter then it is obvious you will be less likely to have a crash if you decide to slow down a bit.

A few years ago i started often driving slower (50-55 on an a road, 60-65 on a motorway), admittedly for fuel reasons and since then i have avoided accidents that couldn't have been avoided driving faster...once coming round a bend at 50 and there's a truck overtaking a car...and when a car spun on the motorway (i think he had a blow out from lane 3 and flew across the motorway ended up in lane 1 pointing backwards). In both cases there was a brown trouser moment and sharp braking (though not enough for the abs to come on) and only just stopping in time...in both cases were i doing the speed limit and driving how i used to do/how most do i'd have crashed.

Now I'm not saying everyone should drive at my speed/drives too fast, but it is a fact that for accident avoidance purposes the slower the better, and also the severity of any accident is obviously less intense with a lwoer speed. Personally i'd rather put my time into this and keep my accident record free and enjoy my cheap and never used insurance rather than start stressing about who uses approved repairers and what my legal rights are in the case of an accident...

 

[turbopete]

Arbitrarily I would imagine .

So someone who drives at 40mph in a 60 would get a gold star

but then again, slow doesnt ALWAYS mean carefully. i really dont know why so many people always think it is the case. sure, if things go wrong, you will hit it less hard, but is the little old dear going to the next town at 30mph because she has slow reactions, really being more careful than someone in their 30's or 40's travelling at the 60mph speed limit? id say NO!!! after all, you can fail your driving test for driving too slowly or, as they word it, 'failing to make reasonable progress' as well as driving too fast

 

[turbopete]

A few years ago i started often driving slower (50-55 on an a road, 60-65 on a motorway), admittedly for fuel reasons and since then i have avoided accidents that couldn't have been avoided driving faster...once coming round a bend at 50 and there's a truck overtaking a car...and when a car spun on the motorway (i think he had a blow out from lane 3 and flew across the motorway ended up in lane 1 pointing backwards). In both cases there was a brown trouser moment and sharp braking (though not enough for the abs to come on) and only just stopping in time...in both cases were i doing the speed limit and driving how i used to do/how most do i'd have crashed.

true i suppose, but had you also been driving at your old speed, you would have already passed the point where you had the near misses, and therefore not have had even the near miss! there will always be arguments for and against. while i dont have a problem with people driving below the speed limit, there does, of course become a point where these people cause unnecessary hold ups, delays, and potentially causing accidents by causing frustration by travelling at an EXCESSIVELY low speed

if roads were to have MINIMUM as well as maximum limits imposed AND ENFORCED, there would be far better traffic flow, less hold-ups, less accidents and better for all concerned IMO

 

[Shezbo]

i dont have a problem with people driving below the speed limit, there does, of course become a point where these people cause unnecessary hold ups, delays, and potentially causing accidents by causing frustration by travelling at an EXCESSIVELY low speed

if roads were to have MINIMUM as well as maximum limits imposed AND ENFORCED, there would be far better traffic flow, less hold-ups, less accidents and better for all concerned IMO[/QUOTE]

Totally agree with that, tractors cause lots of accidents here in Shropshire, yes they are going slow (and safe?) but everyone else becomes frustrated and overtakes stupidly and accidents occur

 

[d215yq]

Totally agree with that, tractors cause lots of accidents here in Shropshire, yes they are going slow (and safe?) but everyone else becomes frustrated and overtakes stupidly and accidents occur

So what you really mean is short tempered, selfish morons who can't cope to be held up by an extra minute, overtaking tractors when not safe to do so cause a lot of accidents here in shropshire.

I can foregive most things, excssive speed on a motorway, hurrying through a red light, etc. but overtaking on a SCW road risking a serious head on is something seriously stupid...and if there are a lot of accidents caused by this you'd be a lot better off driving slower if you're the person coming the other way!

Also i don't see how a tractor can conform to a minimum speed limit...it's not like it is trying to go slow for the sake of it!

 

[Xtractorfan]

The Road safety brigade and the Insurance companies are trying to get this system installed in new cars as it is. So I do believe the Aviva system is just a forerunner for some info to back up this BIG brother tactic..
The information gained will be used by every official body to penalise motorists.. George Orwell.. they are eating your heart out for you...

 

[M80]

Minimum speed limit not feasible.
Better policing is more expensive so they resort to technical devices that become revenue earners.
Assessing driving safety by a black box or other gizmo is just fanciful as seen by the examples given and many more scenarios that can be easily thought of.

I've reduced my speed for economy and to reduce the tiring effect of driving faster, as then there is more speed up / braking activity. generally it's better for me until I'm more South on 2 lane high ways. There I experience a definite impatience and travelling at 70 in the outer lane just has git after git snorting my exhaust gasses. If I travelled at their desired rate, if at all possible, it is safer as they back off.
Slower isn't always safer just not being on the road is.

My old gripe- introduce retesting.
Allow for use of faster roads with increased qualification, motorways specifically.
Use the opportunity to improve education and teach more recent road use information.
Remind people of the skills they should be employing to drive.
Weed out the down right incapable.
Allow insurers to rate drivers on a recognised qualification.

A little different, cause all international arrival drivers to demonstrate competence with a PC based exam before using our congested roads.

It would involve some cost to us the users but surely there would be an offset with the natural competition between insurers surely better road use and less accidents and smoother flowing traffic

 

[turbopete]

So what you really mean is short tempered, selfish morons who can't cope to be held up by an extra minute, overtaking tractors when not safe to do so cause a lot of accidents here in shropshire.

