New to the Mercedes family

[hctbn]

Hi - quick intro - we've just bought a 2011 A-Class for the missus - our first Merc and junior entry to the family! My other cars are 2 classic minis, a 3.5 V8 110 Land Rover (ex-RAF), and a Vauxhall Meriva. I'm an aging Electronic Engineer, used to working on my own cars including the mechanics and also welding, from the days when I had an Austin Maxi (I could do a clutch in about 90 minutes) right up to modern cars, although I can be defeated - they have far too much electronics in them (and Electronics is my profession)!
I'm sure I will be begging for help from the more experienced - please be gentle with me!

 

[Blobcat]

Hello and welcome

 

[SL63 Mark]

Welcome from a fellow Land Rover owner.

 

[dry run]

Welcome

 

[00slk]

Hello and welcome from another classic car owner

 

[Srdl]

Hello and welcome. An Austin Maxi - now that takes me back. Never had one but remember them well from my youth.

 

[harrye500]

Welcome! Was it the Maxi that had the hydrolastic suspension or the Allegro (or both)? I remember the Maxi on the roads!

 

[PaulG]

Hi and welcome to the forum

 

[hctbn]

Welcome! Was it the Maxi that had the hydrolastic suspension or the Allegro (or both)? I remember the Maxi on the roads!

Thank you. The Maxi did indeed have hydrolastic suspension - I had three of them in my early driving days and did a lot of miles, much of it on holidays driving around Norway, Sweden, and Finland. I also had a MG Metro which had it - never had any trouble with it

 

[SL63 Mark]

UK Cars using the Hydrolastic suspension system:

• ADO16 Morris / Austin / Wolseley / MG 1100 / 1300, Riley Kestrel / 1300 & Vanden Plas Princess 1100 / 1300
• ADO15 Austin / Morris Mini & Wolseley Hornet / Riley Elf (from 1964 to 1971)
• ADO17 Austin / Morris 1800 / 2200 & Wolseley 18/85 / Six
• ADO14 Austin Maxi (until March 1978)
• ADO61 Austin 3-Litre

 

[harrye500]

Good reliable cars. Made at a time of uninspired design and under investment by BL. Nonetheless reliable. My first car (1992) was a 1980 dolomite in bottle green. Another BL gem - I loved it, so many great memories!

Thank you. The Maxi did indeed have hydrolastic suspension - I had three of them in my early driving days and did a lot of miles, much of it on holidays driving around Norway, Sweden, and Finland. I also had a MG Metro which had it - never had any trouble with it

 

[SmartAmg]

 

[Srdl]

UK Cars using the Hydrolastic suspension system:

• ADO16 Morris / Austin / Wolseley / MG 1100 / 1300, Riley Kestrel / 1300 & Vanden Plas Princess 1100 / 1300
• ADO15 Austin / Morris Mini & Wolseley Hornet / Riley Elf (from 1964 to 1971)
• ADO17 Austin / Morris 1800 / 2200 & Wolseley 18/85 / Six
• ADO14 Austin Maxi (until March 1978)
• ADO61 Austin 3-Litre

I had to have the suspension on my Morris 1300 pumped up from time to time but otherwise no problems.

(Did you know that the ADO model classification came from “Austin Drawing Office”?)

 

[SL63 Mark]

Hydrolastic suspension does sound complex, and possibly a solution in search of a problem as 99% of manufacturers stayed with springs and dampers. What happens when the rubber cracks ? As we know, rubber only has a limited lifespan.

"The system replaces the separate springs and dampers of a conventional suspension system with fluid filled displacer units which are interconnected between the front and rear wheels on each side of the vehicle.

Each displacer unit contains a rubber spring, and damping is achieved by the displaced fluid passing through rubber valves. The displaced fluid passes to the displacer of the paired wheel, thus providing a dynamic interaction between front and rear wheels. When a front wheel encounters a bump, fluid is transferred to the corresponding rear displacer, then lowers the rear wheel, hence lifting the rear, minimising pitch associated with the bump.[2] Naturally the reverse occurs when it is a rear wheel that encounters a bump. This effect is particularly good on small cars as their shorter wheelbases are more affected by pitching.

