Save The World

[hawk20]

Holy mother, whatever comes next. How about this little baby for next year's Christmas present??

 

[Hibbo]

Now THAT is a nice motor!

Maybe we should all drive them, that'd show these bleeding heart lefties banging on about 'global heatering' and 'the oil will one day run out' and other such nonsense!

It's looks like just the thing to tackle that fearsome speedbump in Sainsbury's car park.

 

[izzi613]

Now THAT is a nice motor!

Maybe we should all drive them, that'd show these bleeding heart lefties banging on about 'global heatering' and 'the oil will one day run out' and other such nonsense!

It's looks like just the thing to tackle that fearsome speedbump in Sainsbury's car park.

Hibbo

Isn't this post at odds with a recent rant on another thread...

"The solution is simple; don't buy a **** chelsea tractor.

Maybe that doesn't sit well with our southern friends; DON'T BUY A ***** MONSTROSITY"

You DISGUST me."

You gotta be consistent man

 

[Hibbo]

Hibbo

Isn't this post at odds with a recent rant on another thread...

"The solution is simple; don't buy a **** chelsea tractor.

Maybe that doesn't sit well with our southern friends; DON'T BUY A ***** MONSTROSITY"

You DISGUST me."

You gotta be consistent man

I've seen the error of my ways!

 

[hawk20]

When we look at America, its huge consumption of energy, and then look at China growing at 10-12% per year, and at the huge population of India, and at Japan and South-east Asia, do we really think the puny efforts of a few of us on this tiny island -amounting to only one per cent of world population- do we really think this will make much difference? Will China really follow our lead, or Korea, or Malaysia? Is the Treasury right that this is a world problem, requiring world solutions and only if we can persuade Europe, the USA, China and India to join in, is it worth putting ourselves through the suffering needed to solve the problem?

 

[television]

When we look at America, its huge consumption of energy, and then look at China growing at 10-12% per year, and at the huge population of India, and at Japan and South-east Asia, do we really think the puny efforts of a few of us on this tiny island -amounting to only one per cent of world population- do we really think this will make much difference? Will China really follow our lead, or Korea, or Malaysia? Is the Treasury right that this is a world problem, requiring world solutions and only if we can persuade Europe, the USA, China and India to join in, is it worth putting ourselves through the suffering needed to solve the problem?

I feel the same on this one, The UK + a few other countries is not going to make any difference.

Malcolm

 

[Alfie]

I feel the same on this one, The UK + a few other countries is not going to make any difference.

Malcolm

Me too.

china, India, russia etc will undo in a week what we 'put right' in a year.

Its a waste of time and will make no difference at all. Its just yet another revenue stream for the government whilst they pander to the greens etc.

 

[izzi613]

When we look at America, its huge consumption of energy, and then look at China growing at 10-12% per year, and at the huge population of India, and at Japan and South-east Asia, do we really think the puny efforts of a few of us on this tiny island -amounting to only one per cent of world population- do we really think this will make much difference? Will China really follow our lead, or Korea, or Malaysia? Is the Treasury right that this is a world problem, requiring world solutions and only if we can persuade Europe, the USA, China and India to join in, is it worth putting ourselves through the suffering needed to solve the problem?

Damn right Hawk20

Now what to do about this. How about a mass demonstation where thousands of disgruntled motorists drive in to central London and park in the roads to bring the capital to a standstill. We will then engage with eachother in car chat whilst sipping margharitas on the pavement. We cannot just leave the demonstrating to the haulage industry!! Come on Television you would love to be at the head of the demo in your SL with a giant loud hailer strapped to the boot decrying the war against motorists

 

[hawk20]

Damn right Hawk20

Now what to do about this. How about a mass demonstation where thousands of disgruntled motorists drive in to central London and park in the roads to bring the capital to a standstill. We will then engage with eachother in car chat whilst sipping margharitas on the pavement. We cannot just leave the demonstrating to the haulage industry!! Come on Television you would love to be at the head of the demo in your SL with a giant loud hailer strapped to the boot decrying the war against motorists

Malcolm for President. Oddly enough a mass demonstration or two is about all that will stop road pricing afflicting us all.

 

[Hibbo]

If I may be serious for a moment;

I do agree that we are taxed to death and 'environmental' issues are a good (and easy) excuse for the government to tax us even more. BUT, I do think the "there's no point us doing anything to help, it'll make no difference" attitude is a little disheartening (I'm trying to de as diplomatic as I can ). It's similar to the "what's the point in voting? My vote won't make any difference" attitude. (The road to the Third Reich in '30s Germany was paved with apathy)

I know the US and China are the major polluters and our emmisions are relatively small, but we must ALL do our bit, please. Someone must take the moral high ground and take the lead, only then can pressure be put on rapidly expanding countries like China. The Germans are leading the way with genuine tax incentives for many different forms of biofuels, and even the US is starting to take major steps towards curbing it's emmisions (ironically Arnie seems to be leading the way)

The main jist of my arguement is that there are probably billions of people on this planet all thinking "What's the point of me turning that light off / turning the heating down / driving a more economical car / using energy saving bulbs / sharing lifts etc etc etc". An individual cannot make a difference, but a huge number of individuals can!

