Faulty battery?

[bigjobby01]

05:00 this morning I came to start my 1997 C200 and nothing, not even turning over, but all the lights work. After a walk to work and a search on the forum, I found a post about even if 1 cell is down on the bettery and the voltage is less than 11v, the Merc won't run. Is this applicable to this year/type of Merc? I have only just got the car from a garage and take it, it could have been stood for a while. I have given it a good drive though. Also, to change the battery, is it just 1 off 1 on, or is there any other resets/procedures?

 

[bigjobby01]

Fitted a new battery and it started OK. Now the ABS/ASR warning lights are on. In the handbook it says when the voltage is below 10v this will happen but when it is above the lights will go off. The battery was tested at the shop and it was fine. It isn't a cheap one, I went for a heavy duty branded one. I have driven it a couple of miles and they are still on?? Any ideas on how to reset these?

 

[robbo]

I think you may need to turn the steering wheel from lock to lock to reset the steering angle sensor.

 

[bigjobby01]

Thanks for the reply, I'll give it a go

 

[television]

If you cant re set, disconnect battery, wait 5 mins and reconnect, should solve the problem.

Malcolm

 

[MW]

The funny thing about modern batteries is that when they go, they just stop dead. In the old days a bad battery gave lots of warning. Once drove to and from work normally and then 120 miles on the motorway. Next morning.....nothing. Battery at 9 volts. They are much better now, but they just go dead and die completely at the end.
With new batteries, I never know how long is has had on the shelf, so I always give them an overnight trickle charge, before use. Nothing like starting out with all connections clean, copper greased, and a new battery at 100%.

 

[television]

The funny thing about modern batteries is that when they go, they just stop dead. In the old days a bad battery gave lots of warning. Once drove to and from work normally and then 120 miles on the motorway. Next morning.....nothing. Battery at 9 volts. They are much better now, but they just go dead and die completely at the end.
With new batteries, I never know how long is has had on the shelf, so I always give them an overnight trickle charge, before use. Nothing like starting out with all connections clean, copper greased, and a new battery at 100%.

Batteries have not changed that much over the years, with modern cars, with quite a few relays, it is these that cant cope with the lower voltages.
One cell going high resistance is still very common, more so in the cold weather, big problem being when fully charged and working, there is no way of testing, its only when you go to start the car the next morning that you turn the key and nothing happens. Once that has happened, you are wasting your time in trying to charge it.

Malcolm

 

[bigjobby01]

Disconnected battery for 5 mins, reconnected. ASR/ABS warning lights still on, turned from lock to lock and still on. The only thing I have done is replace the battery, they were OK before. Not a good start to owning my 1st Merc.

Any other ideas guys?

 

[television]

OK your BAS module is of an early type . A fault could be recorded for under or over battery voltage, in this case the fault code needs to be erased, the second problem is to do with an interuption of the CAN BUS that also leaves a stored fault that needs to be erased, Later cars do not have this problem and many people do change the BAS module for a later type. Have the fault codes removed, and with luck that will be the end of it, with not so much luck the Module will have to be replaced.

Malcolm

 

[bigjobby01]

Thanks for the reply Television. Can the local dealer do this under my 3 month warranty where I bought the car? Or will it be the usual not covered. If not is it an expensive job? Am I OK driving the car?

 

[television]

Thanks for the reply Television. Can the local dealer do this under my 3 month warranty where I bought the car? Or will it be the usual not covered. If not is it an expensive job? Am I OK driving the car?

Yes this should be done under warranty, as it is not your fault, This BAS module would normally be changed for the later type. I know that warranties often excludes batteries. I think that the car may have also been started by a booster , or jump stated after standing on the fore court or show room. This is a practice that should not be done to an MB. this would cause the fault. Go back to the dealer and ask nicely, if this fails I would make so much noise that he would pay me to go away. If you want any back up, pleas ask.
You could also point out to the dealer that selling the car with a duff battery has brought this fault about. I guarantee that the car has been jump started. if you have only had the car a couple of weeks,he cant exclude the battery, from any warranty.

Malcolm

Print all of these threads out and take along with you

 

[bigjobby01]

I actually only picked the car up on Friday afternoon, I have also been on 12 hr shifts Sat/Sun day, so I haven't had any real time with my new pride and joy. I will contact the seller tomorrow and ask nicely.

