Disappointmet Buying Star

[M80]

Thanks for your responses I am interested in views.
To clarify,
I saw the adverts for various Star kits on eBay.
This chap trades from his rented home address under a company name, and uses 3 eBay profiles.
The only officer of the company is his wife, the Director.

We spoke (24th Aug) and agreed the C3 kit was suitable for my purposes but he couldn't have one ready till the following Wednesday (29th Aug). I agreed to visit and take the Delphi kit in the interim to get my ailing Viano roadworthy.

I visited by arrangement 3 hours later. When 'they' arrived home I was invited in to witness their small industrial style manufacturing set up in the open plan downstairs. I was there for around 1 1/2 hours conversing about many things. I paid £400 for the C3 kit and was loaned the Delphi kit.
At least now 'I believe' my version of this is confirmed by his text responses, prior to his responses I was aware that a "don't know who Martin is" might have looked reasonable.
Come the 29th He wasn't in the UK, supported by a different type of ring tone at my end. This being the start of my doubts.

My take is,
I was a numpty to trust so readily, in a way that we might when dealing with a High St trader.
I can demonstrate that the eBay advertising, my initial contact, is associated to the Company.
The house is the Company registered office.
eBay have allowed his mobile to appear in the advertising, the number I am text from.
Dealing with him is as an agent / Employee of the Company. That's not my concern as I see the Company as the trader.
Is my evidence adequate for MCOL?
Will I be seen as having done all that is reasonable to resolve this before Court action? Considering I attended the property by arrangement to be stood up. Considering this has gone on for so long and I have offered to return again but gained no response.
Considering I have requested product demonstration but this isn't responded to.
Would the Court see that I should accept his offer and accept the C3 posted to me, that is assuming it arrives and is fit for purpose.

MCOL can only give me a judement at best.
For serious recovery as I understand I then need approval of that Court to pass action onto the Sherrif, who (at a cost of approx £1k to be added to any debt) act in a manner far superior to the County Court Bailiff.
This of course is more chew and those with experience / confidence can create significant run around with the processes.
A rental property might mean a fly by night situation. I don't envisage they are wishing to uproot family for £400 but I can't know what else is in the pipeline to make this strategy attractive.
On my side they haven't been in the house for very long, and lived locally before this. The wife works locally, as does he. They have private registrations to match the Company name. There is evidence that they are aiming for stability.

BTW, returning to use the personal approach.
It's more effort and a 25 mile drive each way.
He may or may not be there, even if pre arranged.
He isn't likely to volunteer £400 from his back pocket.
I don't see this as being a reliable way to sort this.

 

[M80]

My take is.........

He used e-bay to contact the seller, he fuc'd (made a mistake) up and bought outside of e-bays buyer protection, that's why it's there to help stop scamming.

****Nothing to do with e-bay****

Nothing to do with anyone except seller and buyer doing a deal somewhere on the planet and certainly nothing to do with being disappointed in buying/using a star machine.

Apparently for that money............

Some Chinese clone sellers of Star
have support via Team Viewer (remote access)
and will log into your laptop and set up the equipment they sold you
and get it running and give 12 months support.

To follow that thinking we should all only buy from eBay or at least larger organisations that have a reputation to protect, those with a proven customer service record. Larisa used to work at Debenhams and see ladies buying a dress on Friday to return it Monday. Here we have some confidence.

But the esteemed Mercedes get slated here often for their poor customer service to many complaints. We talk of their extortionate prices especially when having us over that barrel.
eBay make oodles while changing their policies so often it's near impossible to keep up. Paypal who were always seperate to eBay enjoyed their banking charges due to the massive bias for them created by eBay.

I was a dumb nuts.
I do resent many eBay styles and Paypal charges and I was actually happy to give a guy a chance to just trade, in an honest way. Actually chaps we do it here, and with Star, there have been 2 sold across these pages recently. I'm sorry I don't have one of those, but there isn't any protection in place.

