Driving Through Standing Water, How Well Does Your Car Do?

[as400]

Even when the country wasn't strapped for cash the authorities that be seemed very reluctant to replace concrete stretches of motorway with porous tarmac that eliminates both standing water and spray.

I mean if the safety camera partnership really gave a tiddlywink about safety they would campaign against concrete roads as I would imagine there are many accidents caused by excess water/spray each year.

Having said that I wanted to hear other peoples experiences of car characteristics when driving through pools of standing water at speed (70mph) on dual carriageways and motorways. On a bit of a dash last week to Heathrow through some heavy rain I was surprised that my E class felt like it was totally shifting sideways when it hit the water, the tyres are Michelin Primacy about half worn, maybe I should get the tracking checked.

Does anyone else find their car parts the waves like Moses?...any particular brand of tyres that excel at water dispersal?

 

[drmw]

standing water + 70mph = aquaplaning regardless of tyres

 

[kth286]

I am inclined to think you were not driving according to the conditions.

 

[as400]

I am inclined to think you were not driving according to the conditions.

Possibly so, I did slow down to 60 and changed lane because there was a LOT of cars behind me quite happy to be doing 80+ through the large puddles/small lakes and didn't seem to have any problems at all which is what led me to think my car had a problem.

 

[Alex M Grieve]

Possibly so, I did slow down to 60 and changed lane because there was a LOT of cars behind me quite happy to be doing 80+ through the large puddles/small lakes and didn't seem to have any problems at all which is what led me to think my car had a problem.

I don't think your car is unusual. It is really only a problem if you try cornering at the same time.

 

[dieselman]

maybe I should get my head checked.

Probably not a bad idea...

 

[hairyg]

Yes, standing water + speed = aquaplaning. The wider the tyres the worse it gets, so a cheap Korean import on narrow tyres will be less inclined to aquaplane than your well-shod E Class. The degree of wear makes a big difference as well, the reduction in water dispersal doesn't seem to be proportional to the wear, so half worn tyres are less than half as good at shifting water as a new set, in my experience anyway.

I've learnt to treat standing water with respect, not least because it can hide tooth-rattling potholes or worse.

 

[television]

Often the water is deeper on one side of the road more than the other and this will pull the car.
Ignore those going past you on those conditions, you get the same lunatics in fog, sadly lacking any sense or understanding of these things

 

[as400]

Probably not a bad idea...

So you went to the trouble of using my original quote, then changing it to try and make your response look funny and hope people would laugh at you and think you were some kind of comedian?

 

[dieselman]

So you went to the trouble of using my original quote, then changing it to try and make your response look funny and hope people would laugh at you and think you were some kind of comedian?

No. I genuinely think that if you drive so fast through standing water that it pulls the car around, then ask for guidance on a web forum, you really should have a good think about your driving style and ability to reason.

You were obviously driving too fast for the conditions.

 

[as400]

No. I genuinely think that if you drive so fast through standing water that it pulls the car around, then ask for guidance on a web forum, you really should have a good think about your driving style and ability to reason.

You were obviously driving too fast for the conditions.

Oh I see!, so when I also posted that I adjusted my speed, slowed down and changed lane so the other cars could speed past....well presumably you didn't read that post?....otherwise it would have put a dent into your (un)clever witticism?

I mean for someone to notice that their car wasn't clearing water well and who adjusts their speed accordingly and lets other cars overtake....this somehow in Dieselmans brain necessitates the fake adjustment of a posters comment in order for his own post suggesting that I "get my head checked" (your quote I hasten to add not mine as you lie).

Are you aware of the laws concerning defamation of character?

Your logic or should I say illogic as is now becoming apparent that my correct actions necessitate the need for professional psychological examination makes you look the more foolish.

And you question my ability to reason?....could I suggest it is your ability to reason or lack of it together with your underhand methodology that you use in order to attempt to look superior that you should be concentrating on?

Also I was not seeking guidance, I asked for other peoples opinions there is a difference.

Your mechanical knowledge on this forum is of good use to many people and I am sure we collectively thank you for that, perhaps you would do well to concentrate on this speciality.

 

[jberks]

The original question was, if I understand it, when you go down the motorway, perhaps a tad faster than would be idea, and hit a patch of standing water, does the car track straight or if it doesn't, do you have a fault?
Fair question.

I get a bit tired of the holier than thou attitude we sometimes get on this forum. Yes I am aware of the condition and yes I slow down in poor conditions, but have I ever been a bit late and pressed on a bit harder than I may have liked? Yes I have, and so has everyone else on this thread who has a driving licence and uses the road network to get to meetings, airports, job interviews, childrens birthday parties and other time sensitive locations. Sorry, we're human and as great as we are, none of us maintains a 100% perfection record 100% of the time, so lets get off our pedestals.

On the question, there are 2 factors at play here. As has been said, the affected wheel is almost certainly aquaplaning but assuming the other 3 tyres are holding their own, this is no reason to worry unnecesarily, unless you're cornering at the same time. At 70, you're through the pool in less than a second and the traction of the other 3 wheels won't let you slip off the road. The second factor is more of a concern. hitting standing water at that speed causes severe drag on that wheel as it goes in. It's effectively like stamping on the brake on that wheel alone. This is what you feel and why the car will twitch and the steering wheel will twitch. The concern is that if the other 3 tyres were on the limit of grip at that moment, that yaw effect could steer the car. I have seen the traction light flicker (well I think I did, my attention was on the road but something amber flickered in the corner of my eye) at such a moment which tells me that without ESP I may have been in trouble and perhaps I should be backing off a bit more than I already had.
Anyway - if the above sounds like what you're feeling, then its probably normal. As has been said, new tyres will always help with water dispersal (raising the level where the other 3 tyres would give up) but the affected tyre, no matter how new, is probably without grip for that moment. Tracking issues don't really come into it (less relevant on a wet road) so theres no point having this adjusted if its happy on a dry road.

