SAAB to Go it Alone –or Maybe Bust?

[hawk20]

SAAB to Go it Alone –or Maybe Bust?
The board of the Swedish carmaker Saab, which is owned by General Motors, has filed for reorganisation, seeking to create a fully independent business.
The announcement follows Thursday's extraordinary board meeting in which bosses considered the company's future.
GM has said that it wants to sell Saab. There had been concerns about the loss-making carmaker after the Swedish government rejected GM's call for aid.
GM took a 50% stake in Saab in 1989 and gained full ownership ten years later. Saab has lost money every year since 2001.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7901027.stm

This follows the news 2 days ago that GM had said Saab could go bust within days. The Times reported: -

“Saab, the Swedish carmaker owned by America's General Motors (GM), could go bust within ten days without an immediate injection of state aid, the US company warned last night.” Feb 18th

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/engineering/article5757562.ece

 

[st4]

Shame as is the case when any car maker goes bust...

 

[charlfourie]

Would be very sad if SAAB goes bust.
I have always thought of their cars of being a healthy alternative in a very big market.
They have always been something special.

 

[jibcl500]

Great cars until GM got involved.

jib

 

[Splatt]

They seem to have been lost in the wilderness of recent years Obviously a lack of investment in product design and development. Why do megalithic conglomerates buy good companies just to starve them and let them rot.
I see GM also want to be shot of the Hummer Brand , now that is a car ? that I will be pleased to see melted down, living next to the Chelsea FC training ground we see quite a few, I think the stars buy them as run arounds for their wives and girl friends

 

[carlsson20]

I've had many Saab 9000 Carlssons and Aeros fantastic cars

 

[television]

Yes they were great cars till the take over, I had a 9000 executive, wonderful car and very well built. back then both SAAB and Volvo wanted to concentrate on the lorry side in which they have 68% of the world market. I know one SAAB 9.3 that has spent 3 years of its 5 years life in the workshops

 

[carlsson20]

had this one up until around 5 years ago

 

[hawk20]

Sad indeed. A car with real character. I suppose the sensible outcome would be to combine with Volvo and hope the two together can survive where neither may do so alone. But sensible outcomes rarely happen in the car industry.

We are probably about to live through one of the most momentous periods for the car industry, since it began. I fear a giant clearout is on the way -or subsidies galore for a very long time.


Let's hope Vauxhall and Opel are spared by GM.

 

[television]

Sad indeed. A car with real character. I suppose the sensible outcome would be to combine with Volvo and hope the two together can survive where neither may do so alone. But sensible outcomes rarely happen in the car industry.

We are probably about to live through one of the most momentous periods for the car industry, since it began. I fear a giant clearout is on the way -or subsidies galore for a very long time.


Let's hope Vauxhall and Opel are spared by GM.

With cars getting too clever for their own good, this is fine in one way,, but smaller concerns cannot afford the technology to keep up to date with others, add in the legal requirements and it pushes the the whole thing over the edge.

I read SAABs reasons for backing out of the car side of things, and it was the money needed to keep up to date. GM wanted the name added to theirs and they got it.

Sales have fallen ever since as many felt that it was a up vamped Opel, with more to go wrong, and go wrong they did. Volvo's reason were slightly different

 

[Splatt]

I've had many Saab 9000 Carlssons and Aeros fantastic cars

You have just reminded me about the SAAB 99ES I used to own . These had Triumph Dolomite engines installed back to front . Once I was having a hell of a time with the timing light trying to tune the engine till the penny dropped and I realised I was trying to do it on No 4 Pot which was at the front.They were great in the ice and snow and would stay perfectle stable with only three wheels on.

 

[Alex M Grieve]

Amen to that.

I agree SAABs were great cars. I had 5 in total, during the 1970s. The 95 (estate) V4 was a super car, but if you see one today you will realise that it is tiny. Nevertheless, the V4 1600cc Taunus engine had good performance, which I chose to enhance with a Webber twin choke carb, a large bore exhaust and a Kenlowe fan. These were all pretty much "fit and forget" but they increased the power at the wheels by about 40%, with a huge boost in torque, whilst 33 mpg was still achievable cruising at 80 mph. (the standard exhaust with a transverse front box presumably strangled the engine in production form)

The gearbox was a bit like the VW Beetle, 3 lowish gears to get the best performance and a taller cruising gear (20 mph per 1,000 revs!!). Having said that, with these modifications it would go right off the speedometer and across country I remember thrashing a rather brash fellow with a V8 Rover and curing his smugness!

The first of the 99s was good too. The engine, designed by Recarro for the SAAB 99 and the Triumph Dolomite (2 welded together as a V8 for the Triumph Stag) had lots of low down torque and good economy. Sadly, as with the Stag, it had problems and mine had to have the head skimmed @ around 35,000.

