Thinking Of Purchasing C220 CDI Sport Estate or E Class Estate?

[Martian]

Hi Everybody,

Hope everybody is managing to live a relatively normal life during these extraordinary times.

I am currently looking to replace my 2006 Peugeot 307SW Estate, (purchased for the princely sum of £300 and still going strong some 14 months later - but MOT time is looming), and I was going to look for a bargain 407SW Estate, (just a little bit larger than the 307SW)!

But then I got 'swayed' by a number of Mercedes C Class Estates that started to 'crop up' in my searches - as you do!

My re-focused searches then lead me to the E Class Estates too . . . !

I have undertaken a little research into both the C and E Classes, (2002 onwards), and I could be tempted to purchase one if it is in good, overall, condition and the price is right, (around the £1500 mark), but I would welcome the forum members thoughts and opinions and I realise that any suitable vehicle will be a few years old and things will begin to go wrong!

I undertake most repairs myself so I do not mind a few challenges but would prefer not to have to start undertaking engine rebuilds or extensive bodywork although I know, from experience, that there are plenty of 'good' vehicles out there that have plenty of life left!

May I ask what sort of mileage, (I have seen many Mercedes with 200K plus mileages), can be expected from the diesel engine range and what are the most common issues, (with both the engine and other systems)?

Incidentaly my Peugeot 307SW has 205,000 miles on the clock!

What sort of things should I be looking for, (I have Jeep Grand Cherokee with a 2.7CRD Mercedes Diesel engine that suffered the 'black death' and I had to clean the head and recut all the Injector seats and replace the Injector seals), do the C and E Class engines sufffer from the same issue?

A certain 2006 C220 CDI Sport has caught my eye and I could be tempted but the current climate presents a bit of a problem with regards to viewing any vehicle at this moment in time and I am certainly not going to purchase blind!

Any advice and guidance would be gratefully received.

Martian.

Jaguar XF, Jeep GC, Peugeot 307, Ducati 1198s, BMW GSA1200R, Benelli Tornado Tres.

 

[Chrishazle]

Don't go older than 2004, as lack of galvanising leads to rusting problems. If space is the requirement then the E class estate is cavernous but externally it's also larger - wife loves our C class estate but when parked next to an E class estate of similar age, she siad the E was too big for her. For an S203, good engines are the C270Cdi and the 320 V6 diesel. The pre-facelift (MY2011) C220Cdi's seem pretty bullet proof, or there's the very similar engine in the C250Cdi if you want a bit more oomph but lower mpg and I suspect higher RF.

 

[Martian]

Don't go older than 2004, as lack of galvanising leads to rusting problems. If space is the requirement then the E class estate is cavernous but externally it's also larger - wife loves our C class estate but when parked next to an E class estate of similar age, she siad the E was too big for her. For an S203, good engines are the C270Cdi and the 320 V6 diesel. The pre-facelift (MY2011) C220Cdi's seem pretty bullet proof, or there's the very similar engine in the C250Cdi if you want a bit more oomph but lower mpg and I suspect higher RF.

Chrishazle, many thanks for your advice - I will discount any pre 2004 model as per your advice - especially so as I had already noticed that there was a bit of a corrosion issue with the earlier models during my searches!

The additional 'space' would be useful but that may not compensate for the larger vehicle size and reduced mpg although my 'girls' may disagree, (2 x Husky's, 1 x Labradoodle and 1 x Sprollie)!

 

[Blobcat]

Hello and welcome

C220 is a decent car of that age. The E Classes from 02 to late 06 have SBC brakes which can be a little expensive.

 

[Martian]

Hello and welcome

C220 is a decent car of that age. The E Classes from 02 to late 06 have SBC brakes which can be a little expensive.

Bobcat, many thanks for the additional info - as with all modern vehicles things have become more complex with the addition of electronics although the benefits are definitely worth the additional complexity, (traction and dynamic stability control), until things go wrong of course, (additional sensors, pump/modulators, electronic module, etc)!

Even my bikes have traction control and dynamic suspension - the days of roadside repairs are rapidly diminishing and all of my Ducati's have spent time on the back of an AA trailer at some point in the past!

At the end of the day every vehicle will develop faults - most of which will be down to pure bad luck of course and my philosophy is simple - if I am going to have to spend the weekend working on one of my vehicles I would rather it be something worth the time and effort rather than something that is not!

Although my daily workhorse, (the Pug307), is in pretty good shape, (and has never let me down), I doubt that it is worth more than the price of four new tyres and I also need to look at the cooling fan too - so it may be time to replace it with something with a little more character!

Not that I want to be spending all my spare time in the garage - that is what I bought the Ducati for, (she currently has a clutch problem)!

 

[Blobcat]

Bobcat, many thanks for the additional info - as with all modern vehicles things have become more complex with the addition of electronics although the benefits are definitely worth the additional complexity, (traction and dynamic stability control), until things go wrong of course, (additional sensors, pump/modulators, electronic module, etc)!

