Update: W211 in limp mode - EGR valve?

[cheshireE220]

My W211 had both the turbo boost hose and housing replaced yesterday after it split with a bang and black smoke.

The CEL has gone out. But the car is in limp mode, won't go above 3k rpm and has grey smoke from exhaust on leaving the MB dealer that stopped after a few miles.

The dealer wants the car to be booked in again for a diagnostic to trace the fault and fix it.

The technician says it's pointing to the EGR valve but it needs to go on the diagnostics and this valve may be the cause of the hose splitting if it is stuck closed. They think 2 hours work.

Is this a big expensive job? The part-ex against another car (300e) didn't work out because I rejected the other car on its condition. Therefore, mine will have to be fixed. The MOT is due by the month end. It is booked for MOT on 17th October - that could be rxtended to fix the fault then MOT on the same day.

Do experts on here have any other views on why the car is in limp mode with no power? There are no warning lights on. The car idles fine.

 

[onefortheroad]

Needs the codes read.

New egr £400

Used in eBay £99

 

[cheshireE220]

Needs the codes read.

New egr £400

Used in eBay £99

Thank you. It seems the duagnistic is the next step. The technician stated EGR but needs codes to trace the fault. The car has no value part-ex but I will have to spend to sort it. I'm going to change it in 2025 - preferably a PHEV 2019/20 300e premium edition. Alternatively a E220 2.0 litre turbo petrol (non hybrid).

This is money I won't get back, but it is what it is. Till now after 21yrs and 158k miles it has been good.

Could the EGR be stuck closed and caused the turbo hose to bliw off and split?

 

[onefortheroad]

Thank you. It seems the duagnistic is the next step. The technician stated EGR but needs codes to trace the fault. The car has no value part-ex but I will have to spend to sort it. I'm going to change it in 2025 - preferably a PHEV 2019/20 300e premium edition. Alternatively a E220 2.0 litre turbo petrol (non hybrid).

This is money I won't get back, but it is what it is. Till now after 21yrs and 158k miles it has been good.

Could the EGR be stuck closed and caused the turbo hose to bliw off and split?

Someone on here might buy it for spares ??

 

[cheshireE220]

Someone on here might buy it for spares ??

That is a possibility But the route looks like fix the car, hold it and part-ex when I see a replacement, in my own time and not be rushed into an early purchase.

 

[cheshireE220]

Fixing the blown and split turbo hose has been done. Those costs are over.
However, we need to find out what caused the blown hose and cracked the housing to which it attaches.

Presumably, the rest of the turbo plumbing and intercooler are all OK because they did not require replacements.

Could the EGR be the cause of the blown pipe? For example if it got stuck in the closed position, unable to divert (vent) excess boost as the revs rise?

Any expert care to comment and help identify cause of the blowout?

 

[oigle]

Thank you. It seems the duagnistic is the next step. The technician stated EGR but needs codes to trace the fault. The car has no value part-ex but I will have to spend to sort it. I'm going to change it in 2025 - preferably a PHEV 2019/20 300e premium edition. Alternatively a E220 2.0 litre turbo petrol (non hybrid).

This is money I won't get back, but it is what it is. Till now after 21yrs and 158k miles it has been good.

Could the EGR be stuck closed and caused the turbo hose to bliw off and split?

Unlikely that stuck egr would cause split hose. There is no connection between egr and boost levels. Hoses don't last forever.

 

[onefortheroad]

You can blank off an egr and nothing happens to turbo pressure or pipes.

 

[supernoodle]

Unlikely that stuck egr would cause split hose. There is no connection between egr and boost levels. Hoses don't last forever.

Not just unlikely, I'd say impossible.

If the technician was suggesting that I'd be worried.

Could the EGR be the cause of the blown pipe? For example if it got stuck in the closed position, unable to divert (vent) excess boost as the revs rise?

Pressure is higher in exhaust than in intake, that's how EGR works. Boost cannot flow that way.

 

[cheshireE220]

These are helpful answers. Thank you.
Just to clarify, the technician told the service guy he "suspects egr valve as the cause of the limp mode, but it needs diagnostics to trace and fix the fault" to which the service guy (who is new to MB and been there just days) added, "it might explain why the hose split" which is evidently untrue and unrelated.

The service manager is on leave this week. So I'll wait till he is back next week to agree next steps. I have known him ever since I first got the car from the dealership and prefer only to deal with him and not the youngsters in the department.

I'll update this thread after speaking to him. Thank you to all for all the help.

 

[M80]

While MB will likely ignore any diagnosis you perform, you might get a heads up on the EGR for a few quids.

