Declaring modifications to insurance company

[television]

The insurer will only have access to information as shown on the V5, they don't have VIN decoders. Anything that the purchaser adds as option will not be visible to the insurer. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't go through the sales brochure to check for themselves.

Basically the onus is on the person applying for the insurance to ensure they comply with the T&Cs.

How do you know that insurance companies do not have access to data bases, many firms selling car spare parts do.

As at least, I would estimate that 97% of car owners do not belong to forums, they do not have a clue about their motor cars, they have no idea what is or was standard.

The amount of not payed out claims is probably next to zero if the truth were known.

 

[Devonian]

Some interesting replies here, thank you all.

There seems to me to be two different potential issues here:

1) Are factory fitted options a modification?

These are usually referred to as the specification of the vehicle. I can appreciate that should a car be 'fully loaded' then its desirabilty to a theif woiuld increase therfore increase the risk to the insurer as well as the potential value of a payout. However can the buyer of a 10 year old car be reasonably expected to know if its leather seats or CD player were standard fittment on the base model or an option? - sure you can do a lot of research and find these things out but does the average driver do so? I think not.

2) Changes to the vehicle after initial purchase

This is what most people would consider to be a modification and some of course are plain to see. Many however are not. On a used vehicle it's feasible that an unsuspecting buyer would not know about some modifications that might have been done years previously such as a change of wheels, audio components or even being chipped.

I can see the insurance companies point if a vehicle has had performance enhancing mods or anything that changes the handling of the car and this I suspect is what most people think about when answering 'NO' to the has your vehicle been modified question. I wonder how many cars are being driven around with non declared tow bars.

I started this thread out of interest and am intrigued to hear the different opinions both on here and other related threads. To the best of my knowledge my car has not been changed in any way from the time of purchase but who knows...................

I dont think I'll sleep soundly ever again

 

[television]

Some interesting replies here, thank you all.

There seems to me to be two different potential issues here:

1) Are factory fitted options a modification?

These are usually referred to as the specification of the vehicle. I can appreciate that should a car be 'fully loaded' then its desirabilty to a theif woiuld increase therfore increase the risk to the insurer as well as the potential value of a payout. However can the buyer of a 10 year old car be reasonably expected to know if its leather seats or CD player were standard fittment on the base model or an option? - sure you can do a lot of research and find these things out but does the average driver do so? I think not.

2) Changes to the vehicle after initial purchase

This is what most people would consider to be a modification and some of course are plain to see. Many however are not. On a used vehicle it's feasible that an unsuspecting buyer would not know about some modifications that might have been done years previously such as a change of wheels, audio components or even being chipped.

I can see the insurance companies point if a vehicle has had performance enhancing mods or anything that changes the handling of the car and this I suspect is what most people think about when answering 'NO' to the has your vehicle been modified question. I wonder how many cars are being driven around with non declared tow bars.

I started this thread out of interest and am intrigued to hear the different opinions both on here and other related threads. To the best of my knowledge my car has not been changed in any way from the time of purchase but who knows...................

I dont think I'll sleep soundly ever again

You are right most would not have a clue as to if their car was standard or
not. A lot of scare mongering on this thread.

 

[ianplymouth]

When I phoned to take out my insurance, I told them about my wheels, I was asked if my wheels were factory or dealer fitted when new and I said that I didn't know, they said if they were fitted at the dealer when new they class that as a standard fitment.

I had a modified Fiat Uno Turbo, I phoned the insurance company to tell them about the mods, they asked for a list of all the parts and manufactures (verbal), they also wanted a rolling road power figure and the same with that they only wanted a verbal figure, but the best bit was it actually lowered my premium.

 

[whitenemesis]

You are right most would not have a clue as to if their car was standard or
not. A lot of scare mongering on this thread.

Scare mongering? Rubbish!!

Just be open and honest with your insurer. If your not sure, declare it. Don't be complacent

 

[ianplymouth]

Most online quotes only have a yes/no dropdown box therefore not allowing for that option

I always get the best package deal from the internet and then phone the company to clarify the details and to knock down the price :lol:
The last time I did this there was a note on the web site saying not to phone to get a reduced price, checked through all of the details and then they offered me a price 10% lower. :lol:

 

[television]

Scare mongering? Rubbish!!

Just be open and honest with your insurer. If your not sure, declare it. Don't be complacent

I can understand that if you want you are insuring an AMG more questions could be asked.

