Are Starter Motors Interchangeable?

[steve kane]

Hello everyone, I wonder if someone with an in depth knowledge of Mercs could tell me which models share the same Starter-motor as my 1995 non turbo C250D, Im on the lookout for a replacement as mine often spins up but refuses to engage, Im hopeing that its really just a soliniod fault rather than Ring Gear, anyway knowing which models to look out for at the scrapyard would be really helpfull, Oh and of course if anyone has one for sale within striking distance of Ringwood/Bournemouth I would of course be intrested, look forward to hearing from you all,
Steve.

 

[television]

Steve your best way is to trawl through the cars that have the same engine, then there is a good chance that they are the same,,you can use the ruskie site

There is a good chance that the 124 cars use the same engine and motor, or even the 201

http://www.detali.ru/cat/oem_mb0.asp?TP=1

The diesel starters could be larger than the petrol versions

Do check the grounding strap and live connection as we had that fault recently

 

[steve kane]

Many thanks for the prompt reply Malcolm, I will check out the site you provided, my trouble is that the Merc Numbers (mines a 202 old chap!!) rather freak me out and after several years of Merc Ownership Im really still not too clued up on the various models except where the "name" as presented on the car is used, ie C250,, but I will give it a go. Your Starter Fault, was it a failure to engage or to actually operate? Mine seems to start spinning before it engages, something I thought Pre Engaged starters were not supposed to do,,,but perhaps this is not so, Im hopeing that either its a faulty Soliniod not throwing the pinion into gear or perhaps a sticky shaft,, what do you think?
Steve.

 

[television]

If it spins before it engages, that would indicate traces of oil on the starter motor shaft the the pinion spins on, this can cause the pinion to stick, giving the symptoms you say.

It could be worth taking it off and washing the pinion assembly in petrol then trying again,,It could be that the rear oil seal on the engine leaks a touch

 

[wireman]

Its probably a Bosch unit, and it would be no surprise to find it common across a range of similar sized engines (and other makers) this could make it much easier to source a second hand unit if you can identify which may be good candidates. Find the ten digit bosch number (with the magneto symbol at the begining) on its label and this is the number to chase rather than the MB part.

The starters on most cars are almost all of the pre engaged type in which the soleniod engages the pinion before the contacts close to turn the motor, most can be dismantled and reassembled without great difficulty and I would be looking for a worn or broken part around the forked see saw like lever that connects the solenoid armature (the iron piston that goes through the solenoid) to the pinion.
Take care to get all the bits back in their original places if you dismantle the pinion/solenoid assembly and don't over tighten the nuts on the electrical bits, being made of a copper alloy they are not the strongest of threads and will strip easily if you are over enthusiastic.

The only way to find out what's going on is remove the starter and examine the thing. Disconnect the battery earth strap first so that you don't short the electrically hot side of the battery (+ve) to earth/ground/body.
From your description its obvious that the solenoid is travelling fully or the motor would not spin, the chance of it being stuck with oil is negligible, this was the common fault on bendix inertia pinions but yours is pre engaged with a mighty punch being available from the solenoid to the pinion.

If there is a decent auto electrical place near you they may well be able to help with any small parts you may need, there is some commonality of parts on bosch starters.

If you bench test the starter beware of the pinion crushing your fingers and the tremendous starting torque flinging the motor off the bench.

 

[television]

Thank you wireman and I accept what you say on the way that it works and thank you for writing it out

 

[steve kane]

Many thanks to you all and apoligies for not replying sooner, all the above is very intresting and to this I will add the little I have discovered, I belive that certain Merc Starter Motors have a set of Planetary Gears between the armature and the pinion, I think that its most likly that its these gears which are at fault on mine rather than the pinion/ring gear which lead fairly cossetted lives with a pre engaged starter motor.
My Starter Motor(fitted to a late 95 W202 D) is intrestingly quite different it seems to E Class starters I was shown at the breakers and ferriting through ebay advts for new starters it apears there are lots of different types and fittings, for instance the older c250D (mine) is completly different to the newer C220D ect, its all quite bewildering and you find yourself longing for the days when there really only seemed to be one or two types. My present Starter is a Bosch 004 151 6701 and I think these are rated at around 2.3kw, some others might just be the same fitting (though Im not sure about this?) but are rated at a lower power output, poss only 1.8kw, I guess for petrol models, and I have been warned about being sold one of these cheaply as whilst they work they are rather over stressed on a diesel and are said not to last. I have also seen Lucas Starters advertised on ebay, part no LRS611, which are said to fit my car.
I have today fired off several notes to Ebay Sellers asking for quotes and I will let you know how I get along. Im also going to float off an advt in the Spares Sect on this site as I would be happy enough with a used one, once again, thanks for your help,
Steve.

 

[roofless]

had a look you have two makes bosch & valeo the part numbers match with most w202 c200 c220 c250d & some w124 e250d & some w210 e200d e220d

 

[steve kane]

Many thanks indeed, thats quite intresting, however does it mean that a used Bosch starter off say a c220 will bolt on but be of a lower power? from my "research" of the fitment lists on ebay the c220 is not the same starter as mine,,,,I must say that I would have thought that for instance an E 250D would have been the same as mine though, whereabout have you looked up your info, is it accesseable to me?
The concern I have of course is that if I buy a used Starter listed as being from another model and it did not fit I would be lumbered,,,
Steve.

 

[roofless]

Many thanks indeed, thats quite intresting, however does it mean that a used Bosch starter off say a c220 will bolt on but be of a lower power? from my "research" of the fitment lists on ebay the c220 is not the same starter as mine,,,,I must say that I would have thought that for instance an E 250D would have been the same as mine though, whereabout have you looked up your info, is it accesseable to me?
The concern I have of course is that if I buy a used Starter listed as being from another model and it did not fit I would be lumbered,,,
Steve.

sorrrry i only looked at the diesels just forgot to type the d & no the part numbers are the same so the starter is the same .if you look at the link from tv click a model like c200d then on the right click engine electrical equipment then look at the starter part number a lot of diesels match but not cdi

 

[steve kane]

Many thanks again to both yourself for the info and to TV for the link, I will have to sit down and work out useing the info above if one of the used ebay ones will fit, I hope so, I also noticed that on the parts diagrams the part numbers over on the right hand side say "To 004--------" this is very useful to know as I was previously looking for my exact number, in fact I think I did see some listed that were close to mine, I will nip off and have a look,,,,many thanks and I will let you know how I get along.
Steve.

 

[television]

Many thanks again to both yourself for the info and to TV for the link, I will have to sit down and work out useing the info above if one of the used ebay ones will fit, I hope so, I also noticed that on the parts diagrams the part numbers over on the right hand side say "To 004--------" this is very useful to know as I was previously looking for my exact number, in fact I think I did see some listed that were close to mine, I will nip off and have a look,,,,many thanks and I will let you know how I get along.
Steve.

Do not forget that the diesel starter is not the same as the petrol version