 

[LostKiwi]

To follow that thinking we should all only buy from eBay or at least larger organisations that have a reputation to protect, those with a proven customer service record. Larisa used to work at Debenhams and see ladies buying a dress on Friday to return it Monday. Here we have some confidence.

But the esteemed Mercedes get slated here often for their poor customer service to many complaints. We talk of their extortionate prices especially when having us over that barrel.
eBay make oodles while changing their policies so often it's near impossible to keep up. Paypal who were always seperate to eBay enjoyed their banking charges due to the massive bias for them created by eBay.

I was a dumb nuts.
I do resent many eBay styles and Paypal charges and I was actually happy to give a guy a chance to just trade, in an honest way. Actually chaps we do it here, and with Star, there have been 2 sold across these pages recently. I'm sorry I don't have one of those, but there isn't any protection in place.

And even on here it's possible to get ripped off as @GLK found.

Martin,
If it helps you get up and running I would be happy to loan you my Star. It doesn't resolve the issue with your own C3 but will help get you up and running.
I have my MB-II I can use if needed while you have Star. In the event I really need the Star we can always arrange it's return somehow.

With respect to your own Star you have definitely done enough to satisfy MCOL. You could try sending a letter stating what you expect and outlining that if he does nothing you will seek legal advice and discuss the matter with trading standards. I would imagine TS are the last people he'd want poking their noses around....
If he has offered to post the Star out I would accept that and if there are issues with it the TS threat still stands.

 

[malcolm E53 AMG]

I would definitely talk to EBay you have a very good case re the complaint and if the seller is very active on EBay he will want to resolve the issue ASAP. I use PayPal and had a problem with a misrepresented item which cost £400 and was given a full refund so the system does work, in this particular case the items were left with me which did prove useful as the return postage was expensive (shipping to Ireland on a pallet)

I’ve been on EBay since 2004 and am currently on circa 800 transactions so have had one or two bad experiences which led to a cautionary rulebook when buying:

Lots of tat on eBay so only buy branded goods from a reputable U.K. seller

Always pay with PayPal and check seller feedback thoroughly

Don’t buy large items unless they are local and you can pick them up yourself, return postage costs are usually not recoverable unless stated in the advert

Overall I’d say 99% of my purchases have been very good but we all know what can and does go wrong.

Hope you get somewhere with this it does dent your confidence in people and it’s in Ebay’s interest to resolve issues like this after all it’s their platform that these people are using

 

[Taffy7hfa]

Its the risk you take when paying cash. Paypal exists to protect you from exactly this type of fraud.
I doubt that ebay will offer any help.
Good luck though.

 

[M80]

Thanks Alistair, another truly generous offer and true to character. It could well be my best option.

I'm still happy to buy a C3 Star, as even if / when the Viano has recovered from Van flu I see how it has purpose for the future.
I've come to the conclusion that my iCarsoft MB V2 hasn't had the programme well designed for the 639. Everyone else here likes the iCarsoft but I can't sing its praises.

With this seller, I feel to trust him to send a good working system, that may arrive some time in the distant future if I'm lucky, is a misplaced trust. To attempt wind this relationship up is favourable in my mind.
I repeated my text for me to post and for him to refund by bank transfer. While I type He has just messaged his agreement, so we'll see.

 

[LostKiwi]

Fingers crossed Martin!

 

[Westheath]

Fingers crossed Martin!

Agreed

 

[malcolm E53 AMG]

Hope you get a good resolution directly with him but do talk to EBay if not at the very least he will be banned and lose all that precious feedback if he re-registers

 

[Westheath]

I still fail to see how E-Bay are even involved in this transaction.

The responsibility lies solely with the purchaser for circumventing E-Bay.

I dunno is it just me ??

I have enough scammers come through the workshop doors let alone dealing with them on E-Bay,
fake money, stolen credit cards, fake number plates (MOT) stolen vehicles, stolen parts >> list goes on.