On the 'argument', speaking as a mod, I don't approve of people quoting others and changing their comments in the process for humerous effect. As mates, do whatever you like to each other, but only with tacit consent, doing it to people you don't know will only result in bad feeling. A quote should be a literal quote (or its not a quote).

 

[Mic]

As wheels and tyres have become wider and wider over recent decades the problem has heightened.....narrower tyres ''cut through'' standing water much more effectively than wider tyres.
My old Volvo is much easier to handle in such adverse conditions than my SL.

Mic

 

[television]

As wheels and tyres have become wider and wider over recent decades the problem has heightened.....narrower tyres ''cut through'' standing water much more effectively than wider tyres.
My old Volvo is much easier to handle in such adverse conditions than my SL.

Mic

A very good point Mic

 

[as400]

The original question was, if I understand it, when you go down the motorway, perhaps a tad faster than would be idea, and hit a patch of standing water, does the car track straight or if it doesn't, do you have a fault?
Fair question.

I get a bit tired of the holier than thou attitude we sometimes get on this forum. Yes I am aware of the condition and yes I slow down in poor conditions, but have I ever been a bit late and pressed on a bit harder than I may have liked? Yes I have, and so has everyone else on this thread who has a driving licence and uses the road network to get to meetings, airports, job interviews, childrens birthday parties and other time sensitive locations. Sorry, we're human and as great as we are, none of us maintains a 100% perfection record 100% of the time, so lets get off our pedestals.

On the question, there are 2 factors at play here. As has been said, the affected wheel is almost certainly aquaplaning but assuming the other 3 tyres are holding their own, this is no reason to worry unnecesarily, unless you're cornering at the same time. At 70, you're through the pool in less than a second and the traction of the other 3 wheels won't let you slip off the road. The second factor is more of a concern. hitting standing water at that speed causes severe drag on that wheel as it goes in. It's effectively like stamping on the brake on that wheel alone. This is what you feel and why the car will twitch and the steering wheel will twitch. The concern is that if the other 3 tyres were on the limit of grip at that moment, that yaw effect could steer the car. I have seen the traction light flicker (well I think I did, my attention was on the road but something amber flickered in the corner of my eye) at such a moment which tells me that without ESP I may have been in trouble and perhaps I should be backing off a bit more than I already had.
Anyway - if the above sounds like what you're feeling, then its probably normal. As has been said, new tyres will always help with water dispersal (raising the level where the other 3 tyres would give up) but the affected tyre, no matter how new, is probably without grip for that moment. Tracking issues don't really come into it (less relevant on a wet road) so theres no point having this adjusted if its happy on a dry road.

On the 'argument', speaking as a mod, I don't approve of people quoting others and changing their comments in the process for humerous effect. As mates, do whatever you like to each other, but only with tacit consent, doing it to people you don't know will only result in bad feeling. A quote should be a literal quote (or its not a quote).

Excellent reply many thanks for that. I think I will be looking for four new tyres and will fork out for the confirmation that the tracking is spot on too.

As it's blowing a gale out there presently and bucketing it down am sure it will be money well spent!

 

[wemorgan]

I hope this table is of some use. There's quite a difference in the wet weather performance of some tyres.

http://forums.mercedesclub.org.uk/showpost.php?p=593349&postcount=2

 

[dieselman]

Excellent reply many thanks for that. I think I will be looking for four new tyres and will fork out for the confirmation that the tracking is spot on too.

It won't be the tracking as if it was far enough out to pull the car it would be shredding tyres in a few hundred miles at best. A quick look at the tread wear pattern will show if this is the problem.

What's happening with your car is that due to the wide(ish) tyres a wedge of water builds up in front of the tyre. Eventually the front tyres lift off the road surface. As it's a RWD car the wheels then rapidly slow down so building more water in front and steerage is lost, but the rear wheels continue to push the car along.
The pushing from the rear combined with the front wheels losing traction makes the car skew.

Other cars may fair better due to having narrower tyres and being FWD, because the tyres bite through the water better, and as they are driven wheels they resist the wedge of water until a higher speed is reached, because they then spin quicker so continue to remove water instead of building a wedge.

What you are experiencing is just a characteristic of RWD cars with wide tyres.

Sorry for being ratty earlier, I was indeed having fun at your expense.

 

[Developer]

Good for you Will.

It's a mature approach like yours that stops these arguments getting out of hand.

On the subject of tyres, every magazine tyre test includes an aquaplaning analysis and tyres are rated with it as a charactertisic.

That tells me that different tyres behave in different ways when confronted with standing water. With as400 entering it quickly the effects would be magnified and a different brand of tyres may have acted differently (though probably not much different at speed).

It may not be the car at all, but speed/brand/rwd characteristics.

 

[st4]

Aye, not so bad on the "74" today but as a word of caution the rural roads often have big puddles on one side and that can "pull" the car due to the braking effect on one side of the car.

I was on a lovely road (A713) and love to give it some on that run, but it would not be so prudent to go very fast as there were big pools of standing water.

My advice, take it easy, powerful RWD cars with wide tyres (245) are not so good in the rain, amusing yes.

 

[Naraic]

Splashing through puddles is a great way to clean the underside of the car.