I can foregive most things, excssive speed on a motorway, hurrying through a red light, etc. but overtaking on a SCW road risking a serious head on is something seriously stupid...and if there are a lot of accidents caused by this you'd be a lot better off driving slower if you're the person coming the other way!

Also i don't see how a tractor can conform to a minimum speed limit...it's not like it is trying to go slow for the sake of it!

the problem is though, that tractors also often fail to pull over and let traffic past, as they are legally required to do so. but the factor isnt always tractors, and its not always for a minute or so. only recently i was held up on a twisty road by a tractor who refused to pull in to allow the queue of traffic past, for a full 20 minutes. not a problem for me at the moment, BUT when i was working for a delivery company and timed drops HAD to be completed on time or the items being delivered would have perished costing the company a fortune, it then becomes more of an issue.

then of course you get the people in all vehicles, who drive in the middle of the road even when its safe for people to overtake, simply to PREVENT them overtaking. horseboxes are particularly bad for this, especially when towed by a 4x4 rather than a dedicated truck.

unfortunately, we dont live in an ideal world. if we did, then slow vehicles of all kinds (horseboxes, caravans, farm vehicles etc) would only be allowed to use the road at certain times.

 

[Alex M Grieve]

Arbitrarily I would imagine .

So someone who drives at 40mph in a 60 would get a gold star - the fact that his vision is so poor / he is so careless / totally unaware of his surroundings, he continues at 40 in a 30.

There was an old joke about the "typical" OAP driver - been driving 50 years, never had an accident - but saw lots in his rearview mirrors though.

so, you knew my late father in law then David?

 

[Alex M Grieve]

i don't have a problem with people driving below the speed limit, there does, of course become a point where these people cause unnecessary hold ups, delays, and potentially causing accidents by causing frustration by travelling at an EXCESSIVELY low speed

if roads were to have MINIMUM as well as maximum limits imposed AND ENFORCED, there would be far better traffic flow, less hold-ups, less accidents and better for all concerned IMO

Totally agree with that, tractors cause lots of accidents here in Shropshire, yes they are going slow (and safe?) but everyone else becomes frustrated and overtakes stupidly and accidents occur[/QUOTE]

I have tried driving at 70 mph on the Motorway, and I am one of the minority who use lane 1 when possible. I quickly find that I become a hazard to shipping - particularly when I want to overtake a slower vehicle in lane 1. In order to do so, I have to use lane 2, but the moron who lives in lane 2 (and never leaves it) fails to spot that I am indicating a desire to overtake and in spite of the fact that lane 3 is empty as far back as the eye can see, he will hold his ground in lane 2 and run me into the back of the slower car I would like to overtake.

Now imagine someone in my position who is not very good with mirrors and whose indicators don't work - and there are plenty to choose from. This is all happening within the national speed limit. It will be a car crash. It won't be an accident, in my view.

And we will all need to sit in the stationary queue for as long as the road remains closed as a result.

 

[S80]

Until all motorists are willing to treat driving as a skill worthy of continuous development and refinement, then no amount of legislation or policing will have much real-world impact (pun not particularly intended!).

Most of us start out thinking we know it all at 18 or so, when in reality only the rudimentary aspects of vehicle control have been learnt. The mechanics of pressing pedals, operating controls, steering etc form only a very small part of driving a vehicle. Rather, it is the development of 'road sense' - developed over the next 100,000 miles or so - which is the key to making safe progress.

My aim has always been to be 'invisible' to other road users (not literally, of course!), never baulking, nor being 'in the wrong place at the wrong time'. This can be achieved whilst still making 'good progress' within the confines of the law. Sometimes I don't quite get it right, which earns a good self-inflicted slap across the chops (metaphorically!).

Absolute concentration, self-discipline, keen observation, anticipation - and a willingness to keep on learning - are not guaranteed to ward off all road evils, but they're a damn good start. It's just a pity such notions conjure up the killjoy picture of a 1950's Whitehall civil servant

 

[Alex M Grieve]

Until all motorists are willing to treat driving as a skill worthy of continuous development and refinement, then no amount of legislation or policing will have much real-world impact (pun not particularly intended!).

Absolute concentration, self-discipline, keen observation, anticipation - and a willingness to keep on learning - are not guaranteed to ward off all road evils, but they're a damn good start. It's just a pity such notions conjure up the killjoy picture of a 1950's Whitehall civil servant

I completely agree with you. A sure sign of less than 100% concentration is the driver who leans his right arm on the window sill.

I have yet to discover any driving academy that teaches this technique, yet its practice is widespread - generally accompanied by an incomplete understanding of what else is happening around them.

 

[S80]

I completely agree with you. A sure sign of less than 100% concentration is the driver who leans his right arm on the window sill.

Indeed, Alex - I still have a battered copy of Roadcraft which decries this habit because, "it lacks control and looks slack"

Similarly, many drivers seem incapable of having a conversation with their passenger(s) without turning to look at them I fondly remember a billboard (back in the 70s) positioned at first-storey level at a small side street junction - it read: "A Moment's Inattention Causes Accidents".

 

[Frontstep]

Has the Law lessons finished on this thread ?
I was enjoying those armchair Lawyer exchanges.

 

[Alex M Grieve]

Has the Law lessons finished on this thread ?
I was enjoying those armchair Lawyer exchanges.

"Ah, you want room 12 for Arguments sir. This is 12A - Abuse"!