Mercedes Diesel software update.

[Winstanley]

I believe the EU has got 1 Billion from MB, or Euro 4000 per car. Nothing as been given to the Customer.

 

[Winstanley]

Maybe ask Mercedes benz uk the question.

Personally if i was that unhappy with a relatively new car i would just sell it. Older Mercedes are far better cars than the modern junk anyway.

I have I went straight down that line, and MD dealers are unable to sell product that has not been NoX "enhanced" from units to new-or-used card to standard services.

 

[js190d]

I believe the EU has got 1 Billion from MB, or Euro 4000 per car. Nothing as been given to the Customer.

Par for the course i am afraid, seeing as they have invented there own legal framework & courts so can do what they like. Good riddance!

 

[LostKiwi]

Safety, as one wants to operate the car most efficiently by moving to higher gears, meaning the optimum point to be in top is ~76mph. Normally the flow of traffic is around 70mph, hence your are shunting in to the car in front or tailgating until they get out of the way. We all seen it happen.

If driving in the highest gear possible to maximise 'efficiency' is your idea of safety we have widely different view points. My idea if safety is using the appropriate gear to suit the traffic and road conditions I'm in. Efficiency doesn't come into my safety calculations at all.
I doubt many would consider fuel efficiency as part of safety either and this is why that argument will fail with MB and the courts.

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

I agree, this is not a ‘safety’ issue and basing your argument on that point of view is guaranteed to end with failure

 

[LostKiwi]

I believe the EU has got 1 Billion from MB, or Euro 4000 per car. Nothing as been given to the Customer.

Why would you expect to get anything from fines levied? If a burglar breaks into your house and the courts fine them £100 do you get a share of the fines?

Par for the course i am afraid, seeing as they have invented there own legal framework & courts so can do what they like. Good riddance!

Put aside your dislike of the EU - it's no different to the UK.

 

[js190d]

I do not think for a second that any Mercedes owner will ever get any recompense for their expensive car being detuned against there will. David V Goliath springs to mind.

Show me evidence of financial transparency with eu fines such as these.

Where does the money go. That's 1000 million euro's, enough to house and feed every poor person in Europe. Obscene.

 

[LostKiwi]

Like I said - no different to the UK.

 

[Botus]

have any of the complainant's considered the fact their car might be holding back from shifting because Mercedes are trying to get their DPF to clear ?

and if they allowed it to do it, the shifting might go back to how it was when its done

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

Yes, I spent about a month or two thinking it was a DPF issue, took it back to MB dealer to test the DPF (no errors), bought an MB2.0 scanner and even paid an indie for a STAR scan - no DPF issues (my DPF is actually in very good nick).

Eventually I realised it's nothing to do with the DPF.

I believe that having the engine running hotter simply reduces NOX emissions (at the expensive of using more fossil fuel and CO2 emissions but hey as long as the NOX box is checked...)

 

[LostKiwi]

In some ways it's about priorities.
CO2 grabs all the headlines but NOx and particulate matter are the real immediate killers.
NOx 'stuns' the cilia in the lungs that help prevent foreign matter getting to the fine air sacs in the lungs. Once the cilia are stunned the particulates have an easy route deep into the lung tissues where it causes carcinomas and respiratory disease.
Particulates on their own aren't too much of an issue but in conjunction with NOx create a dangerous combination. CO2 on the other hand is a much longer term issue but also one that can be ameliorated right now in other ways.

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

We actually have no idea how much NOx these cars are putting out until someone does an independent test. Nor do we know how much these measure are actually helping - we don't know a before/after. But one must assume that it must've been pretty bad before otherwise MB wouldn't have had to come up with this 'hack' to try to improve the situation.

I like the idea that my car is putting out less NOx, that's a great thing.

My issue is with MB (or any other manufacturer) lying/cheating the emissions tests, then when found out, making their customers pay the price - and then lying that there is no extra price. No transparency, no accountability and no repercussions - simple pi**ing all over the good will of the customers that line their pockets.

And I certainly don't think that MB are doing this for the good of the environment or our lungs. They are doing this to avoid legal action, and a reduction in NOx emissions takes priority over CO2, fuel consumption, soot/ash creation (running the car harder will be throwing more diesel particulate into the air) and so on. They did not care enough about 'our lungs' (as evidenced by the inevitable increase in DPF regeneration) when they lied on the emissions tests and I highly doubt that they suddenly became ECO warriors in the last year or so. They simply want to avoid a big law suit a l VAG.

 

[LostKiwi]

A very quick way to see how much NOx affects city streets is to think back to how we used to feel walking round them 30 years ago. Personally I couldn't walk round London without getting short of breath and having coughing fits.
Now I can (but still choose not to go there). That suggests to me that air quality is now significantly improved.

Car manufacturers will always try to game the system to gain market advantage. The real issue is the failure of governments to develop real tests and provide follow up monitoring.

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

In my opinion, that isn't really NOx, that's more likely soot output (helped by DPFs in the past 10 years) and... not exactly a scientific test...

Diesels weren't very popular 30 years ago (in cars), either. They've only had the big boom since the ~2009+ government backed 'lower CO2' craze.

 

[LostKiwi]

Agreed not scientific but 30 years ago the black cabs were everywhere and generating high levels of NOx and particulate matter. London air still irritates me but nothing like it did.
For the record I don't suffer from asthma or have any other respiratory illness.

 

[ioweddie]

Just got a recall email...something to do with knox sensors....2016 model c220d premium plus 23000 miles..should I do it?

 

[Wighty]

Just got a recall email...something to do with knox sensors....2016 model c220d premium plus 23000 miles..should I do it?

If you drive on the IOW you probably only use the first 2 gears anyway

 

[Blobcat]

If you drive on the IOW you probably only use the first 2 gears anyway

I don't know the military road (A3055) can be fun

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

Remember guys, it's not just a 7th/9th gear issue. The car's economy will be down ~15-20% and there will likely be increased EGR valve use, increasing wear and tear and carbon build up in the engine. But less NOx emissions is good.

 

[Tony Dyson]

The knock sensor feeds a high frequency signal to the ECU which in turn listens for anomalous vibrations in the engine, at face value it doesn't sound related to any Emissions but what exactly MB have then programmed the ECU in response to anomalous information I do not know? I am convinced the dealership network don't know a great deal of exactly what the emissions update does, either the list of components affected by the update, the changes to the operating parameters of those components, the difference in any tangible measurable emissions or the short or long term effects on nearly all Euro 5 and 6 vehicles.
I would Contact the dealership and seek confirmation of exactly what they intend to update, additionally, if you don't specifically want the emissions update, tell them, remove any implied rights and insist on written confirmation and compliance of your wishes. It is an optional update!