R170 Jacking

[mikestrivens]

The problem with dog-legging is that it will have a tendancy to rotate then you will be worse off. You could always get a taller jack

 

[turbopete]

The problem with dog-legging is that it will have a tendancy to rotate then you will be worse off. You could always get a taller jack

i think i need a thinner body!!! :lol::lol:

thats what i need to work out. how to stop it rotating! unless it was made an adjustable length to lift an entire side at once...........................
then again, maybe not. unless you have 4 axle stands and need the whole car up in the air! :lol::lol:

 

[antijam]

Doh! - I'm not thinking straight, there's an even simpler solution. All you need are two 250 mm. lengths of Ø20 rod.

Raise the car using the trolley jack under the hard pads, plug the rods into the jacking points and then lower them into the vees of the the axle stands.

(use four and you can have the whole car in the air)

Simple, safe and secure - Job done!

 

[television]

Doh! - I'm not thinking straight, there's an even simpler solution. All you need are two 250 mm. lengths of Ø20 rod.

Raise the car using the trolley jack under the hard pads, plug the rods into the jacking points and then lower them into the vees of the the axle stands.

(use four and you can have the whole car in the air)

Simple, safe and secure - Job done!

Brilliant,, I will put 2 flakes in the ice cream that I will send to you

 

[antijam]

Brilliant,, I will put 2 flakes in the ice cream that I will send to you

Looking forward to it Malcolm - soon as you can, in this weather I'm melting in front of my PC!

 

[turbopete]

Doh! - I'm not thinking straight, there's an even simpler solution. All you need are two 250 mm. lengths of Ø20 rod.

Raise the car using the trolley jack under the hard pads, plug the rods into the jacking points and then lower them into the vees of the the axle stands.

(use four and you can have the whole car in the air)

Simple, safe and secure - Job done!

i thought of that. but in this heat, it seemed too simple a solution to post up!

 

[mikestrivens]

Doh! - I'm not thinking straight, there's an even simpler solution. All you need are two 250 mm. lengths of Ø20 rod.

Raise the car using the trolley jack under the hard pads, plug the rods into the jacking points and then lower them into the vees of the the axle stands.

(use four and you can have the whole car in the air)

Simple, safe and secure - Job done!

Great solution. Would that take the weight of a W140 V12?

 

[turbopete]

that would depend on what the rods were made from! mild steel may be fine for the rear, but you would want high tensile or something extra strong to support a V12! mind you, whats the original jack made from for a v12 W140?

 

[antijam]

i thought of that. but in this heat, it seemed too simple a solution to post up!

I think we'd all been tiptoeing round it Pete - you're right, the heat is not helping logical thought.

It is a good solution though since the positioning of the bars in the axle stand vees is a very stable and positive location. Also the stands are situated outboard of the car giving more working space underneath and allowing easy visual inspection to ensure that the support is safe.

If I can find a metre of 20mm bar in the garage tomorrow, I'll try it out. (If I don't post back come and lift the car off me!)

 

[mikestrivens]

that would depend on what the rods were made from! mild steel may be fine for the rear, but you would want high tensile or something extra strong to support a V12! mind you, whats the original jack made from for a v12 W140?

Just been in the garage to look. The jack that comes with the car has a 20mm steel pin that goes into the tube about 3" ( I know mixing metric and imperial measures ). Seems like it is ok for wheel changing but I was thinking about the longer use of such a device for more serious work.

 

[antijam]

Just done some rough stressing on the rod - and I don't think I'll trust any old bit of mild steel.

Some high carbon tool steel should be provide an acceptable yield strength for adequate safety so I'll see what I can source at my local steel suppliers before trying anything.

If anyone else is thinking of trying it out, do proceed with caution.

 

[hotrodder]

This sort of jack stand is readily available, even in polished stainless for those with more money than sense. I'd be very surprised if anything more 'exotic' than CDS (max of 0.20% carbon, yields ranging from 170 - 360 N/mm^2 depending whether it's annealed, normalised or 'as drawn') is used for most of em- high carbon tool steel would complicate the welding

Expensive for something so simple to make but factor in the 'motorsport tax' and type approval...

 

[antijam]

Thanks very much hotrodder, I hadn't realised that that sort of stand was on the market. A straightforward solution to our problem!

As you say though, a bit pricey for what they are. I think there should still be a solution using just a pin plugged into the jacking point and resting on a standard axle stand. The best option for the pin might simply be a Ø20 high tensile bolt of the right length - the head could overhang the stand vee to minimise the risk of the stand slipping away.

 

[mikestrivens]

How about these:
http://www.screwfix.com/prods/26723/Bolts/Bolts/Bolt-BZP-High-Tensile-Steel-M20-X-150mm-Pack-of-25

 

[television]

It would be important to get the stand as near as possible to avoid an offset load, as the axle stands as such are designed to have a direct load from the top.

Its a shame that the ones found by hotrodder are so expensive, I sure that I could find somewhere else to place my nuts

 

[antijam]

It would be important to get the stand as near as possible to avoid an offset load, as the axle stands as such are designed to have a direct load from the top.

Its a shame that the ones found by hotrodder are so expensive, I sure that I could find somewhere else to place my nuts

Yes Malcolm, the distance of the stand from the car will determine the bending moment on the pin, which we'd obviously want to minimise.

Like you, I think I'd be quite happy to keep my nuts in my pocket....

 

[mikestrivens]

OK what about going back to the original idea of putting one of these bolts in the tube to lift car then put stand under jacking pad. As it is for a short period it can't do more harm than the jack that comes with the vehicle (or even use the vehicle jack), or am I missing something.

 

[antijam]

OK what about going back to the original idea of putting one of these bolts in the tube to lift car then put stand under jacking pad. As it is for a short period it can't do more harm than the jack that comes with the vehicle (or even use the vehicle jack), or am I missing something.

You are probably right Mike, we seem to have come practically full circle now - there's got to be a workable solution in there somewhere.

Anyway, I have just ordered five Ø20 x 220mm hex.head high tensile steel bolts on the net (they come in packs of 5, so I get a spare!) and I'll try out some of the options we've suggested.

 

[hotrodder]

Was half asleep when i posted last night and missed the references to making an adaptor to fit the sill for use with a trolley jack or conventional stands. Jacking adaptors make more sense to me as you are then relying on certified axle stands to support the car in a manner for which they were designed- having a car fall off a jack isn't much fun but infinitly preferable to falling off stands after wheels have been removed.

Ignore the CDS comment in my last post as it's tube so would only be used on the frame, the pin that goes into the sill could be mild bar stock or something like EN14 (similar alloy to T45 tube) which is very weldable. In hindsight i wouldn't like to use those stands unless you're jacking up via a crossmember or diff i.e one end of the car at a time rather than a corner at a time

After a little thought my approach would be to weld a pad to some 20mm bar stock so that the trolley jack cradle has less chance of slipping but then i'm a welder and fabricator. An M20 bolt is certainly going to be more than strong enough but the threads arer going to cause more marring to the jacking point than a smooth bar. Cutting the bolt head off and inserting the shank into the jacking point would work better... could always use a couple of nuts to attach something to the end sitting in the jack cradle

 

[television]

Its a shame that you cannot weld a bar to the stands, but the off set load would buckle it, I think