Urgent ideas please

[S500 Pete]

Hi, Just left National Tyres trying to get a new rear tyre fitted.

Problem was that the wheel nuts were overtightened previously and although they shifted the ordinary nuts the locking nut was so tight it has damaged the key and still not moved.

Any fresh ideas on shifting it?

I now have a new tyre sitting there paid for online and no way to get it fitted.

 

[EmilysDad]

When I was in the same boat I went to ATS who had a set something like these ... https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/locking-wheel-nut-remover-2pc/
But do the locking nut 1st while the other bolts are tight

 

[S500 Pete]

When I was in the same boat I went to ATS who had a set something like these ... https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/locking-wheel-nut-remover-2pc/
But do the locking nut 1st while the other bolts are tight

Thanks

 

[Blobcat]

When you do get it off, take the remaining 3 off and replace them with normal bolts...

One method that can work is park close to a strong metal post or a brick wall. Put the locking adapter on the nut with an extension and bar. Then wedge a scissor jack between the post/wall and the end of the breaker bar.
You want it to force the locking adapter as hard as possible into the locking wheel bolt.
Once you have it really pressing in (until the post bends or the wall collapses...) press down on the breaker bar (whilst crossing your fingers and anything else you can)

With luck the force will be sufficient to allow you to undo the bolt.

 

[Jim2]

While checking out the boot in my latest MB acquisition, I found a small metal box n the wheel well. It had 4 original wheel bolts and the removal socket for the locking bolt..thereafter followed the quickest bolt swop you have ever seen!

 

[Blobcat]

While checking out the boot in my latest MB acquisition, I found a small metal box n the wheel well. It had 4 original wheel bolts and the removal socket for the locking bolt..thereafter followed the quickest bolt swop you have ever seen!

My little “suitcase” has my locking bolts and adapter in as well

 

[rorywquin]

There are tools available however, I think the fitter will be able to get it off (check with them). Next time remove the keyed bolts and put the standard ones in when you get work done on your wheels.

While checking out the boot in my latest MB acquisition, I found a small metal box n the wheel well. It had 4 original wheel bolts and the removal socket for the locking bolt..thereafter followed the quickest bolt swop you have ever seen!

Ditto

 

[rifiki]

When fixed loose the locking wheel nuts.

 

[peterws1957]

If all else fails, I've seen my mate, who buys cars at auction, carefully chisel through the spinning ring thing, pull off the splined bit and then weld on a large nut to it, refit onto the splines and use a normal socket to undo. He's got it down to 10 minutes or so now.

 

[Jim2]

Thats a good method, if you happen to have access to a MIG welder, but it all depends on how deep the bolt is in the wheel.They can be very awkward at times. The best solution is to change them while you can. I had an Audi 6 before, and the lock bolts were very good..they had deep spines, with a deep splined socket to match. I never had a problem with them. But quite a lot are badly designed rubbish .

 

[peterws1957]

Yep the best approach is not to use locking nuts, or if you do make sure you have the key and its in good nick. A wheel thief won't hesitate to force the boot to a get a key either. If you're faced with a car without a key though, your choices are a bit limited.

 

[S500 Pete]

Still not got it off but I have bought a new locking adaptor (£36 ouch) I am going to remove one of the others so that I can see properly what I am dealing with. Don't fancy damaging a 19" alloy by hacking around blindly.

 

[Jim2]

Still not got it off but I have bought a new locking adaptor (£36 ouch) I am going to remove one of the others so that I can see properly what I am dealing with. Don't fancy damaging a 19" alloy by hacking around blindly.

Yes Pete, and you are right. As I said earlier, if the locking bolts are in a deep recess within the wheel, and its an expensive allow wheel,,,its a problem, especially if it combines an outer ring, which just revolves around the locking bolt,so the ordinary reverse thread removal socket won't work with it.
In the pic that I have uploaded, you can see 3 lock nut removal sockets (1) MB ( 2) Peugeot 508 (3) Unknown make. But all 3 have the same thing in common,,,the amount of gripping edge in each is only a few mm. Then see (4) the standard 17 mm. socket, and the depth of grip that has compared to the others. So its not surprising that these lock nuts can be very problematic. But by now I imagine that tyre garages will have the problem solved, in the most common cases anyway.

 

[badger_wazzala]

Have a look on amazon as they have a fair few removal kits for MB wheel nuts and do your best to soak in release oil spray if you can. Welding the head of another nut on is how I'd have played the game (protect wheel face against slag/flux spits) and I think it's brilliant advice.

When you get this off and replace your nuts :-D is there a specific tightening sequence for the MB wheels along with small torque tolerances? I'm sure I read somewhere the discs warp otherwise?

 

[LostKiwi]

When you get this off and replace your nuts :-D is there a specific tightening sequence for the MB wheels along with small torque tolerances? I'm sure I read somewhere the discs warp otherwise?

Tighten opposites. I always start at the valve (if it lines up with a bolt) or opposite the valve (if it doesn't).
Then going clockwise do every second bolt.
I usually do tightening in 3 phases. Initial tighten to seat the bolts and wheel. Then a half tighten then full torque. Once torqued go round again to check.

Torque settings may be different for different models.

Never heard of discs warping through putting wheels on.

 

[badger_wazzala]

Yeah ta, I’ll try and find the thread on here. I happy fitting wheels with my eyes closed and standing on one foot but I’m certain a few of you guys agreed it can lead to problems if tightened in an incorrect pattern.

 

[LostKiwi]

Disc should be held in place by the retaining screw. It also mounts direct to the flange which should be clean and flat. The disc is clamped between the wheel and flange so should always end up aligned by the flange and wheel.
If you have dirt between flange and disc that's another matter....

 

[badger_wazzala]

Disc should be held in place by the retaining screw. It also mounts direct to the flange which should be clean and flat. The disc is clamped between the wheel and flange so should always end up aligned by the flange and wheel.
If you have dirt between flange and disc that's another matter....

Indeed. I just bought another car to use for track, it came with a full mot, and no disc retaining bolts so they were rammed up against the wheel bolts also both of the front callipers had lose hangers, and a rear caliper had a leak.
did I mention this had a recent and Full mot.
I’ll find the info regarding wheel stud tightening sequence (un related to discs/hubs). I remember it as it’s the first time I’ve ever seen that mentioned and it was defiantly regarding a Merc. Maybe another MB forum filled with bro science

 

[S500 Pete]

Finally found a local mechanic who has got all of the locking bolts off for me. They all needed a 4 foot bar and a bit of hammering for shock to remove them. The damaged one involved a lot of chiseling, a turned down socket to fit in to the recess and a lot of hammering. Some scratching in the recess but nothing that really shows.

All locking bolts are now in the bin.

Thanks for all the suggestions.

 

[Jim2]

Finally found a local mechanic who has got all of the locking bolts off for me. They all needed a 4 foot bar and a bit of hammering for shock to remove them. The damaged one involved a lot of chiseling, a turned down socket to fit in to the recess and a lot of hammering. Some scratching in the recess but nothing that really shows.

All locking bolts are now in the bin.

Thanks for all the suggestions.

And thats the problem with them in a nutshell.....and bearing in mind that you had a mechanic on hand, with all the tools, and yet it was still a difficult job.....now a different scenario, when you are stuck on the side of the road, and many miles away from home or a service centre and its the middle of the night. Nightmare is the only way to describe it.