C180 Timing chain and variators/cams hell

[Mercmo]

hi all

First time poster long time reader!

So a few weeeks ago our c180 kompressor 2007 model wouldnt start properly, felt like it had a misfire. Called the AA they hooked it up showed misfire cylinder 1 advised to drive to garage.

Took to local indy informs me its a common problem death rattle he called it but said he would check.
After checking it was the dreaded death rattle needs new belt and variators, parts from mercedes would cost around 2k plus labour may as well scrap car.

I looked on line and found some aftermaket ones for a lot less and passed the details to the garage that spoke to the supplier and ordered.

The garage has now fitted all the parts and put the engine back together but there is a noise still coming from the chain I am told.

Has anyone experience of using aftermarket variators? Or any other info that may be helpful

 

[Oldspanners]

hi all

First time poster long time reader!

So a few weeeks ago our c180 kompressor 2007 model wouldnt start properly, felt like it had a misfire. Called the AA they hooked it up showed misfire cylinder 1 advised to drive to garage.

Took to local indy informs me its a common problem death rattle he called it but said he would check.
After checking it was the dreaded death rattle needs new belt and variators, parts from mercedes would cost around 2k plus labour may as well scrap car.

I looked on line and found some aftermaket ones for a lot less and passed the details to the garage that spoke to the supplier and ordered.

The garage has now fitted all the parts and put the engine back together but there is a noise still coming from the chain I am told.

Has anyone experience of using aftermarket variators? Or any other info that may be helpful

Here's a thread from another forum http://forums.mbclub.co.uk/threads/c180-k-timing-chain-and-sprocket-kit.229749/
Seems this chap is having the same problem.

 

[Mercmo]

Or the same chap!

 

[Steve@Avantgarde]

I always use genuine parts and would never use anything else for major assembly work unless it was coming directly from someone like Mahle...but have used M271 for gear repairs with no issue..

Did he replace the chain tensioner? Has he timed it up properly? Have you done a compression test to see if the engine bent or unseated a valve or 2? Has the engine ECU been readapted so the variable timing gears are in the correct position in relation to the magnets? All these questions can only be answered with solid diagnosis and or with STAR...

 

[Steve@Avantgarde]

The other thing to check which has dawned on me is the oil filter. I had a 271 come to me that had been serviced at a german car specialist close to me, they had somehow managed to break the oil filter housing neck that had all seals on it. That engine rattled its nuts off on start up. Took me an age to find until I went to measure the oil pressure which required me to remove the oil filter....a complete luck in find, and a reminder never to trust the competency level of other garages...

 

[Mercmo]

Thanks for the info unfortunately I cant answer any of those questions but I would hope that they have tested all these things at the garage, the parts are from m271

 

[Uncle Benz]

The other thing to check which has dawned on me is the oil filter. I had a 271 come to me that had been serviced at a german car specialist close to me, they had somehow managed to break the oil filter housing neck that had all seals on it. That engine rattled its nuts off on start up. Took me an age to find until I went to measure the oil pressure which required me to remove the oil filter....a complete luck in find, and a reminder never to trust the competency level of other garages...

Seen this a couple of times myself. The turbo engines (have turbo printed on the oil filter lid) seem to be even more prone. The plastic is like a spiders web thin.

 

[Mercmo]

A couple of pics I took of the new chain and cams, a new oil filter has been fitted from what i was told

 

[star]

I have seen a couple of faulty cam gears from 271, one was assembled wrong and rattled on start up, the other, the circlip shown above fell out along with the plunger and spring giving a rattle.

 

[star]

Looking at those pics, its all wrong, E gear is the inlet and A is the exhaust. The lines on both gears should be at 12 oclock, not 3 and 9.

 

[Mercmo]

Looking at those pics, its all wrong, E gear is the inlet and A is the exhaust. The lines on both gears should be at 12 oclock, not 3 and 9.

Thanks for the info are the gears on the wrong sides? I will tell the garage. I would have hoped that the merc specialist would have known what he was doing but clearly not

 

[Oldspanners]

Thanks for the info are the gears on the wrong sides? I will tell the garage. I would have hoped that the merc specialist would have known what he was doing but clearly not

E= Einlass Inlet, A=Auspuff, Exhaust from memory.

 

[Mercmo]

Been in touch with the garage they say when i took that picture, the engine wasnt timed up, the variators only fit in one position because they have dowels and the while they were removing the tensioner, no idea what any of that means! He thinks its lack of oil to the head and will be contacting the supplier of cams tomorrow

 

[Oldspanners]

Been in touch with the garage they say when i took that picture, the engine wasnt timed up, the variators only fit in one position because they have dowels and the while they were removing the tensioner, no idea what any of that means! He thinks its lack of oil to the head and will be contacting the supplier of cams tomorrow

They are still on the wrong way round.

 

[Steve@Avantgarde]

Yeah, they have made a total cock up of that if the gears are in that position. No wonder it rattles.

 

[Botus]

They are still on the wrong way round.

exactly, timing irrelevant (if the picture is correct), people are saying it has the wrong sprocket / variator on each cam
exhaust and inlet will run different timing (valve opening).

anyway more exciting for me... the big hump in the chain between each sprocket !!!

are we saying merc are animals and tension between the two cams ?
I can see if the timing is tweaked by a sensor it could work around wear and tear of either a guide or a tensioner in the wrong place but in basic engineering terms that's awful

 

[Wighty]

If as the experts say they are the wrong way round , at least you have photographic evidence if they try and charge you for that part of the work !

 

[umblecumbuz]

If, as MB state, the car was not timed when you took that photo, then when did they time it? Did you hear the engine running in its 'pre-timed' state? If so, maybe that did some damage.

If you took a photo now, would the cam timing be correct as Star indicates above? Worth checking.

MB seem to have shot themselves in the foot, with clear photograhic evidence if you need it.

 

[Oldspanners]

Been in touch with the garage they say when i took that picture, the engine wasnt timed up, the variators only fit in one position because they have dowels and the while they were removing the tensioner, no idea what any of that means! He thinks its lack of oil to the head and will be contacting the supplier of cams tomorrow

Did they change the cams as well?
Really looks like they are far from MB repair experts. I'm not an expert either but if they have the cam gears on the wrong camshafts and the valve timing miles out I'm surprised it runs at all without damage. A detailed explanation is required first thing Monday as it doesn't look good. Sorry.

 

[Mercmo]

I know we feel we are being fed aload of rubbish by them but not much we can do. The explanation they gave for the cams (yes they have just replaced them) being the wrong way round is they were only on to hold something in place while they removed the tensioner, I am far from anysort of mechanical engineer but it all sounds fishy to me.

P.S. the garage in question is mentioned on this forum and has good reviews