When did Mercs become lemons

[Jensen]

When was it that the quality of Mercs deteriated ie up to what year was this 1999/2000.
Up to what age would you expect you get a good reliable C220 CDI

 

[jeffhosier]

My Oct '98 C250TD hasn't been bad up to 87,000 miles. Certainly not a lemon, but not as well made or engineered as the Subaru and Hondas I had before.

It's now beginning to play up a bit, so I'm changing, probably to a BMW.

I'd suggest that the real problem is the dealer network which failed to respond properly to Mercedes' manufacturing problems. I'm happy to believe that Mercedes can, and probably has, addressed the build quality issue. But my local dealer ...


Jeff

 

[turbo man]

i must just LOL @ 'I'd suggest that the real problem is the dealer network which failed to respond properly to Mercedes' manufacturing problems'
i work at a dealer, and if we had back up from the factory we could sort the crap DC have been building (throwing together???) for the last few years
the 211 E class is the biggest pile of **** u could find it now has a list of repairs as long as your arm for us to sort out - if we could get the bits!
the reason we cant fix most cars is coz the bits or service info inst avalible
!
New today...donot change dash's on 211s cos the milage will jump up DC have no idea why, or how to fix!
we are between a rock and a hard place / DC and customers
BTW if i get found out who i am, i will probs be looking for a job! se you at Lexus!

 

[OlafMaxwell]

Turbo Man, thats interesting. I also keep a trusty Peugeot. The Peugeot dealer always has these things called service bulletins, telling him of various fixes for problems. These are not necessarily warranty items, just things that happen as the cars get older. One of the things I noticed and raised with MB here was the fact that MB dealers get nothing but we thought this was because the distributor was the problem and did not give out information. It was very clear to me getting an MB dealer to fixthe car they were acting like they were trying to play snooker in the dark. Any member of a profession, architects, engineers, lawyers etc all get things called Practice Notes etc stating procedures etc for specific issues or problems. Are you saying Mercedes factory dont give this type of informationto the dealers?

Having said all that it was MB who told me my exhaust failure at 4k from new was 'wear and tear', also that brake failure at 5 months after a previous brake failure was also wear and tear, suspension failure at 23k is wear and tear. It took three MB dealers six attempts to replace a faulty oil level sensor on my car. It took another MB dealer to charge for rotating the wheels when clearly they did not do it.

Who is codding who?

 

[jberks]

Wasn't it 97 that it all went downhill ? My 95 C is great.
It's interesting to hear that the dealers don't get the backup from MB. This goes a long way to explain why they all seem to be poor, despite being separate competing companies.
Out of interest, are the 'enhancements' done automatically at services?, so if I were to buy a used 2-3 year old 211 in a couple of year's time, is it likely to be vaguely sorted or am I going to end up with an original factory built bag of cr_p ?
I don't really want a BM (I don't drive badly enough) but .....

 

[flyingtech55]

Is it possible the yanks are doing this purpose. Mercedes were always seen as a quality make here as well as in the 'states. So if the yanks can buy into the brand and trash it then they sell more Fords, Caddies etc.

 

[jberks]

Fair point tech, but wasn't it MB that bought Chrysler ? They said it was a 'merger' but only one party had any cash!
That said, I have an 02 Jeep and its a hell of a lot more reliable than my Merc.
Can't comment on the dealer as I've never had call to meet him!

 

[Ednamillion]

Jensen,

As you know from another thread I have a particular fondness for the W124 E-class and it seems to me - from afar and with no inside knowledge - that the subsequent E (W211, is it?) marked the start of the decline. Not sure what the situation is with build quality/reliability of the models (S, SL, C) whose life span traversed this time ('95/'96).

It may simply be a case of 'square lights-good; amorphous lights-baaaad'...or 'any Benz that doesn't have a black fascia-top - baaad'.

Edna'...

 

[turbo man]

yes we do get service bulletins, loads of them, but 1/2 the time we have to wait ages to get the answers we need, plus parts are always in sort supply, there is a enhancment program on 211 (current E) but loads of the bits you just cant get
as for being separate competing companies if you dig deep you will find that dealer close to each other are often owned by the same company thats hard to see coz most are called mercedes benz of (town)
ask who owns the garage and 9/10 will be the same as the next nearest dealer
often the enhancemests are done without telling the owner but this is not only true with merc but most others to

 

[OlafMaxwell]

Turboman is more like the kind of person I like to meet at a dealer. I agree too about the dealer ownership. The Peugeot dealer I use is a single outlet, a family business which has one other outlet selling Fiat/Alfa which I have often dealt with. When you go into there you meet the owner...he could be showing a car, cleaning the showroom floor, meeting a customer,and he does not hide in an office.

The MB dealer I use is a 70 mile drive and is also a family owned business. You get to meet the man who does the work to your car. The MB dealers I had so much grief with are part of a chain called MSL.

I am impressed by the honest answers, I was always used to that sort of honesty at the garage too.

 

[peterchurch]

Turbo man Its really cool to see someone prepared to stand by their principles 8) my local dealers are sytners group...
Last week I had to take my car into Bristol to have the windscreen replaced (2nd time as this one had a fault) RAC replaced the first one and in my opinion it was not a bad job... There was a mix up and MB ended up doing the replacement, Unfortunately the muppet that did the job messed up my vin plate. When I came to collect my car it was tucked up next to the bins, and covered in bird sh1t... I asked that the car be washed and they obliged When I pointed out that what was wrong they agreed to redo the screen and charge the chap that did it for the work
I was pretty annoyed about it at the time as I kind of expected that MB would have checked what the third party had done to my car before signing it off and subsequently washed the car to present the work...
I also saw signs of abuse towards a customers vehicle, when a windscreen technician had to move another 129 to change its screen...

I think working in MB must take the patients of a saint. Every customer that I saw while I was there was a "Primo Donna" and in my opinion all of them were out of order in the way they addressed the staff... I can see their point when things are not going their way but if that was a typical day in the life of MB staff its no wonder we get the service we get regardless of support from MB...

 

[OlafMaxwell]

Interesting comment about how customers treat MB staff. I never really thought much about that. #

My first trip to MB service was with a high spec E320 cdi estate and I was pretty much treated like a leper by the staff in two MB dealershps, including the one where it went for first service. I never met such condescending s**ts in my life. I could have a pint with any of the guys in the Peugeot garage, some of them are my customers, I would not give the MB staff at my local MB garage the time of day now. I am normally regarded as a nice quiet guy, being nice gets you nowhere in an MB garage. Seems to me the only way to get service is to do that, treat them like you are a prima donna. It did not come naturally to me, I hate it, but it was the only way I was able to get a response of any kind from MB.

Seems to me.......treat customers badly they revolt.........