I would say that most are open with their insurer, this still begs the question, who honestly knows out of the general public or person in the street if the car that they have just bought has been modified in any way.

Just take wheels, I know for a fact that not one person in my road would know if their wheels were original, replacements, copies or come to that the correct size.

I would imagine that a youngster insuring a certain type of car could be asked more questions when applying and as I said if an AMG etc.

If you think that I am going to tell my insurance company that I have fitted DAB, then you are mistaken.

 

[Mic]

I think the reality is that insurance companies will pay out in the case of accidents regardless of any modifications unless there was cause to believe that a particular modification was found to have contributed to the accident or completely changed the nature of the vehicle such that it should have attracted a higher premium.
Theft and desirability are different issues......breaking and entering to steal a visible high value non standard modification could jeopardise a pay out and no doubt obviously expensive wheels on a low value car could increase its potential as a target for theft.
It is most likely that each case is judged on its merits but I think the days are long gone when it was perceived that insurers actively sought to evade their contractual responsibilities......on the contrary.......insurers, whilst not necessarily erring on the generous side, have adopted a pragmatic approach to the costs related to investigating claims.......it often cheaper to pay out than to ''over investigate''.

Mic

 

[television]

I think the reality is that insurance companies will pay out in the case of accidents regardless of any modifications unless there was cause to believe that a particular modification was found to have contributed to the accident or completely changed the nature of the vehicle such that it should have attracted a higher premium.
Theft and desirability are different issues......breaking and entering to steal a visible high value non standard modification could jeopardise a pay out and no doubt obviously expensive wheels on a low value car could increase its potential as a target for theft.
It is most likely that each case is judged on its merits but I think the days are long gone when it was perceived that insurers actively sought to evade their contractual responsibilities......on the contrary.......insurers, whilst not necessarily erring on the generous side, have adopted a pragmatic approach to the costs related to investigating claims.......it often cheaper to pay out than to ''over investigate''.

Mic

Thank you Mic and very well said That is the way life is

 

[Devonian]

I agree entirely with Mic. I don't think insuraance companies would actively try to avoid a claim where the insured answered their questions to the best of their ability, particularly as most claims are batch processed with little need for investigation. However I do wonder what their position would be on a very large claim that has resulted in serious injury or fatality.

I must admit prior to this discussion I hadn't really condiered the difference in value of a brand new car. A fully loaded C class would have a considerably different value to a base model and if it were written off or stolen in early months of ownership therefore I suppose this should be reflected in the premium and to make this happen optional extras would have to be declared

 

[television]

I agree entirely with Mic. I don't think insuraance companies would actively try to avoid a claim where the insured answered their questions to the best of their ability, particularly as most claims are batch processed with little need for investigation. However I do wonder what their position would be on a very large claim that has resulted in serious injury or fatality.

I must admit prior to this discussion I hadn't really condiered the difference in value of a brand new car. A fully loaded C class would have a considerably different value to a base model and if it were written off or stolen in early months of ownership therefore I suppose this should be reflected in the premium and to make this happen optional extras would have to be declared

In the event of any claim the insurers must have access to the data bases to check the cars spec if all factory fitted.

 

[Rory]

I must admit prior to this discussion I hadn't really condiered the difference in value of a brand new car. A fully loaded C class would have a considerably different value to a base model and if it were written off or stolen in early months of ownership therefore I suppose this should be reflected in the premium and to make this happen optional extras would have to be declared

I was a bit concerned about this as my car has some chunky price options but the insurer (LV=) told me it doesn't matter. I even got them to write to me and say the COMAND unit would be fully covered. I don't want to encourage insurers to charge more, but it does strike me as a bit of a missed revenue opportunity for them.

I have "heard" (read somewhere on the internet) that Admiral group companies will only replace with a standard model if your car gets written off in the first year.

 

[M-B Dave]

If you think that I am going to tell my insurance company that I have fitted DAB, then you are mistaken.

Funny you should say that - I actually did inform my insurance company (AVIVA via Swinton), when I fitted a double-DIN head unit in my A-Class, just under three years ago, only to be told that it's a 'cosmetic' mod and as such would not have had affected the policy. It almost sounded like "don't be such a boy scout!" LOL ... Same was said for parking sensors and reversing camera. When I switched the insurers the following year (and the year after) I didn't bother telling them anything.