An EML327 for about £10, plugged onto your OBD port,

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would transmit to an Android device with 'Torque' free version loaded.
That can monitor the EGR easily. It wouldn't be long before you either see it fluctuating from 5% to approx 100%, or not.
Since yours went with a pop we can be sure the turbo boost is boosting well, but since you are in limp the turbo would be disabled anyway.

There are many other sensors that can be monitored live by this. Of course, as you don't know (I assume) the acceptable parameters it would mean more questions.

 

[Snake Charmer]

The 2003 S211 E320CDI I currently drive lost boost when I first put the car back on the road, no codes or EML* showing. I traced it to the turbo controller, mainly due the noise with the ignition on of the controller. It was an easy fix, nothing more than a corroded operating linkage from standing a few months. A good clean up and lubricate saw boost resumed.
I think your engine is a 4 cylinder version of the OM648, I wonder if your overtaking manoeuvre went to maximum boost and did not back off blowing the hose/seal and the linkage is now stuck.

* EML: Engine Management Light.

 

[M80]

Not familiar with this earlier engine, but I would expect the turbo actuator to cycle its travel as the key is cycled.
That is someone watching should see it move up, and back again. But if it failed that should cause the EML.

 

[cheshireE220]

The 2003 S211 E320CDI I currently drive lost boost when I first put the car back on the road, no codes or EML* showing. I traced it to the turbo controller, mainly due the noise with the ignition on of the controller. It was an easy fix, nothing more than a corroded operating linkage from standing a few months. A good clean up and lubricate saw boost resumed.
I think your engine is a 4 cylinder version of the OM648, I wonder if your overtaking manoeuvre went to maximum boost and did not back off blowing the hose/seal and the linkage is now stuck.

* EML: Engine Management Light.

View attachment 91908

View attachment 91907

This is a possibility. There could be several possibilities. I guess I'll have to take it back to MB next week for a diagnostic and take it from there.

The idle is fine. No CEL.

I'm guessing when it had its first 'diagnostic' last tuesday after the incident on saturday, it was a visual diagnostic and not on STAR.

After all, if the technician saw the hose was split, he'd not then connect it to STAR. Had he done so, he would have discovered the split hose had created other faults - the limp mode was still there after fixing the hose and air box.

In the clinical world, if a guy presents with a machete stuck in his head, the cause of death is assumed to be trauma to the head. But if they had done a blood test, they might have discovered the protein troponin in the blood, confirming the guy died from a heart attack before someone stuck a machete through his head!

 

[Snake Charmer]

Not familiar with this earlier engine, but I would expect the turbo actuator to cycle its travel as the key is cycled.
That is someone watching should see it move up, and back again. But if it failed that should cause the EML.

That's what I thought would happen, Xentry showed no fault. As I have two near identical cars it was the sound from the turbo controller with the ignition on and the lack of boost that led me to consider swapping the turbo or controller between cars hence finding the problem.

If this is the OP's problem, I can see quite a big bill from MB just diagnosing let alone the repair costs, ie replacement turbo and actuator.

 

[cheshireE220]

UPDATE: The car is all sorted. The CEL after the boost hose was replaced turned out to be the EGR valeve needing to be cleaned of the vehicle and re-fitted. Next, a regen on the DPF to clear the soot. They test-drove it over 10 miles and called me to say it is fixed. I drove it home and it is fine. Thy also did the MoT yesterday - passed, no advisories. I will take it for a long motorway run of 150 miles or so at the weekend to ensure the whole exhaust system and DPF get up to heat properly.

I will look to part-ex next year after April for a 300e or a 220 petrol c4 or 5 years old.

 

[onefortheroad]

UPDATE: The car is all sorted. The CEL after the boost hose was replaced turned out to be the EGR valeve needing to be cleaned of the vehicle and re-fitted. Next, a regen on the DPF to clear the soot. They test-drove it over 10 miles and called me to say it is fixed. I drove it home and it is fine. Thy also did the MoT yesterday - passed, no advisories. I will take it for a long motorway run of 150 miles or so at the weekend to ensure the whole exhaust system and DPF get up to heat properly.

I will look to part-ex next year after April for a 300e or a 220 petrol c4 or 5 years old.

Try adding Dipetane to your fuel to help keep it clean.

 

[cheshireE220]

Try adding Dipetane to your fuel to help keep it clean.

I use RedEx as a fuel additive. Never heard of dipetane.

 

[Blobcat]

I use RedEx as a fuel additive. Never heard of dipetane.

Try it along with 2EHN - I use a concoction of both in my cdi smart and am very impressed “more go” and my spreadsheet is advising of an increase in fuel economy.

 

[onefortheroad]

Millers eco max is the expensive version of ehn 99. Mixed with Dipetane your car will be on steroids.winter time is best for it tbh. So much better starting and quiet running.

We here buy ehn 99 direct from hydra . Works out loads cheaper. A 5 litre bottle lasts me well over a year .