This is not aimed at anyone in particular and I do not mean do cause offence (no matter how many of your car's wheels are driven ) to anyone.


If anyone wants me I'll be eating organic lentils sat in a tree

 

[jberks]

on the serious side, it is true that we are a small number. But, proportionately allegedly we consume double the average in energy, so we have a way to go.
What gets me is not the whole 'green' agenda, but rather Gordon's cynical abuse of it to fill the financial holes left by his other naive policies.
There are biofuel alternatives but the market is incapable of bringing them to critical mass quickly enough. This is where Government could really help. I'd use Biodiesel if I could. I still have to get around and I insist on using something that will get me there in reasonable comfort, speed and safety but I can still be green-ish, if they'd let me.
But then there's no money in that.....

 

[television]

If I may be serious for a moment;

I do agree that we are taxed to death and 'environmental' issues are a good (and easy) excuse for the government to tax us even more. BUT, I do think the "there's no point us doing anything to help, it'll make no difference" attitude is a little disheartening (I'm trying to de as diplomatic as I can ). It's similar to the "what's the point in voting? My vote won't make any difference" attitude. (The road to the Third Reich in '30s Germany was paved with apathy)

I know the US and China are the major polluters and our emmisions are relatively small, but we must ALL do our bit, please. Someone must take the moral high ground and take the lead, only then can pressure be put on rapidly expanding countries like China. The Germans are leading the way with genuine tax incentives for many different forms of biofuels, and even the US is starting to take major steps towards curbing it's emmisions (ironically Arnie seems to be leading the way)

The main jist of my arguement is that there are probably billions of people on this planet all thinking "What's the point of me turning that light off / turning the heating down / driving a more economical car / using energy saving bulbs / sharing lifts etc etc etc". An individual cannot make a difference, but a huge number of individuals can!

This is not aimed at anyone in particular and I do not mean do cause offence (no matter how many of your car's wheels are driven ) to anyone.


If anyone wants me I'll be eating organic lentils sat in a tree

Having lived in Sweden,when they put up tax there or bring out new green policies, the public say "thank you very much" and life goes on.

You do though have a good point in your answer. Can I take away the ladder

malcolm

 

[Hibbo]

Having lived in Sweden,when they put up tax there or bring out new green policies, the public say "thank you very much" and life goes on.

You do though have a good point in your answer. Can I take away the ladder

malcolm

Good point Malcolm (apart from the ladder comment), I think us Brits do like to moan about anything and everything. We're not happy unless we're moaning!


As to Blobcat's comments about BioD, I fully concur and I am extremely frustrated at the government's (and industry's) complete lack of interest towards GENUINELY supporting it and other biofuels. As you say; no money to be made (and got to keep the big oil companies happy).

 

[MarkF]

Hello to all,

I have just read this thread, and I have to say I agree that we do need to think of the planet more, but I also think that the bloke in number 11 needs to live in the real world and not fantasy island.
I thought long and hard before I bought the ML270 CDi, the reason I purchased this fantastic car was that its the best thing since sliced bread to pull the horse trailer.
So to go green and drive a small car like the bloke in number 11 wants us all to do (when we are all driving around in smart cars he will find an excuse to tax these to death also) would mean my wife and daughter giving up there hobby of horses, NO WAY.
I'm not a rich man or Id have a SL and Sclass to go with the ML, but the horses mean agreat deal to her, they are as she says her salvation in life.
My hobby is building miniature live steam locomotives and for this I need a large estate car, I have the ever trusty slogger of a Mondeo estate for this. This is my company car and as I need this to undertake my day to day duties of keeping the telecoms network including the new GSMR network on our railways working, why should I pay tax on what is a tool to do my job.
The ML gives out less polution than some of the so called cars that they would like us to drive, its a 4x4 so must be bad, WRONG Mercedes build some of the best engines in the world, and it takes up no more space on the drive that the Mondeo.
One day when its to late the bods in Downing Street will wake up and listen to what the population has to say, get freight of the roads and onto the rail, thats what its good at moving big loads from A to B.
Anyway I think I should get of my soap box before I have my head knocked off, yes we all need to do our bit, but number 10 needs to do its bit as well in a more constructive way.

 

[izzi613]

Having lived in Sweden,when they put up tax there or bring out new green policies, the public say "thank you very much" and life goes on.

malcolm

Malcolm Malcolm, that's because they have beautiful women to run after (same in Italia) what have we here...:sad:

 

[hawk20]

BUT, I do think the "there's no point us doing anything to help, it'll make no difference" attitude is a little disheartening (I'm trying to de as diplomatic as I can ). It's similar to the "what's the point in voting? My vote won't make any difference" attitude.

It is easy to misunderstand the arguments here. I don't think anyone is saying do nothing. What some are saying is individual action is useless; concerted action is essential. It is no good Britain giving up flying abroad, taxing cars to death and so on, unless we get a broad agreement that all major countries are going to join the cause. You just get suffering and no real gain. Just like Nuclear disarmament, unilateral is no good. Nobody follows and you don't even get a place at the talks. Every effort should be directed to multi-lateral talks and action. As we get others to move, so we should agree to move too.