 

[television]

Funny you should say that - I actually did inform my insurance company (AVIVA via Swinton), when I fitted a double-DIN head unit in my A-Class, just under three years ago, only to be told that it's a 'cosmetic' mod and as such would not have had affected the policy. It almost sounded like "don't be such a boy scout!" LOL ... Same was said for parking sensors and reversing camera. When I switched the insurers the following year (and the year after) I didn't bother telling them anything.

Absolutely, that's the way it is in real life, why someone would want to tell the insurance company that they are using a different car polish is beyond me.

 

[television]

I was a bit concerned about this as my car has some chunky price options but the insurer (LV=) told me it doesn't matter. I even got them to write to me and say the COMAND unit would be fully covered. I don't want to encourage insurers to charge more, but it does strike me as a bit of a missed revenue opportunity for them.

I have "heard" (read somewhere on the internet) that Admiral group companies will only replace with a standard model if your car gets written off in the first year.

To stop someone from writing their car off to get a better model ???

 

[Scoob]

Some insurers seem to care less than others about mods. I've always been very particular about declaring them, having run a modded Impreza for years. They didn't really care about the suspension kit I fitted - the old one was worn, I fitted a new, better one - half the price of the "Standard" kit. Same for the Turbo, it's still a TD04, but a hybrid unit with a different turbine wheel and flowed casing, they didn't really kick up a fuss about that either. Same for the exhaust changes (nothing huge, different back box) and even the new ECU and remap didn't seem to phase them - I even provided dyno readouts so they could see the power difference. To be fair, most have my tweaks have just kept the car feeling fresh, rather than going crazy.

One thing I'm noticing with Diesels (I've had two now, the Focus and my current Merc) is that insurance companies seem far less concerned over remaps for these. I guess as more and more people get this done for drivability / economy as well as maybe a bit more poke, it's become quite an accepted mod, not having any real impact on premiums. At least, this is my experience so far with Aviva. Possibly younger drivers in their 20's might have a harder time with such mods?

As for other extras, my car seems to be accurate on the V5 - even down to the 18" wheels that change the emissions from 158ppm to 162ppm (or something like that) is on the V5. However, does that taking into account my new tyres? lol.

I'd hope that if we try to be honest we'd be ok in the event of a claim. However, on older cars it become more tricky. I.e. who knows what the prior owner did. Is changing a standard part for an aftermarket - but still like for like - replacement going to cause an issue as it's not an over-priced manufacturers part?

I've not had any issues, however, nor have I had to make any claims - touch wood!

Scoob.

 

[ChrisKnottIns]

Here's a repeat of some news we posted back in June 2013 concerning declaration of mods. Maybe it'll help some of you.

"The Consumer Insurance (Disclosure and Representations) Act 2012 came into force last month.

Under the Act it is still the duty of consumers to take reasonable care not to make a misrepresentation to the insurer but there will no longer be a need for consumers to volunteer information that an insurer might regard as material. This increases the onus on providers to ask the right questions (and properly record the answers).

The result is that claims can no longer be thrown out just because the consumer didn't disclose a certain detail. The test is whether the omission was ‘deliberate or reckless’ or merely ‘careless’.

The insurer will be able to refuse a claim where a consumer deliberately or recklessly makes a misrepresentation. But the remedies for the less serious, 'careless', misrepresentation are based on what the insurer would have done if the consumer had complied with the duty to take reasonable care.

In essence this means that, under a careless misrepresentation, a claim would be paid but there may be a deduction to reflect the additional premium the insurer would have charged at the outset had they known.

This helps consumers and should reduce the incidence of claims disputes. Good news for the motorist."

 

[television]

Thank you very much Chris, and this puts pay to the speculation that has been posted here and completely inline with my thinking, and what I have said.

 

[ChrisKnottIns]

That is talking about at the outset i.e. when getting a quote or renewing but you should still disclose any modifications made during the policy term, as you make them.

 

[television]

That is talking about at the outset i.e. when getting a quote or renewing but you should still disclose any modifications made during the policy term, as you make them.

Thank you and understandable, in the main with the question of how many people would have a clue about if their car bought secondhand had any mods, most would not know if the wheels were the ones on the car from new or if they were repro. Sure if you add an expensive audio system you tell the company so it can be included within the terms of the policy. The same goes if you bought a set of £5k wheels.

Nice having you on board for these things