in snow and ice which is safer to drive ?

[Myros]

on the skid control thing

i believe current thinking is bang the clutch out/select neutral as soon as you are aware of the skid. You should then get the same response from fwd or rwd and be able to deal with the skid in a "uniform" fashion by braking or throttling back and/or steering as appropriate.
Ditches and trees notwithstanding.

 

[Apial]

Weight is very important in maintaining grip. I had a practical demonstation of this the other winter in a Fiat Coupe I used to own.

I had stopped on an icy hill after deciding that to continue to the bottom of the hill would result in me being trapped there as a steeper upward hill was at the bottom. I tried reversing, but the road was too slippery to gain traction. I decided to get out of the car and look for some material to put under the wheels to get better traction.

I got out of the car, and to my shock, the car started to slide down the hill without me, rear wheels locked! There had been only sufficient tyre friction to hold the car on the handbrake whilst I was in the car, but the minute I got out, off it went.

Fortunately I managed to jump in and apply the footbrake to bring it to a stop. In the end I was forced to go on down the hill, and I managed somehow to get up the other side

 

[mlc]

I'd go with FWD. More weight over the driving wheels, more feedback when something starts to slip and a better chance of pulling yourself out. I've been stuck in rear wheel drive cars far more often the fwds. In fact, when I was a cabbie a few years ago, it snowed one new years eve. After a couple of hours, all the ford mondeos and granadas (RWD) have given up and gone home, leaving us Cavalier drivers (FWD) to clean up. I had a 1.7tdi cavvie. Pointed it up a snowy hill, in 2nd and up she went.

I'd rather have a little understeer than oversteer unless I was playing, in which care rwd is more fun.
I fell foul of a rwd manual once. Feeling the slip, I backed off the throttle - seemed logical...until I spun off the road. The rear wheels had effectively stopped under engine braking, giving no feedback, whilst the front wheels continued to roll along at 40, until it all hell broke loose. Took me a few days to figure out what I'd done wrong but after that I remembered to bang in the clutch when it happened again.
However, it wouldn't have happened on a fwd.

Dont like to correct the master - but, I suspect that those old Mondeos were actually old Sierras. my memory is that Mondeo was FWD from day one, however I could be wrong.

I actually think that tyres are very importnat in this, and the lower profile the tyre the worse it is in snow. I have certainly used the kids Ka with ease when my Mondeo with silly 17 inch low profile tyres wouldnt move from outside the house.

 

[David Nock]

Dont like to correct the master - but, I suspect that those old Mondeos were actually old Sierras. my memory is that Mondeo was FWD from day one, however I could be wrong.

Yes the Sierra launced 1982 was RWD. Mondeo launced 1993 was FWD. I thought of posting but I'm like a dog in a pack. Let someone else nip first! Howling sound icon!

 

[rf065]

Easy solution - just get a 4x4 - easy peasy :lol::lol::lol:

Yeh, had one for 5 years, brilliant at going forward in snow or ice, but the same as any other car when you try to slow down or stop, unless winter tyres are fitted.

Russ

 

[Rory]

I fell foul of a rwd manual once. Feeling the slip, I backed off the throttle - seemed logical...until I spun off the road. The rear wheels had effectively stopped under engine braking, giving no feedback, whilst the front wheels continued to roll along at 40, until it all hell broke loose. Took me a few days to figure out what I'd done wrong but after that I remembered to bang in the clutch when it happened again.
However, it wouldn't have happened on a fwd.

I certainly had an incident in the Fiesta I mentioned earlier, where I braked for a junction and the car simply went straight across - wouldn't respond to braking on/off or to steering. It was only afterwards that I realised that the wheels locking (no abs then) had stalled the engine so the car was completely unresponsive.

 

[JEZ.S320L]

Yeh, had one for 5 years, brilliant at going forward in snow or ice, but the same as any other car when you try to slow down or stop, unless winter tyres are fitted.

Russ

Couldn't agree more. AND you can only go at the same speed as the vehicle in front

p.s. I once got totally stuck in a RR - on FLAT, wet meadowland. 4 wheels - all slowly spinning. Had to get some bystanders to PUSH me out :Oops:

 

[jberks]

I suspect that those old Mondeos were actually old Sierras. my memory is that Mondeo was FWD from day one, however I could be wrong.

