Front Lower Control Arms--Do they fit?

[kid-jensen]

Guys,

My local parts place has some lower control arms that are for a W124 320TE (Estate).

Does anyone know if they will fit my 320Ce (coupe)?

 

[kth286]

We need the part number of the arms which are on offer, AND we need your 320 car VIN.

Both those will enable a credible feedback to you.

 

[jibcl500]

Should be the same part, post the first 6 digits of your VIN so I can look on EPC.
jib

 

[kid-jensen]

OK,

As usual, things are never simple..... He hssn't actually got the control arms in his possession, but he can get hold of them if I need them. All he says is that they definitely fit a "L" reg 320TE.

Not helpful I know. Anyway, the first 6 numbers of my (320CE) VIN are WBB124052.....

Thanks for the help so far...

 

[kth286]

Paul

how much are they and what make are they.

 

[kid-jensen]

Kth286,

They are "original fit" and he wants 50 quid the pair....

Sounds a good deal, so I'm hoping they will fit my coupe..

 

[kth286]

Paul

I would not fit secondhand ones to my car as they could be worse than the ones taken off.

 

[wireman]

You can fit new balljoints and replace the inner bushes on your old ones, why use some ones cast offs when for just a little more you can have as new ones? The Sportline suspension on some 124s uses a different lower arm.

 

[kid-jensen]

wireman,

The 320CE uses non-replacable ball joints (as I have just found out the hard way) so you are screwed when it comes to your repair options.

The Control arms I've been offered are new, which makes them a bargain.........if they fit.

Still trying to find this out..

 

[kth286]

Paul

Why are you having so much trouble getting hold of the spec (make, part number etc) of the arms ?

Does the guy want to sell them or not ?

A sign of very poor service I would say - beware.

 

[kid-jensen]

kth286,

You have to understand that I'm dealing with a (what once was ) typical corner-shop car accessory place here. A bit tatty, massively in decline (because people don't fix their own cars any more) and probably borderline financially.

He's being a bit defensive because he doesn't know any more than he's told me, but I've been going in there for years and he's always been fair and reasonable to deal with.

All I need to know is if the Control arms are the same between the Coupe and Estate. If they are, I'll grab them with both hands......

jib...did my VIN number help you when looking up the EPC??

 

[kth286]

Paul

As wishbones are SUCH an important item from a safety point of view I would be concerned.

How can a new £25 item compare with a new £220 original item ?

(unless of course they are off the back of a lorry)

I asked for the full VIN because that is the only way to provide a fully credible answer that will be 100% correct for the following reasons:


1. It will show whether you have sportline bushes in your current arms (which use a different rubber compund in the bushes compared to the standad arms.

2. because component design is ALWAYS evolving (even for discontinued models) (in Mercedes case anyway) the VIN will show exactly the latest part number for your generation of 320 coupe (which spanned several years).

The hardness (shear factor) of the wishbone bushes changed over that time.

BUT I guess the ONE vital question that the parts man you are dealing with SHOULD have asked you initially was:

"Do you have sportline chassis sir?"

Was that question asked ???

If not, you need to get out of there.

The significance of that one question alone is vital to get the harmony of good suspension
flow, because the hardness of the wishbone bushes are matched to the spring and damper design of the car.

 

[Richard Moakes]

I concur with David that the sportline question is vital, as is 4-Matic, but that won't apply in your case I guess.

The simple answer is no, they won't fit. Without your full VIN number we can't be sure, but a cursory check on eurocarparts shows different part numbers for E320 Estate and Coupe for a 1995 car.

There are a wide range of opinions about the quality of genuine parts, vs. pattern, vs. OEM, and I don't intend to get into that here, but make sure the parts are either genuine (safest and most expensive) or a well known OEM such as Febi or Lemforder (cheaper, and some believe lower quality).

When you do get hold of the arms, you will also need new camber bolts, as it is almost certain they will be seized into the bushes of the old arms. You will also need the specialised spring compressor tool, or a mechanic with access to one.

And finally, once the job is done, you will need a full suspension alignment as camber, caster and toe will all have changed.

 

[kid-jensen]

Guys,

Thanks for your input so far.

I should have stated that it's not a Sportsline version and the car is "L" reg. (like the Estate that the control arms fit.

I did post the first 6 numbers of the VIN, because that''s what jib asked for.... The whole VIN is WDB1240522B921176. Hopefully, this will help get a definite answer, I'm not sure there's hundreds of coupe owners queuing to buy these, but I don't want to keep putting the shop off with excuses.

About alignment......surely, once the camber has been correctly re-set with the eccentric bolts, the caster and toe will automatically be right if they were right before?

 

[Richard Moakes]

Paul,

I have just checked on EPC, and it seems that for that chassis number, the part numbers are the same as those for a 320TE of similar vintage. As ever with non-genuine parts, you do take the risk that once you have stripped everything down the new parts don't fit nicely.

