M113k or M157? Back to the scene

[supermgm]

Hello all,

It's been about 8 years since I last interacted on this forum and also owned a Mercedes. Dreadful, I know.

Mainly because I've been using company cars and BMWs for that matter. Previously I had a C215 CL500, that was a lovely thing, but it did knock my confidence in Mercedes in general. Due to a number of rather irritating faults and failures, mostly due to previous owners or me being a student and not having a lot of money to actually fix anything properly.

A number of fast BMWs later, including an E39 M5, M140i (all of which have been unbelievably reliable) etc. I'm in the market for a new daily driver. My circumstances mean I don't typically do many miles, so a V8 daily is on the shortlist.

Now, do I go for something a little older W211 E55 or CLS 55 with the venerable M113k engine and pretty solid reliability, albeit terrible fuel consumption (max 20mpg?). Or do I go down the slightly newer M157 engine cars E63 et al. I've heard these aren't as strong as the all M113k - but are somewhat more efficient.

I'll use the cars for 90% long journeys to the airport or visiting clients etc. so want something comfy, not ruinous on fuel, V8 and reliable.

So please help me make up my mind!

 

[SJMaxwell]

My two 2012 E63 M157 never gave me any issues, and as long as the timing chain issue has been dealt with, they should be fine

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[supermgm]

My two 2012 E63 M157 never gave me any issues, and as long as the timing chain issue has been dealt with, they should be fine

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Easily found out by looking through the oil cap - two different types I've seen?

 

[DSK]

I drove a e63 with n/a when they were relatively new. Personally, I did not like the character of the engine for anything other than flat out driving. The bit where it all starts to get interesting always seems just out of reach in daily conditions unless you drive excessively fast everywhere. With all the turbo charged pocket rockets everything has buggered off. However, the sound track is probably the best and purest I’ve heard. Nothing this side of v12 hyper cars can compete.

I’d go for the torque monster 5.5 kompressor, not only is it my favourite Mercedes engine but, they are solid, have a solid gearbox (I’m far from the biggest fan of the 7g) and in E55 guise highly practical. I would then perform a rust treatment on it as the first thing.


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[SJMaxwell]

That was the nature of the M156. The M157 was a twin turbo with loads if power low down

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[DSK]

Sorry I misread for the na for some reason…

I recall AMGeed didn’t regret going from an E55 to the E63 5.5.


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[SJMaxwell]

Sorry I misread for the na for some reason…

I recall AMGeed didn’t regret going from an E55 to the E63 5.5.


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No, he didn't after seeing mine!

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[supermgm]

Yeah the M156 reminds me of the S85 a little - great engine for something small and lightweight. I want a more effortless driving experience, so has to be either 157 or 113k with the torque on offer.

I drove a e63 with n/a when they were relatively new. Personally, I did not like the character of the engine for anything other than flat out driving. The bit where it all starts to get interesting always seems just out of reach in daily conditions unless you drive excessively fast everywhere. With all the turbo charged pocket rockets everything has buggered off. However, the sound track is probably the best and purest I’ve heard. Nothing this side of v12 hyper cars can compete.

I’d go for the torque monster 5.5 kompressor, not only is it my favourite Mercedes engine but, they are solid, have a solid gearbox (I’m far from the biggest fan of the 7g) and in E55 guise highly practical. I would then perform a rust treatment on it as the first thing.


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[DSK]

Whilst I am an m113k fan, I can’t help but think the e63 5.5 is the better option for most.


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[alexanderfoti]

I prefer the m113k

The m157 can be great and reliable and torquey, especially when tuned.

With age chain issues, adjusters and pcv systems are common. They will do far better economy on a run, being direct injected etc.

I'd choose the car first as most of the cars with 157s are 10,12 years newer than anything with the m113k

 

[supermgm]

I prefer the m113k

The m157 can be great and reliable and torquey, especially when tuned.

With age chain issues, adjusters and pcv systems are common. They will do far better economy on a run, being direct injected etc.

I'd choose the car first as most of the cars with 157s are 10,12 years newer than anything with the m113k

Would you say the whole bore-scoring and bent rod accounts are just very unlucky on the M157, or is it an inevitable?

 

[alexanderfoti]

Batch of bad injectors and a load of tuners putting too much boost/ignition timing in at low rpm. It's not such a common sight now

 

[SJMaxwell]

I prefer the m113k

The m157 can be great and reliable and torquey, especially when tuned.

With age chain issues, adjusters and pcv systems are common. They will do far better economy on a run, being direct injected etc.

I'd choose the car first as most of the cars with 157s are 10,12 years newer than anything with the m113k

And pulley issues on M113s ?

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[alexanderfoti]

A far far cheaper fix more equivalent to replacing idler pulleys compared to bent con rods

 

[SJMaxwell]

A far far cheaper fix more equivalent to replacing idler pulleys compared to bent con rods

I never had the con rod issue, but as you say, people overtuned them. Idler pulleys were a regular disposable item from my mates that had the M113 though

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[SJMaxwell]

I forgot that the M157 has the coil pack problem. Like the M156, they eat them, but dealers rarely, if ever have all 8 in stock, so you end up chasing them and replacing them as they fail!

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[DSK]

What about the timing chain upgrade, an oil check valve recall (on early cars) and a dodgy sensor that let oil into the wiring due to a beautifully engineered seal on the M157?


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[SL63 Mark]

I have owned both, and the M157 is a much better engine IMHO, especially in its later more powerful guise. Faster, more economical, better noise, more fun with the roof down. 900NM in the '63 vs 700NM in the now rather old M113k. Don't get me wrong I was impressed with the 113k when I bought one in 2012, but the M157 is much better. It's night and day, a more modern engine. Talk to people who have actually owned them long term, rather than the internet jockeys.

The M113k leaks oil, and has potentially disastrous oil pickup issues. The 157 is totally reliable, except when tuned.

 

[AMGeed]

I moved from an 04 E55 to a 64 E63 Biturbo and didn't regret it for a moment.
As good and quick as the E55 is, the E63 is much quicker. Both great cars with low down boost that I love.
I'm afraid I only had the E63 for 2 months before I took it to Acid at MSL and had a remap and exhaust work done.
That totally transformed the car again. An absolute animal up to 160 mph (private road of course)
Never had a single issue with either car, although the bent rods reports on the M157 did make me nervous.
There is also the issue of the coil packs and leaking oil into the ECU wiring harness through the cam magnets.
No issues at all as I said and the only things I've heard that could be problematic with the M113k is the possibility of an oil pump failure.

I owned the E63 for 3 years and it was running better when I sold it thanks to the remap. I'd buy another M157 without question had the M177 W213 E class not been such a big step up in the cabin. Both the W211 and W212 are showing signs of age in comparison to the later offerings from Mercedes. Not surprising really, its called progress and its what sells cars.

 

[AMGeed]

What about the timing chain upgrade, an oil check valve recall (on early cars) and a dodgy sensor that let oil into the wiring due to a beautifully engineered seal on the M157?


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From 2013 on, this wasn't an issue with the M157.
Although the oil wicking up the harness can still be an issue.