I actually think that tyres are very importnat in this, and the lower profile the tyre the worse it is in snow. I have certainly used the kids Ka with ease when my Mondeo with silly 17 inch low profile tyres wouldnt move from outside the house.

Probably more likely that you're right, I'm wrong and they were sierras.
Its all a long time ago and I never had a mondeo.
I agree about tyres though I suspect it's more to do with the fact that lower profile tyres are wider as a rule. Basic physics really, the wider the footprint, the lower the surface pressure, so wider tyres won't dig in as well. Basically the same as the weight over the driven wheels issue. Hence rally cars in icy stages often run with skinny tyres to dig in better and my car will probably aquaplane earlier with its 245's than one equipped 205's.

 

[whitenemesis]

Private paving slabs no good then?

Nah! Too light, council ones were much heavier :mrgreen:

 

[whitenemesis]

guess council ones are cheaper!!

MUCH....

 

[type49]

I think the FWD has the edge over RWD Dont forget that Volvo and SAAB were both developed in Sweden, and they pull their way through,, and that's easier than pushing

Mmmmmmmm no real answer for this one me thinks. Yes the Swedes are more used to snoe/ice & build FWD cars but they are remembered for their rally days in RWD Escorts. Some of they did rally & rally X in a Volvo............ a 240 - again RWD. On the other side of the coin, the average driver may find FWD is probably easier than RWD.

 

[television]

Mmmmmmmm no real answer for this one me thinks. Yes the Swedes are more used to snoe/ice & build FWD cars but they are remembered for their rally days in RWD Escorts. Some of they did rally & rally X in a Volvo............ a 240 - again RWD. On the other side of the coin, the average driver may find FWD is probably easier than RWD.

Back in those days it was Pat Moss Saab 99 and the RWD Amazon

 

[Glenn Smith]

Mmmmmmmm no real answer for this one me thinks. Yes the Swedes are more used to snoe/ice & build FWD cars but they are remembered for their rally days in RWD Escorts. Some of they did rally & rally X in a Volvo............ a 240 - again RWD. On the other side of the coin, the average driver may find FWD is probably easier than RWD.

Also note Volvo have only recently started to build fwd, all their old stuff was rear wheel drive.

 

[anyweb]

so the general consensus here seems to be that it's safer to drive in snow (with winter tires) on a FWD car (as opposed to RWD, I'm not talking about 4x4's here)

maybe I should put up a poll to get a better overview of peoples opinions ?

 

[Glenn Smith]

I have a front wheel drive van, which is terrible in snow and ice, with very little grip, and even worse with some weight in the back. But i still say that tyre choice and knowing your vehicle is more important, i used to have continentals on my C230k, which were less than useless in the snow, i now have BF goodriches and tha car is much much better. Also try putting a heavy load in the back of a large front drive volvo and see how it grips or doesn't. Not forgeting of course that the car deisign and weight distribution play a vital role in the safety, both my Jag and Merc are very good in all conditions, as was my VW Mk2 Gti, but my front drive Peugeot 309 was hopeless in even just wet conditions.

 

[brandwooddixon]

When comparing the two I'd be tempted to go for the car with the narrowest tyres. They'll tend to float less on snow.

 

[television]

Yes, I had my 1928 RR in Sweden and did a wedding in the Winter, the 21" x 5" wide tyres never got stuck once, where as the MB with 8" tyre would not move 1mm

 

[wireman]

Give me rear drive, when it wont go there is good enough reason to stop driving.
The FWD is far more difficult to get back under control once skiding starts.
The RWD is fun to slither about in, you always have some steering and the tail wags on throttle command.
First move whist skiding:- press the clutch and hope that you can get some steering back, if you dont declutch there is little chance of recovery.
First rule when on poor frozen sufaces:- do not exceed 10 MPH.

 

[rf065]

First move whist skiding:- press the clutch and hope that you can get some steering back, if you dont declutch there is little chance of recovery.

What if its an auto? As I assume most of us have

Russ

 

[JEZ.S320L]

First rule when on poor frozen sufaces:- do not exceed 10 MPH.

May I add a 2nd Rule?

Don't even THINK about going DOWN steep hills/inclines - gravity overcomes friction VERY easily..!!