You are right about caster, but toe is likely to change due to manufacturing tolerances in the arms themselves, a small difference will make a big difference to toe.

 

[kth286]

Paul

Do let us know your progress once you have made the purchase and fitted.

We would be interested in the manufacturer's name and the manufacturer's part number of the item.

The forum is a learning work in progress and this is your opportunity to educate us on this item.

Thanks

 

[kid-jensen]

Guys,

That's the news I was hoping to hear.....Thanks for all the help, I'll keep you informed as what sort of pig the job was....

 

[kid-jensen]

Changing The Lower Control Arms (Wishbones)

Well, thanks to all your input, the job is now done and the MOT in place.

It's traditional at work (where there are a LOT of old cars) to have a proper Celebration down the Pub when someone passes the MOT..... I guess these little traditions are what makes it so good to live in this country!

Anyway, the job itself went reasonably smoothly, this was how I did it:

1. Chock the rear wheels and support the front on axle stands from the inner chassis members.

2. Remove the wheel and the anti roll bar mount on the LCA.

3. Fit the spring Compressor and compress the spring enough to notice it lifting away from one end or the other. Check for movement by levering between the LCA and spring with a screwdriver. Don't overdo the compression, there's a LOT of energy in a spring and your face may not stay the shape nature intended if it lets go.... I used a spring compressor that tightens from inside of the spring...much safer, but a fiddle to fit and remove. IMHO you could do this job with traditional external spring compressoirs, but I wouldn't feel safe with less than three....and it's difficult to fit three in there..

4. With the spring loose, CAREFULLY remove it from the LCA and set it aside where the kids won't play with it. Treat it as an unexploded bomb, because basically, that's what it is.

5. Remove the outer ball-jount pinch-bolt. This was siezed in mine and needed an extra long lever on the socket wrench to move it. You could also hammer it out from the other side but I would imagine you'd need a replacement bolt after.

6. Mark the position of the two inner mounting eccentric bolts with a cold chisel, centre punch or even tipex. Unbolt them and remove. These came out easily on mine, but I hear they often sieze. I would guess an angle grinder would then be needed as there's not much space to swing a big 'ammer.

7. The LCA will now fall off (it's surprisingly heavy for a component that's supposed to be light!) And can be thrown in the shed for the traditional 5-year delay before it goes to the dump....

8. Fit the new LCA starting at the inner eccentric bolts, noting their original positions.

9. CAREFULLY fit the compressed spring into the turret and mounting indent on the droopy LCA.

10. Twist the floppy bit of the ball-joint around until the machined slot in it aligns with where the pinch-bolt will go (facing the engine, parallel to the centre of the car).

11. With a trolley jack (ideally, but any jack will do) gradually raise the outer end of the LCA (and start to sompress the spring) whilst aiming the ball-joint at the "socket" it came out of. As you raise the LCA, the ball-joint will enter the socket and start to appear in the pinch-bolt hole. You may have to eyeball it from several directions to make sure it's going in straight.

12. When the cut-out in the ball-joint aligns with the pinch-bolt hole, it's in the right position and the pinch-bolt should slide easily in. Fit the pinch bolt but and tighten.

13. Slowly uncompress the springs and remove the compressors.

14. Refit the anti-roll bar mount and torque everything up to the figures in the Manual. Sorry, don't have these to hand...

15. That should be it, but whilst the wheel is off, a good squirt round with the Waxoil is always advisable (MOT blokes just love it!) perticularly the inner part of the top of the turrets where W124s tend to rust.

Of course, if you have anything other than the 320-engined W124, all the above ie probably unnecessary because you have replacable ball-joints that cost about nine quid!

Shouldn't complain though, this is the first MOT failure I've had in 6 years, so Mercedes reputation for long life and high mileages is very much intact...

 

[kth286]

Paul

Thanks for feedback, glad you got it sorted.

Was it those cheaper pattern parts you previously talked about, that you fitted ?

If so, what make are they ?

Where can members get them from ?

and finally, what is the normal price ?

Thanks

 

[kid-jensen]

David,

The arms from my "Convenient Local Parts Shop" had been sold when I eventually found out they would fit, so someone got a bargain...... As usual, it wasn't me!

Due to the credit crunch (everyone's blaming it for everything so why should I be different), I went for used arms from Dronsfield. They were about £80 a pair delivered.

They were stated to be genuine Mercedes parts and I've no reason to think otherwise.

A bit of surface rust, so should match the car perfectly! The rust is easily sorted with a wire brush and a good dose of zinc-rich paint or waxoil.

I had to swop over the rubber gaiters of the ball joints bercause the Dronsfield ones were damaged, I guess whilst getting them off. This is a good thing though, because it encouraged me to change the grease in them.

The normal price I understand is around £270 EACH SIDE, so you can see it was an easy choice.

As it turned out, I only needed to do one side, so if anyone wants a Offside Lower control Arm, I have one.....please get in touch!