My car really hates snow

[xavierx]

Come on guys, I think the "It's not the car it's the driver that is the problem" posts are a little harsh.

Last year I got stuck several times in the lightest of snow in my E-class, and I have never had this problem before in any car I have owned.

The most embarrassing thing to happen was when I was getting stuck at every junction only a mile away from my house. A very nice man in a little Nissan micra was really kind to follow behind me, get out of his car, give me a push to get me going and then jump back in his little front wheel drive car, and follow me to the next junction, himself having no problem at all in setting off every time. I had reasonably expensive Pirelli tires on at the time (summer ones of course)

This year (right now) I am looking to get some winter tires stuck on the car to see if that helps the situation at all, but other than not driving the car when it is cold, what can I do as a driver to fix the issue?

 

[turbopete]

micra has skinny tyres hence no problem. my little FWD puma is a bit jittery in the snow thanks to fatter tyres than the fiesta its based on

narrower tyres and weight in the back will help you

 

[bahram]

This year (right now) I am looking to get some winter tires stuck on the car to see if that helps the situation at all, but other than not driving the car when it is cold, what can I do as a driver to fix the issue?

How about snow socks? I am about to order some from ebay. About 50 quid and you slip them on over summer tyres.

 

[Rory]

Come on guys, I think the "It's not the car it's the driver that is the problem" posts are a little harsh.

Last year I got stuck several times in the lightest of snow in my E-class, and I have never had this problem before in any car I have owned.

A colleague of mine has just chopped his 5 Series BMW in for an E220CDi and he rang me almost in tears asking how on earth he's supposed to drive it in the current weather! He said he'd had no memorable issues in his 5 Series (also an auto) and couldn't understand why the E Class was so different.

The most embarrassing thing to happen was when I was getting stuck at every junction only a mile away from my house. A very nice man in a little Nissan micra was really kind to follow behind me, get out of his car, give me a push to get me going and then jump back in his little front wheel drive car, and follow me to the next junction, himself having no problem at all in setting off every time.

I did that in January for an MB driver when I was out in wifey's Honda Jazz (itself on pretty wide low profile tyres). Only trouble is I fell over at one point walking back to my car and my elbow still hurts. :cry:

 

[Naraic]

For everyone who has great difficulty or knows someone who has, there are others (me included) who don't.

Torque is a problem in the snow and ice, so I should have a problem...I don't. So please start quoting me when people say they're rubbish in the snow.

 

[horgantrevor]

stick it in "W" and the ESP takes over the rest. This is on the staggered wide AMG alloys. Braking and steering has to be treated with respect, but again the ESP/gubbins sorts it out.

 

[jefrs]

The past week is the first time I've driven the MB in the ice and snow, and I've never driven a rear-wheel drive that does it better: stick it in "W" and the ESP takes over the rest. This is on the staggered wide AMG alloys. Braking and steering has to be treated with respect, but again the ESP/gubbins sorts it out.

<snip>

I'm getting deja mot ;-)

Diesel: now there is a problem, all that low end torque: almost impossible to engage drive gently on packed snow without spin in any gear. I remember well one journey years ago where we had to bail out of my mate's old pre-selector London taxi every time he had to stop in order to push start it, then dive back in whilst it was moving. Fortunately the rear doors opened the wrong way so they scooped us up.

 

[Alex M Grieve]

I'm getting deja mot ;-)

Diesel: now there is a problem, all that low end torque: almost impossible to engage drive gently on packed snow without spin in any gear. I remember well one journey years ago where we had to bail out of my mate's old pre-selector London taxi every time he had to stop in order to push start it, then dive back in whilst it was moving. Fortunately the rear doors opened the wrong way so they scooped us up.

Let "tick over" get you started. In gear, feet off and let it set off on its own. Most diesels will get you going easily on the flat with no risk of stalling. Specialists, like the Land Rover Defender seem immune to stalling and will even motor up gradients happily on tick over.

Works well on snow and ice, mud, wet grass.

 

[jackwall5]

Alex, just what came to my mind as I read this thread also ...

I recall rolling sillage of all things at home as a kid and failing to get up and over when accelerating the tractor .... I was of the thinking that I needed to apply power to get up .... only for the tractor engine to stall and die. Once Dad showed me how to do it [I was learning], it seems counter-intuitive to be honest. Foot off the accelerator and let the engine power do the work. Only needed to keep it alive.

 

[Thincat]

Come on guys, I think the "It's not the car it's the driver that is the problem" posts are a little harsh.

Last year I got stuck several times in the lightest of snow in my E-class, and I have never had this problem before in any car I have owned.

Exactly right. Part of your problem will be your high peformance Pirellis. Have a look on mytyres and see what their snow rating is - I'd guess they're very low rated. I have partially solved the problem with my SLK by using Vredestein Ultracs which are pretty good in snow. Unfortunately they're now nearly ready to replace and Vredestein don't seem to make them in the size I need any more - and the Ultrac Sessantos don't have very good snow ratings.

Mercedes are unconcerned about the problem because they think that we should use winter tyres in winter - like they do in Germany. Like I've said the problem is caused by the Mercedes ESP which intervenes too early and takes control away from the driver because it thinks it knows best. Often it does know best, but in very low grip situations it gets it WRONG. The problem is compounded by the fact that turning off the ESP doesn't turn off the pseudo-LSD. So you get in the ludicrous situation where the TC is braking one of the wheels because it has detected a bit of slip. The other wheel is rotating slowly and getting a bit of grip but the TC has turned the car into one-wheel-drive which is useless. This is where you'd want to lock the differential ideally, not deliberately brake a wheel that has slipped slightly - leave that up to the driver's clutch and throttle control. The Merc system - even on manual cars - takes too much away from the driver.