 

[M80]

It surprised me that eBay allowed for his mobile number to be shown on the adverts, and that did allow 'us' to step outside of eBay to deal.
My guess is that eBay would remove and prevent his mobile from being displayed. Would they act further? Well maybe if I pushed by saying that he promoted the direct dealing, but I don't intend to do that.

I can see many ways of making things more difficult for him, if I get my refund I won't feel a need to be vengeful.
Is making a few quids wrong, well 'course not. I get a bit cheesed of with angry socialists wanting to have a go at me for being a greedy property landlord who expects tenants to live in bad condition, while having no understanding of the reality of it.

Should I feel guilty for eBay or Mercedes losing out on further revenues? Since they don't seem to have social conscience and would seemingly take the food from our mouths I don't. Any eBay protection is so the sales and their revenues can continue to increase, and in the main it can be a real pita for the sellers, who hopefully the majority of just desire to make an honest living.

Any further action from me will firstly depend on if I get the refund, and without further hassle.
I will then consider more after this has less of a troublesome feel about it.
True I have lost another 5+ weeks of the van that I hoped Star would assist with.
True I lost an afternoon travelling to see the guy who clearly had no respect for my time.
True it has cost me another £7.79 to return his useless Delphi kit.

Life is full of lessons.

 

[Capra]

You're not the first and you will definitely not be the last.

 

[bob 6600]

If he is a business, they allow it at the bottom in their details. It shouldn't be in the main advert but if he's a trader then they might allow it. If not, then it's slipped through the net

 

[ajlsl600]

Sorry I can't get this to lay out in an easier to read layout.

I made contact with a eBay seller and was invited to go and collect. It isn't too far so why not?
Also I was keen to get the Star to get the Viano going as it seems I need some techical assistance to diagnose its fault.

Anyway I think the record below tells the story and for those with the patience I'm interested in opinions of what next.
I've deleted what would identify the seller.


Company Director

Company Address

Company number

Mobile number from eBay adverts

eBay Trading Names a
b
c

23-Aug Thur 16:13 Text > "Hi, I'm interested in you Mercedes Star diagnostic kits. Perhaps you could call when possible. Martin"



24-Aug Fri 11:29 Call > Rang mobile. Arranged to go to ******* to collect loan dianositics kit, pending the C3 being ready Wednesday 29th.

14:17 Visit > Arrived, as arranged, no person home. Rang mobile 'they' arrived 5 minutes later.

29-Sep Wed 20:01 Call > I called, "I'm not in UK, back 4th Sept"

04-Sep Tues 11:16 Call >
11:23 Call > I called 2 times, both to answer service..
14:04 Call >
14:05 Call > Answered after 2 more calls

04-Sep 14:08 Text > "Hi this is Martin, please let me know when I can collect the MB C3 Star diagnostics, or alternatively when to collect the £400 paid on the 24th August."

10-Sep Mon 15:36 Text > "It seems you are unable to provide the Mercedes Star C3 diagnostic as agreed. I have the loan machine you provided and I'm now keen to return this and recover my £400 that you hold. Pleaee advise.

15:43 < Call Return call, "...things stuck at customs, I didn't know. Ready tomorrow pm".

11-Sep Tue 17:13 Call > I called, "it's ready but I'm not home till 7:30, I'll call you when home". No call.

12-Sep Web 09:27 Call > I Called 9:27, to answer machine

12:21 < Call Missed call from

11:24 Text > "Is collection of the Star still possible early today."
13:56 Call > I rang mobile and arranged to go to swap kits. Explained I had little time. He "I can come out to you and exchange if you like".

14:39 Visit > Arrived, as arranged, I rang mobile and told He would be there in 2 minutes. 10 minutes and no show. I left.