I thought SAABs were best in their rallying days when the man at the dealership wore overalls, a flat cap and carried an oily rag. Some of these guys had an encyclopedic knowledge of the cars and were very good on competitive prices too.

Then one day SAAB dealerships and franchises smartened up and you could no longer speak to the mechanic. They started behaving and costing like B*Ws, so I moved on and went elsewhere. That was to Peugeot at the start of diesels as we know them today, but that is a different story.

 

[Seeker_UK]

I had a 9000 Aero for a while.

Fantastic! Quick, comfy and not bad on fuel either.

A shame to see them go down the pan but GM just haven't spent any money on a suitable replacement for their 95 and that's a lot of market lost to Ford Mondeos and the new Vauxhall Vectra replacements.

And as for putting a V6 into the Aero! What's that all about? Just because the US market likes big engines, that's not what Saab are about - turbocharged 4-pots.

 

[PanzerMcGrory]

Thats what happens when you get into bed with fat yanks as Mercedes know to their cost.
Only saab i liked was the old 900 turbo with the three spoked alloys.

 

[hawk20]

And Moody's have just reduced Renault's credit rating to junk status. And the news is full of a rumour that a large UK car plant will be shut in next few days (Vauxhall?). Who'd be a carmaker at the moment?

 

[television]

Thinking about this in reality, have not we been producing too many for the last few years anyway

 

[stumpy]

Thinking about this in reality, have not we been producing too many for the last few years anyway

I agree - I'm not so sure about the mainstream stuff but years ago you had to wait months, sometimes years for a prestige car from the point of order. I remember ordering an M3 years ago and having to wait 12 months for it to be built. These days there is no wait for any car. They all went for volume from Ford to Bentley (only Rolls seem to be in good shape at the mo) and they have all been caught with their pants around their ankles! Greed and easy credit are to blame.

 

[Alex M Grieve]

I agree - I'm not so sure about the mainstream stuff but years ago you had to wait months, sometimes years for a prestige car from the point of order. I remember ordering an M3 years ago and having to wait 12 months for it to be built. These days there is no wait for any car. They all went for volume from Ford to Bentley (only Rolls seem to be in good shape at the mo) and they have all been caught with their pants around their ankles! Greed and easy credit are to blame.

Very true stumpy - and yet they learned the lesson in the 1960s.

When Lee Iacoca (who's autobiography, modestly titled "Iacoca" is worth a read) took over at Chrysler, he found a production department filling airfields with cars on "fast forward" and a sales department on "rewind". Cars were rusting and being recycled. The lesson of too much inventory was clearly explained.

Everyone then said that they would only build in response to orders. Sadly, to maintain the efficiencies of volumes, I think many manufacturers have worked out the popular combinations of colour and specification and make these speculatively anyway. So they are back to filling airfields, albeit more intelligently.

If you want an MB in silver with black upholstery and the more popular "extras" it has probably been built already and the dealership or lease company, who have just quoted you "6 weeks wait" will suddenly be able to source it much faster.

There have been winners though - I bought a pre-registered W203 AG diesel estate AG auto for a huge discount a couple of years ago - and it is flawless. So there are 2 sides to the coin, but Malcolm is right, there has been significant overproduction which just did not read how overstretched Mr & Mrs Average were on personal credit and the mill did not slow down.

Fo genuine "built to order", stumpy's experience is probably still true.

 

[stumpy]

Very true stumpy - and yet they learned the lesson in the 1960s.

When Lee Iacoca (who's autobiography, modestly titled "Iacoca" is worth a read) took over at Chrysler, he found a production department filling airfields with cars on "fast forward" and a sales department on "rewind". Cars were rusting and being recycled. The lesson of too much inventory was clearly explained.

Everyone then said that they would only build in response to orders. Sadly, to maintain the efficiencies of volumes, I think many manufacturers have worked out the popular combinations of colour and specification and make these speculatively anyway. So they are back to filling airfields, albeit more intelligently.

If you want an MB in silver with black upholstery and the more popular "extras" it has probably been built already and the dealership or lease company, who have just quoted you "6 weeks wait" will suddenly be able to source it much faster.

There have been winners though - I bought a pre-registered W203 AG diesel estate AG auto for a huge discount a couple of years ago - and it is flawless. So there are 2 sides to the coin, but Malcolm is right, there has been significant overproduction which just did not read how overstretched Mr & Mrs Average were on personal credit and the mill did not slow down.

Fo genuine "built to order", stumpy's experience is probably still true.

Not really, new M3s are available from stock. Years ago BMW dealers were not allowed to order M cars for stock. This was to protect residuals and keep the figures realistic. Now that has changed.

You only need to speak to a high end dealer such as Bentley to understand how out of kilter things have become.

 

[True romance]

so if I was to buy a new Saab today and next week they close, would that mean the warranty will be void or is there some EU law that protects you???