Running out of patience.

[Paul_Devon]

C220D Auto (1995)
Bit of a problem, runs like a dog and then the EDC light comes on and the engine stops, sometimes after only a couple seconds. This first happened all of a sudden, it didn?t work up to it.
When tested the fault code P1224 is given and the scanner says it?s not a known fault code.
Checked the fuel lines and there is a bit of air but not enough to cause the engine to stop, and that wouldn?t cause the EDC light to come on.
OVP is OK now as I have reworked it.
Had an oscilloscope on the crank sensor output and that looks OK.
If I take the battery off for a while and then put it back on, the car runs very well, not even a hint of trouble. Then you stop the car and let it cool down and try to start it again and we are back to square one with it running like a dog.
Help please.

 

[Paul_Devon]

I'm sorry, I am new to this forum, (actually, I have never used a forum before), having looked at loads of previous posts, I thought I may be able to get some help here.
I think that the P code range means manufacturer controlled fuel and air metering, and the actual code may mean Throttle position sensor B out of self test range, but I am not sure that is for this car.
I have looked at getting a new ECU and they want over £1000 for it. I have been told that a second hand one can't be recoded to match the car, is this true?
Somebody please help, I have an imaculate C220D which currently I couldn't give away!

 

[blassberg]

Hi Paul,

I'm not your technical type on this stuff but suggest you consider on search on MAF sensors.

Good luck!

 

[Paul_Devon]

Thanks for your response but does this car have a MAF sensor. All I can see is the air temperature sensor, I have tested this bit and it does respond to a change in temperature and the connections seem OK. If there is one what am I looking for?

 

[Paul_Devon]

Update on this fault.
After further investigation and a bit of phoning around by the garage, they say it is either a problem with the ECU or the injector pump, but they don't know which one is at fault. The fault code does not exist for this car.
ECU = £1000
Fuel pump = £1200
Both plus VAT and fitting
So, it's take your pick time, the garage says that they would replace the fuel pump first as it is more likely to be at fault, ie they fail more often than the ECU.
If it was a high mileage car and not in very good condition I would scrap it, as it is immaculate and has only done 76000, I don't know what to do.
Anybody want to by a nice low mileage C220D elegance, metalic green with a cream leatherette interior. Can't describe it as a good runner though.

 

[jberks]

Not convinced.
I presume as the garage had to ring round, they are not an MB specialist but a general garage. IMHO, modern Mercs are far too quirky and complex for these guys. With Mercs, experience is all. Get it to a proper specialist with a proper starttac machine. They aren't a lot more expensive and will know what the problem is instead of guessing.

Also, an ECU can generally be repaired, its usually nothing more serious than a dry joint so more like £100 not £1000! Too many people buy new ones in my opinion.

 

[Paul_Devon]

Thanks for your input and you may have very valid points, but the garage that I have taken the car to professes to specialise in mercs and has all of the diagnostic equipment to be able to talk to the car. As I said before, the fault code is not recognised by any of the diagnostic tools they have used, it is a manufacturer specific one, but the garage say that code should not be issued by that car and they say that they have spoken to merc dealerships. Maybe I should give one a ring and ask myself.
I am an electronics engineer and have experience in the automotive sector. I have taken the ECU apart and it did not have any obvious visible faults, and despite being a Lucas ECU, no dry joints.
Also, I have been told that it is not possible to recode these ECUs cos once they have been started a number of times they are locked to that vehicle, which rules out a second hand one, I don't know how true this is.
Supprisingly this Lucas ECU is supposed to be very reliable, Merc distributor in Milton Keynes say they have only sold 1 in the last year, but they have sold loads of the injector pumps.
Maybe I will take your advice and look into the local dealership, just hope the car makes the 30 miles. The strange thing is that if you remove the battery for a while it then drives OK, until you switch off and the engine cools down. Then it is undrivable.
Has anybody else had this problem?

 

[ivoka1981]

Hallo Pual!

I newly bought a Mb C220D 1995 and it has exactly the same problem as your
How far did you come with your investigation - did you manage to find out what does cause the car to stall and turn the EDC light on ?

Thank you in advance!

 

[whitenemesis]

Hallo Pual!

I newly bought a Mb C220D 1995 and it has exactly the same problem as your
How far did you come with your investigation - did you manage to find out what does cause the car to stall and turn the EDC light on ?

Thank you in advance!

This thread is 6yrs old and the OP hasn't posted since Sept 2005 .....

 

[television]

This thread is 6yrs old and the OP hasn't posted since Sept 2005 .....

It shows that it must be fixed then

 

[Dosco]

This thread is 6yrs old and the OP hasn't posted since Sept 2005 .....

That is a very good point and until I read your post I had not twigged so would it be possible to have an indicator of sorts to identify when a post is over a certain 'age' like a watermark imprint of the date or some other script across the post but not obliterating the words in the post?

 

[Developer]

I bet Ivoka still needs an answer though.

Welcome Ivoka

 

[ivoka1981]

Yeah guys, i really need to know what causes the problem and how to fix it ?

HELP!!!

 

[horgantrevor]

give us all the details car type and year and so on and fault we will do our best

 

[ivoka1981]

Well i did diagnostic twice and in the first i have got the following codes:
P 1224 unknonw fault code
P 1225 unknonw fault code
P 1227 unknonw fault code

P 1335 Crankshaft Position sensor
P 1351 Start of delivery injection control loop

P 1630 Drive authorization signal
P 1705 no text

In the 2 i have got only P 1224 unknonw fault code !

Noticed the the is air bubbles in the diesel pipes between the Valve and Filter , and the Filter and Pump!
Have changed the Filter recently due to this issue with a thought that is is dirty and this cause the air bubbles in the fuel system - failed !

The problem is the same as Pauls! Is it possible the contact him some how and ask how did he manage to fix it?

Appreciate!

 

[ivoka1981]

OBS forgot about the Car type

MB W202 C220 diesel (non CDI) (70 kW; 94 hp) , model 1995
Engine : OM 604.910 EVE

 

[television]

Reading the first post it looks like air in the system, if it runs fine once started and hard to start again it must be

 

[horgantrevor]

or has it a split in a fuel line and drawing in air some were in the fuel line

 

[ivoka1981]

Sorry but i do not understand what do you mean with r has it a split in a fuel line and drawing in air some were in the fuel line ?

Well about the air in the fuel system - yes there is, but why and how to prevent it ?

I have read in a Russian forum that i guy with the engine and issue had removed the thermostat and the problem is solved.

Do you know that this engines have fuel pump with a preheating thermostat in the Valve ? What if remove it or replace it ?

I am really curious about Pauls solution .

 

[television]

You need to fit new O rings on all of the pipes, if the pipes are hard, then replace them, they are cheap enough