17-Sep Mon 18:46 Text > "So you let me down on Thursday agian by not being home even though this was arranged. Do you have a suggestion of resolution here"

18:48 < Text "I didn't let you down you left and put the phone down on me I arrived home 5 mins after speaking you had gone already
Nothing has changed the kit is ready to pick up whenever"

18:53 Text > "Knowing I was pushed for time you even offered to come out to the car to save me time. As you weren't at home that wasn't possible. When you rang 10 minutes later I was already driving so unable to answer. Wasting another 2 hours driving to *******" "is more than I can spare"

19:25 < Text "So what would you like to do ? You tell me what you want I will go along with it"

18-Sep Tue 09:15 Text > "I'm still in need of the C3 Star kit and due to the rain can make it over today. Will you have time to demonstrate it working?"

25-Sep Tue 15:47 Text > "We still no further to resolving this.You didn't respond to my message of 18 Sept so you still have my £400 and the Mercedes C3 diagnostic kit. Do you have thoughts as to how we resolve? Martin."


26-Sep Wed 01:42 < Text "Only just seen these texts Nothing to demonstrate the system works fine I sell many of these. There is nothing to resolve Martin
Tell me when you can come pick up your system and drop off mine I am far too busy these days Might have some time to come to you during the weekend but can't be sure"

07:54 Text > "I can come to you today before 12, or after 5:30. If you can show the system running that would be fine"

01-Oct Mon 13:44 Text > "The best as I see it is for me to return your kit by post, and for you to refund my money by bank transfer. Please indicate your agreement. Martin."

16:01 < Text "Why not send your kit by post to like 99.9% of my customers
I have held on to this system for sometime now I could have sold it many times over"

16:11 < Text "Can make out the numbers els id do search on Dvla see if it's still about"


Edit, if you didn't realise I believe the 16:11 message wasn't meant for me. it doesn't make sense anyway.

i used a guy from hereford .pm me and i will give you his number. i did have an issue .however he resolved it completely in 48 hrs and i have had no issues since. i also have a spare hard drive from him with star loaded just in case ..

 

[Botus]

glancing over the first 2/3s or so posts...

you effectively bought something and as far as he's concerned done deal (what you have functions and the strange idea to pay too much and walk off with the wrong item, quite likely in his mind means he just made more profit than expected...)
you don't want Delphi you want star you believe you bought...

now step back and think from this guys perspective....
this guys makes 200 a pop selling star c3
you bought something, left a wad of cash and he probably thinks you've got far too much money to worry about things and no idea was star really is
he's probably so busy selling c3 he doesn't have time to make your day

the ONLY way to get anywhere is to go round with the Delphi kit and hope he has a c3 sitting there and its easier to do a swap than argue

texting and making appointments is just wasting his valuable time

 

[M80]

Little update, more to more to say thanks to LK for another generous offer.
The Delphi has been returned. Since 'he' has confirmed agreement to refund if that isn't done within a week it'll be a letter before action and then MCOL next. And I will then name and shame.

I've ordered another C3 through eBay, this time with the touchscreen Toughbook, not because I need that but because that's what's available. But it will be more convenient, I hope.
That's due here by Wednesday so assuming this one does as expected I shouldn't need your kit Alistair, but thanks again the offer is much appreciated.

 

[bob 6600]

Did you post the Delphi back or go down in person?

 

[M80]

Recorded delivery prvovides proof if needed. With a few photo's if needed.

 

[Capra]

Recorded delivery prvovides proof if needed. With a few photo's if needed.

Could you not have done this in person and then picked up your money at the same time? I can understand if didn't want to do this.

 

[M80]

I have learnt from experience from this guy and other situations, you spend time driving to their place,
they're not in,
they don't have money on them,
they mess you about otherwise.

Creating a demonstrable record is favourite.
If recovery looks likely it's worth considering passing it on to an agency where additional costs may be added.
1st though if it goes to Court I've also learnt that a judge likes to penalise anyone they can for wasting their valuable time with trivialities, I will be expected to show how I've done all that is reasonable before hand.