This forum has been invaluable to me so far, thanks for all the info, I'll let you know what happens

At this rate of posting I'll be getting my avatar access soon

 

[robbo]

Don't worry, the W202 C class has a good reputation for reliability so once you have sorted out these small niggles I am sure things will be fine.

 

[television]

I forgot to add that you are OK to drive the car.

Malcolm

 

[bigjobby01]

Just one other thing (for now) assuming I get away with resetting the warning, will this be the case every time the battery is disconnected ie ASR/ABS warning lights?

 

[bigjobby01]

Spoke to the dealer, he said the battery isn't covered by the warranty and because I disconnected it and caused the alarm that wasn't covered either Had to argue to get him to agree to pay for a diagnostic and hopefully reset the alarm. I don't hold much faith in him for the reset of the warranty....

 

[television]

Just one other thing (for now) assuming I get away with resetting the warning, will this be the case every time the battery is disconnected ie ASR/ABS warning lights?

No not the normal case. the dealer knew that the battery had gone, he had been jump starting it. I really feel that you are being taken for a ride on this.
I have asked Jberks to give some advice.he can do that so much better than me.

Malcolm

 

[television]

I get upset that you are getting ripped off, read this posted by Tiny Tim


Thanks for the continued interest in this one.

An update: MB did take an interest in this one. But they wanted a MB dealer to strip down the engine first to determine the cause of the problem - at my cost (approx 10 hours @ £90 + VAT) - before making a judgement call. Thereafter the dealer would apply to the factory for goodwill and then MB for goodwill. No one would commit to paying back anything, so I could be another grand out of pocket. So I took another approach and will find out today the outcome: there is a new law regarding Statutory Rights in this country which is specifically targetted at Trade Dealers selling used cars. The law states that after a car is purchased from a dealer, should there be a major fault with the vehicle within 6 months of purchasing it from them, the car is deemed 'not fit for purpose' and may be rejected - yes, returned to them for a full refund! I have used this law against the leasing company who sold me the car. This is news to them and they are running it past their very expensive lawyers. This has caused some consternation amongst them such that they have just paid for an independent inspection (closed engine) of the vehicle to ascertain that it is, in fact, broken. If their lawyer deems that I have a case, they will act according to their legal requirement; if not, I believe that they are going to offer a compromise. They are after all a very reputable company.

You may not have heard of this law as it is new, but I urge all car buyers with serious problems to research it on the Government websites (look under Statutory Rights) and apply it. By the way, the old 'well you get in contact with the warranty company' does not wash because any warranty adds to your rights as a consumer, not replaces them. And the other 'oh, you will have to refer that to the manufacturer/main dealer' does not apply either - it is the trader who sold the car to you who is responsible for fixing it.

I'll let you know how I get on, but the car really does need a new engine.

Regards,
G
Use your rights
Malcolm

 

[bigjobby01]

Very interesting. Maybe I'm panicking and jumping the gun a bit. Hopefully having the car "hooked" the waringing lights will go out and stay out. OK its cost me 60 quid for a decent battery, but brick walls isn't what you need from a dealer when you get a problem. Could be a case of you get what you pay for, the car at the main dealers would have been alot more, but you would expect a difference in car and service. The problem for me is if the warning lights don't go out......We'll wait and see.

 

[jberks]

As I understand it, being a 9 year old car, your legal rights are questionable.
To quote a trading standards site

Your expectations should be different when you are buying a low mileage, two-year-old car than when you are buying a high mileage, ten-year-old one, for example. However, it must still be:

fit to be used on the road;

in a condition which reflects its age and price, and

reasonably reliable.

They could argue that the battery could be expected to go on a 9 year old car, but if that renders it unreliable its another matter. Bottom line, it would be down to the courts and thats not a place you want to go. In any case, if you let the garage put in a battery, you may not get one as good as the one you have bought (they can fit a used one). I think I'd get them to reset the lights and swallow the battery cost. The lights would cost you but not them so you should have less resistance.
In all this I assume its not a top line garage with the "100 point check" line. If it is, I would argue they should have picked this up and should be liable for the battery too.