Even my bikes have traction control and dynamic suspension - the days of roadside repairs are rapidly diminishing and all of my Ducati's have spent time on the back of an AA trailer at some point in the past!

At the end of the day every vehicle will develop faults - most of which will be down to pure bad luck of course and my philosophy is simple - if I am going to have to spend the weekend working on one of my vehicles I would rather it be something worth the time and effort rather than something that is not!

Although my daily workhorse, (the Pug307), is in pretty good shape, (and has never let me down), I doubt that it is worth more than the price of four new tyres and I also need to look at the cooling fan too - so it may be time to replace it with something with a little more character!

Not that I want to be spending all my spare time in the garage - that is what I bought the Ducati for, (she currently has a clutch problem)!

You’ve some decent bikes, I’ve had 3 x 1200 GSA’s and a 996 SPS, still have my ‘93 CBR600

 

[Chrishazle]

You would have liked the Duke a friend's stepson had, not sure which model (good size engine though) plus it had been "breathed on" by Joey Dunlop's mechanic so was seriously quick. Apparently on a deserted M20 between J8 and J9 (a 14 mile streatch) the back end got lively at about 140mph and Steve was a good enough rider he knew not to brake but to accelerate - I guess like when a caravan starts snaking. Rear finally started behaving at about 180 indicated!

 

[John Laidlaw]

Welcome

 

[Martian]

You’ve some decent bikes, I’ve had 3 x 1200 GSA’s and a 996 SPS, still have my ‘93 CBR600

You too by the look of your list! My history is thus: -

Yamaha FSIE, Kawasaki KH250, Suzuki GT750, Suzuki GT750, Pepsi Suzuki GSXR1100, Suzuki GSXR1100, Suzuki GT750, Yamaha FZR1000 EXUP, Ducati 916, Ducati 750 Paso, Suzuki GT250, Kawasaki G1000, Honda RVF400, Honda Blackbird, FILA Ducati 999R, BMW GSA1200, Suzuki GT750, BMW GSA1200, Benelli Tornado Tres, Ducati 1198S, BMW GSA1250!

As you can see I am a glutton for punishment!

Also owned a Merc SLK Convertible a while back so I do not feel a complete stranger to the marque!

 

[sonic]

You would have liked the Duke a friend's stepson had, not sure which model (good size engine though) plus it had been "breathed on" by Joey Dunlop's mechanic so was seriously quick. Apparently on a deserted M20 between J8 and J9 (a 14 mile streatch) the back end got lively at about 140mph and Steve was a good enough rider he knew not to brake but to accelerate - I guess like when a caravan starts snaking. Rear finally started behaving at about 180 indicated!

Welcome you have had some good bikes there, except the the BMW! I had a VFR750 then the 800, did 155mph on the autobahn rock solid. Currently have a FJR1300 been up to 140mph on the autobahn with panniers & a top box, again rock solid. Used to be a police rider so managed to ride all the exotic stuff owned by someone else.
You won't go wrong with a E220CDI or a E320CDI as late a possible, but make sure it has service history.

 

[Martian]

Welcome you have had some good bikes there, except the the BMW! I had a VFR750 then the 800, did 155mph on the autobahn rock solid. Currently have a FJR1300 been up to 140mph on the autobahn with panniers & a top box, again rock solid. Used to be a police rider so managed to ride all the exotic stuff owned by someone else.
You won't go wrong with a E220CDI or a E320CDI as late a possible, but make sure it has service history.

Hi Sonic - many thanks for your comments and I also spent he some of my time wearing green and then went over to the 'dark' side and wore navy blue and then black!!

You may well be aware of the infamous Pan 'weave' phenominon that was widely discussed some time ago - I have a friend who's Pan has done well in excess of 150k and it is still pristine and on all original engine parts and he knows the marque inside out, (he also had a Rocket and could put that beast through its paces too)!

I was smitten by the GSA the first time I rode one.

I won a raffle at one of the earlier Honda Fireblade model release presentation evenings - the prize being a new Fireblade for the weekend - but I asked if I could take out a new GSA, (they were a BMW, Triumph and Honda dealer back then).

My friend and I rode over to South Wales on the saturday morning and camped at a place I can no longer remember and we then rode up to Llandudno in the morning and then across to York, (spending the afternoon in the Railway Museum), handing the bike back on the monday morning with over 1000 miles on the trip odometer!!

Apologies to everybody for trangressing - I am still hankering over the C220 Sport but just wary of the chrome inserts on the wheel archesing as this may be hiding something sinister - yet they do look good - but possibly cheaper than new wings??

Thanks to 'LostKiWi' for responding to my other post!

 

[JBell]

The 2006 C sounds good, I would stay well clear of any E Class pre 2006 because of the SBC brakes, to tell the difference the non SBC car will have a point in the bottom of the front grille, the SBC car is rounded

 

[Martian]

JBell,

Many thanks for your further comments - which are quite relevent as I am still hankering over a E320, (as well as the C220), but they are quite a distance away and it is obviously not the best of times to be car viewing currently!