However, the key improvement over conventional suspension is that the front/rear interconnection allows the vehicle to be stiffer in roll than in pitch. Hence it is possible to design a compliant suspension - giving a comfortable ride - without suffering a penalty in terms of excessive roll when cornering. In roll, there is no transference of fluid from the displacers, and hence its internal pressure rises. The only "give" in the suspension occurs because of the inherent flexibility of the rubber springs. These are naturally stiff.

In pitch, as described above, fluid is displaced front to rear, and hence the pressure in the system stays effectively the same, and thus the suspension is much more compliant.

The design of the displacer units, and the way in which they are mounted means that as the suspension is compressed, the (roughly spherical) displacer deforms, and hence presents a larger area to the mounting plates. The pressure in the system is thus acting over a larger area, and hence applying additional force. This gives the suspension a sharply rising rate even in pitch, so that there is a strong tendency to return to equilibrium. Without this rising rate there would be no effective pitch resistance at all.

Cars with Hydrolastic suspension do, however, have a marked tendency to squat under acceleration, and to dive under braking (and for the rear end to sag under heavy loads). This requires clever design of the suspension components to minimise these forces, and to maximise the rising rate characteristic."

 

[Snake Charmer]

Welcome to the jungle or should I say Welcome to ageing Mercedes electronics!!

I can remember a trip in a Maxi with one of my brothers friends, he was quite short and seemed to have quite a workout reaching for first and second gear that seemed to be on the passenger side.

 

[harrye500]

Hydrolastic suspension does sound complex, and possibly a solution in search of a problem as 99% of manufacturers stayed with springs and dampers. What happens when the rubber cracks ? As we know, rubber only has a limited lifespan.

"The system replaces the separate springs and dampers of a conventional suspension system with fluid filled displacer units which are interconnected between the front and rear wheels on each side of the vehicle.

Each displacer unit contains a rubber spring, and damping is achieved by the displaced fluid passing through rubber valves. The displaced fluid passes to the displacer of the paired wheel, thus providing a dynamic interaction between front and rear wheels. When a front wheel encounters a bump, fluid is transferred to the corresponding rear displacer, then lowers the rear wheel, hence lifting the rear, minimising pitch associated with the bump.[2] Naturally the reverse occurs when it is a rear wheel that encounters a bump. This effect is particularly good on small cars as their shorter wheelbases are more affected by pitching.

However, the key improvement over conventional suspension is that the front/rear interconnection allows the vehicle to be stiffer in roll than in pitch. Hence it is possible to design a compliant suspension - giving a comfortable ride - without suffering a penalty in terms of excessive roll when cornering. In roll, there is no transference of fluid from the displacers, and hence its internal pressure rises. The only "give" in the suspension occurs because of the inherent flexibility of the rubber springs. These are naturally stiff.

In pitch, as described above, fluid is displaced front to rear, and hence the pressure in the system stays effectively the same, and thus the suspension is much more compliant.

The design of the displacer units, and the way in which they are mounted means that as the suspension is compressed, the (roughly spherical) displacer deforms, and hence presents a larger area to the mounting plates. The pressure in the system is thus acting over a larger area, and hence applying additional force. This gives the suspension a sharply rising rate even in pitch, so that there is a strong tendency to return to equilibrium. Without this rising rate there would be no effective pitch resistance at all.

Cars with Hydrolastic suspension do, however, have a marked tendency to squat under acceleration, and to dive under braking (and for the rear end to sag under heavy loads). This requires clever design of the suspension components to minimise these forces, and to maximise the rising rate characteristic."

Or that other reliable alternative of course..... ABC - haha and all that! I've yet to travel in an MB with ABC but from all the forum write ups, I believe it is out of this world if not expensive (if neglected)!

 

[Richard Moakes]

Or that other reliable alternative of course..... ABC - haha and all that! I've yet to travel in an MB with ABC but from all the forum write ups, I believe it is out of this world if not expensive (if neglected)!

Once you go ABC, you never go back

 

[SL63 Mark]

Once you go ABC, you never go back

You can't afford to.

 

[Richard Moakes]

You can't afford to.

One car with Airmatic & ADS and another with ABC, I am doubly blessed