C220 not starting

[Frank Patten]

Hi All, my daughter's c220 sometimes will not start and merc cannot find the fault. It has failed her again this evening and has been towed by the AA to the main agent. Is there a good independent in Hemel Hempstead?

 

[television]

Hello Frank and nice to hear from you,,sorry about the bad news though.

That must be MB direct in Hemel Hempstead..

If they cant find the fault I will take a bet on the crankshaft sensor being at fault £47 from Bosch service center or £87 from MB You will have a Bosch service center in or near Hemel and they are ½ the MB prce.

The CPS does not show up on diagnosis

 

[Frank Patten]

Thanks Television.

I now have a little more information on my daughter's C220cdi ('03 I think)
The the engine only fails to start when the engine is warm or hot, never when cold.
The engine refuses to crank (not battery, there is no sound at all) although I think she can hear the tank fuel pump running.
The display shows Coolant Fault, Display Fault, and System Voltage Malfunction.
All this is from her memory and of course she is not technical. She is not certain if the System Voltage Malfunction contains the word "Voltage" but it is certainly 3 words.

Should I be looking at the OVP? It seems to be something of a cure-all!
The battery is about 3 years old.

The car is now with Hemel Hempstead main agent and I have told my daughter to get the error codes from them. I will update when I have more info.

 

[television]

Hello again,,if the engine does not crank, then forget the CPS.
this could be an EIS fault on the ignition switch, an 03 car willl have a DAS11 or 111 and they can fail in this manner

 

[psmart]

A similarity to my C220 dash issue a few weeks back, the car wouldnt crank until I disconnected the battery, made sure everything was off, re-connected and jumped in and started! The voltage seemed reasonable when I measured it (>12 volts)! I replaced the battery and havent had a problem since!

 

[colechelle]

Starter is on its way out, when the fault happens again lift the front fuse cover, disconnect the 6-7 pin plug with the purple wire, flash 12volts down it and i bet your find a heavy flash, if not then starter relay, but un-common!!

 

[Frank Patten]

Hi Television,

The mechanic at MB Direct in H/Hempstead concurs with you, he also thinks it is the ignition switch. It has to be ordered from Germany. I still hope to get the fault codes, if I do I will post them.

Best regards, Frank.

 

[Frank Patten]

Hi All,

I am not going to get any fault codes from merc Direct, my daughter is now informed that the ignition is not recognising the electronic key so a new ingnition lock and 2 new keys have been ordered from Germany. The price? £800!!!

Thanks Television for your diagnosis, it helped my daughter accept the horrible price!

 

[television]

Hi All,

I am not going to get any fault codes from merc Direct, my daughter is now informed that the ignition is not recognising the electronic key so a new ingnition lock and 2 new keys have been ordered from Germany. The price? £800!!!

Thanks Television for your diagnosis, it helped my daughter accept the horrible price!

You do not have to get the new keys,, MB can supply the ignition switch without the keys,,that will knock £300 to£400 off the price

 

[colechelle]

thats because they havent got any codes, still put money on the starter!!!

 

[Frank Patten]

Hi All,

My daughter has visited Merc Direct in hemel Hempstead and had a serious talk to them. She has also shown them a complete printout of this thread. This is what they have offered:

Reduced price on next service – car will be classed under a 6 year reduced price service with full valeting/body/leather work etc.
Car delivered back to me from Bushey garage to her home.
Will look at price quoted and will attempt to reduce it
Will refund £90 of incurred costs from initial AA breakdown, taxis to and from train station, parking etc. (because they had failed to find the fault earlier)
A donation of merchandising i.e. t-shirt, hat etc. Donated for her school christmas auction!
The manager she spoke to will interview the mechanic on Monday
And a very appologeticservice!!

Hopefully we will get more information on Monday.

 

[television]

Hi All,

My daughter has visited Merc Direct in hemel Hempstead and had a serious talk to them. She has also shown them a complete printout of this thread. This is what they have offered:

Reduced price on next service – car will be classed under a 6 year reduced price service with full valeting/body/leather work etc.
Car delivered back to me from Bushey garage to her home.
Will look at price quoted and will attempt to reduce it
Will refund £90 of incurred costs from initial AA breakdown, taxis to and from train station, parking etc. (because they had failed to find the fault earlier)
A donation of merchandising i.e. t-shirt, hat etc. Donated for her school christmas auction!
The manager she spoke to will interview the mechanic on Monday
And a very appologeticservice!!

Hopefully we will get more information on Monday.

Will I have to wear a mask the next time I go in there:mrgreen:

 

[Frank Patten]

further information:

After reading up on this forum about ignition keys I get the strong impression that if the key is not recognised then there is no noise when the key is inserted from the steering lock withdrawing and the key cannot be turned. Is this so?

I have just spoken to my son-in-law and he cannot remember if there was a noise from the lock withdrawing but he said the key could be turned, suggesting that the key has been recognised.

As the fault only happens when the car is warm or hot does this suggest the starter relay or the solenoid on the starter motor is failing when warm as Colechele is suggesting?

 

[television]

Thats a hard question as the ign switch is a multi circuit device, though it may release the steering the start function can fail, although its all part of the EIS its not on the same lines, its a rare thing, but it is a listed fault and I can remember one other case here

 

[Anne]

Update on car

Mereceds have just called me back updating me on the situation. I asked about whether I need the keys ordered as well as the ignition switch and he basically said no, but if the new ignition won't recognise the old keys he'd have to order them, delaying my car by a further week to 10 days. Guess I need to decide what's more important, having my car back or dropping the bill by £300.

Anne

 

[Anne]

Just had a call back from mercedes, they still have my car, which now has a new ignition switch, new keys and new programming from Germany but is now showing a fault with the control unit. They've raised the issue with technical and are going back to Germany to ask for a loaned control unit to see if that fixes the fault. If it does we will need to buy a new one costing £1000.

I have no knowledge of cars other than the basics but I'm starting to feel like I'm either being taken for a ride or they don't quite know what's wrong with my car. They've now had the car for almost 2 weeks.

Can anyone shed any light on this?

Many thanks

Anne

p.s. the car is working and does start but is showing a fault

 

[television]

Hello Anne,,sadly electronic faults are not easy for garage guys,, the never set out to be electronic engineers in the first place but they have been forced into it.

OK there is the one bit that I do not understand,,sure the fault could leave a code, but once cleared if the fault does come back then that item should be at fault.

If its worthwhile your old keys will sell on Ebay for £30 each

 

[Anne]

I get the impression that once the first fault was cleared they could identify the second/main fault.

The control unit which has gone is the engine control module. The service team manager I'm dealing with reckons the control unit caused the ignition switch to fail along with the keys, which also explains the collant error, once they corrected that and uploaded the correct programming, the car then started but showed a new error. By wednesday/thursday of next week they should be able to get a loaned control unit to see if that corrects the fault, if it does we then pay for it! Not sure what happens if it doesn't solve the problems!

Many thanks

Anne

 

[Anne]

I have now managed to get the fault codes out of Mercedes, but they don't match any on my list that I've obtained from the internet, I'd be very interested if anyone can supply the title for each code.

I've listed them in the order they were given to me, not sure if it's the order they occured though.

B1036
B1102
B1000
P2312
P2311
C1038
C1022

Many thanks

Anne

 

[dragon]

They are all MB generic. Cole will be able to help you.

If mine arrives in a couple of days time, I may be able to help you.

It looks like one the ME/HSE - Engine Management performance parameters. You have to get Merc to fix it anyway.