I guess those who think their Merc is good in snow are possibly those who have always had trouble driving in difficult conditions - they're the people you see revving their cars manically and going nowhere. The merc makes it easier for them because it takes most of the control away from the driver. If the car manages to go anywhere they think it's a good car. When it just sits there and won't move they think it's the fault of the tyres.

 

[drmw]

I guess those who think their Merc is good in snow are possibly those who have always had trouble driving in difficult conditions - they're the people you see revving their cars manically and going nowhere. The merc makes it easier for them because it takes most of the control away from the driver. If the car manages to go anywhere they think it's a good car. When it just sits there and won't move they think it's the fault of the tyres.

I've never before seen anyone try to equate an ability to drive in snow with a difficulty of driving in difficult conditions - a quite bizarre idea encapsulated in the even more bizarre argument above.

 

[Naraic]

^ Agreed, bizarre. I drove 120 miles on Sunday, it took twice the time, but I made it. My car works in the snow, and yet apparently I can't drive in snow, and yet I did, or maybe I imagined it. I went to sleep for 4 hours, and when I awoke I obviously had been dreaming of the journey.

Slow and steady was my motto. I bet the guy in the Peugeot 106 wished he'd stayed behind me, but once we got onto a motorway he overtook me. Oh how we laughed when we met him a mile or so down the road, facing the ditch on the hard shoulder. I did think when he overtook, a better man than me, but ...I could go on, sarcasm is so easy...

 

[Thincat]

^ Agreed, bizarre. I drove 120 miles on Sunday, it took twice the time, but I made it. My car works in the snow, and yet apparently I can't drive in snow, and yet I did, or maybe I imagined it. I went to sleep for 4 hours, and when I awoke I obviously had been dreaming of the journey.

Slow and steady was my motto. I bet the guy in the Peugeot 106 wished he'd stayed behind me, but once we got onto a motorway he overtook me. Oh how we laughed when we met him a mile or so down the road, facing the ditch on the hard shoulder. I did think when he overtook, a better man than me, but ...I could go on, sarcasm is so easy...

I think that just about sums you up "renault12ts". Your idea of driving in snow is driving on a well-gritted motorway with maybe a little bit of snow at the sides - or possibly the occasional A or B road where the gritters and a lot of other traffic have cleared a path. Try driving in real snow - like for example on Dartmoor. Most of the roads aren't gritted because the council save money by only gritting the A roads - there aren't any motorways. There are also a lot of steep hills. I seriously doubt that you would be able to drive half a mile. You haven't got a clue what you're talking about. You exemplify exactly what I said. Your idea of driving in "snow" is setting the auto gearbox to "W" (or whatever they call it nowadays) and pressing the throttle gently and then congratulating yourself when the car moves. You wouldn't make it 100 yards up here.

 

[Naraic]

So there I was explaining how a front wheel drive car couldn't cope on a snowy motorway, and you say all of the above. I think what you have written says more about you than anything I wrote say about me.

To assume etc...

 

[drmw]

. Your idea of driving in "snow" is setting the auto gearbox to "W" (or whatever they call it nowadays) and pressing the throttle gently and then congratulating yourself when the car moves. You wouldn't make it 100 yards up here.

Whereas yours is to stick your foot down, go nowhere then blame the car.

Was it not you that couldn't get your car to go anywhere on a level car park with 2" of snow?

Your statement above sums up why that happened.

 

[Colt45_GTO]

seriously guys?

 

[Thincat]

Whereas yours is to stick your foot down, go nowhere then blame the car.

Was it not you that couldn't get your car to go anywhere on a level car park with 2" of snow?

Your statement above sums up why that happened.

I'm pretty experienced in driving in snow so I know when the car is the problem. I also think I understand why, having watched the way the rear wheels behave when power is applied gently. Even if there is a little grip there the Merc can't use it because of the traction control. Mercs are basically 1WD (or less) in snow - not good.

Like I said, computers are good at a lot of things but when it comes to driving in really difficult conditions a good driver is better. The trouble is that the Merc TC takes the control away from the driver.. For those of us who know how to drive it would be good to have a real "OFF" button for the traction control.

 

[turbopete]

Whereas yours is to stick your foot down, go nowhere then blame the car.

sometimes this WORKS!!!! done it a couple of times myself recently. if the snow isnt packed down and theres no ice under it, the tyres can 'dig' through the snow and grip the road. had it not been fr this method, i would have missed seeing my other half's scan pictures AND a dentist appointment as id not have been able to get to where i needed to be. admittedly, my car isnt RWD but im sure the same principles will apply if the boot was suitably loaded.

 

[turbopete]

You're another moron like "renault12ts". I'm pretty experienced in driving in snow so I know when the car is the problem. I also think I understand why, having watched the way the rear wheels behave when power is applied gently. Even if there is a little grip there the Merc can't use it because of the traction control. Mercs are basically 1WD (or less) in snow - not good.

Like I said, computers are good at a lot of things but when it comes to driving in really difficult conditions a good driver is better. The trouble is that the Merc TC takes the control away from the driver. In the case of you and "renault12ts" that's obviously a good idea. For those of us who know how to drive it would be good to have a real "OFF" button for the traction control.

or a limited slip diff. less to go wrong and would mean that the majority of MB's wouldnt need traction control ANYHOW!!!
if ford could fit LSD's to 80's capri's and escorts, im fairly sure the cost cant be prohibitive

 

[Thincat]

sometimes this WORKS!!!!

. Well said.

It does sometimes work and that's exactly why having a ****ing computer sitting between you and the throttle/brakes is a such pain in the arse. Computers are good at a lot of things - usually repetitive tasks - and it's great to have ESP watching over the traction control most of the time. But there are times when I want to turn it OFF and control the car myself. Mercedes don't allow me to do this.