I may hang on a little while and see if anything crops up a little nearer to home!

I am sure that I read that the infamous SBC brake modulator has a pre-programmed number of actuations and, once reached, it flags an error which can only be reset by a Mercedes OBD computer and that the modulator is quite expensive?

Obviously the purchase of any second hand vehicle is a gamble and you just have to go with your 'gut instinct', (after the usual visual checks - and a test drive of course), but I have been very lucky to date - so I suspect that I may be due to land a 'lemon' this time round!

Although I have, deliberately, bought a few 'lemons' in my time - where the faults were highlighted and reflected in the price - hence my current battle with the Merc 2.7CRD with 'black death'!

But I don't want to spend all of my spare time in the garage . . .

 

[JBell]

JBell,

Many thanks for your further comments - which are quite relevent as I am still hankering over a E320, (as well as the C220), but they are quite a distance away and it is obviously not the best of times to be car viewing currently!

I may hang on a little while and see if anything crops up a little nearer to home!

I am sure that I read that the infamous SBC brake modulator has a pre-programmed number of actuations and, once reached, it flags an error which can only be reset by a Mercedes OBD computer and that the modulator is quite expensive?

Obviously the purchase of any second hand vehicle is a gamble and you just have to go with your 'gut instinct', (after the usual visual checks - and a test drive of course), but I have been very lucky to date - so I suspect that I may be due to land a 'lemon' this time round!

Although I have, deliberately, bought a few 'lemons' in my time - where the faults were highlighted and reflected in the price - hence my current battle with the Merc 2.7CRD with 'black death'!

But I don't want to spend all of my spare time in the garage . . .

No worries, the SBC module is very expensive

You may be able to get into a W204 C Class

 

[V6Matty]

There’s a guy on here that can fully rebuild the SBC unit I think he charges only a couple of hundred therefore it will likely then outlast the rest of the car.

 

[Martian]

JBell & V6Matty,

Many thanks for your responses re the SBC units.

I have a habit of 'investing' in specialist marques, (Range Rover's, Jaguars, Saab's, Ducati's, etc), that have 'specialist' modules and components and then learn a little about the systems, (obtain the test gear and software), and then move on - this not realising the positives of my imposed learning!!

I suspect that I may now be adding Mercedes to that list of motor manufacturers too!

The E Series does look like a lot of car for the money, (but it will also come with a few potential nightmares too - no doubt), and I have to be careful that I do not set my sights too high otherwise I may end up spending moe than I planned - thus defeating my primary objective of getting reasonable value for money!

But I am also a realist and fully appreciate that any second hand vehicle WILL have issues - we just have to hope that they do not turn into a money pit and spend more time off the road than on!

Meanwhile I will keep looking!!

Best Regards.

 

[M80]

Yes they're all prone to black death.
If you have recut the 5 seats for the Gr Cherokee I guess you took the head off as the 2 rear bores are inaccessible.

The inline 6, 3 litre was less likely to throw up issues than the newer V6, but they were fitted pre 2005 and so the car will rust easier.

V6 smoother and quieter than the other CDI's, but has inherrant issues and more thirsty. A lovely lump to drive though.

The 2.7 is the most agricultural, but power and economy wise it beats the 220, generally. And is as reliable. Again though not so easy to find one in the later galvanised mo mo's.
Trust me your Jeep will resist rust far better then any Merc.

Loads of 220's to choose from. My choice would be the simpler, but well specced C Class. Avoid Comand if possible of that age it is near useless and an Android is far better so you would likely swap it anyway.
The E is larger and generally better specced as standard.

For me it would be leather, heated seats, and if more than one driver memory pack.

Sports are a hard ride.

 

[Chrishazle]

In the 203 series Classic trim is basic, IMHO top spec Avanatgard has too many toys so potential money put if/when they start going wrong, Elegance trim was just right and is what I bought (C270Cdi Elegance S203) as my first MB. 204 interior is much nicer so after a couple of years when I saw an excellent deal on an S204 C220 Elegance I went for it - in March 2012, and we still have the car!

 

[V6Matty]

Worth noting that the c class is normal sprung suspension at the rear where as the E will have SLS, not expensive again to fix but die add to that complication list.
S211 with the 270 engine are also different from the other 270’s fitted to other chassis for some reason, they got the update OM647 which was a cracking engine and seems to not suffer with Black Death like the previous OM612, also slightly more economical and powerful too boot. They also happen to map very nicely to around 225bhp and 560tourques (I think was the number I ran on mine) without even pushing the map hard.
Wonderful cars and I miss the one I sold

 

[Chrishazle]

Slightly over budget, but this dealer has a very good reputation on MBClub.

https://forums.mbclub.co.uk/threads...night-edition-bluetec-automatic-black.261289/