W210 Doesn't feel right.......

[nick100]

My 99 E240 Elegance just doesn't feel right. The back end seems unstable, a bit like getting stuck on a white line with low profile tyres, it squirms around. Sorry but thats about as accurate a description as I can come up with.
Tyres are Pirelli's and are at correct pressure, the wheels and tyres are standard. I've had the car up on a lift and there is nothing obvious wrong.

Has anyone come across this before?

Also can anyone tell me whether or not I could fit Aventguard springs as I understand the car will sit slightly lower with these.


Nick

 

[mercman_1]

Squirming

Jack up the rear end and spin the wheels to see if the tyre has warped, This can happen if the tyre has hit a kerb at sometime the exterior of the tyre looks OK but the internal weave can be damaged causing the tyre to twist hence it feels as if it squirming.

 

[clive williams]

My 99 E240 Elegance just doesn't feel right. The back end seems unstable, a bit like getting stuck on a white line with low profile tyres, it squirms around. Sorry but thats about as accurate a description as I can come up with.
Tyres are Pirelli's and are at correct pressure, the wheels and tyres are standard. I've had the car up on a lift and there is nothing obvious wrong.

Has anyone come across this before?

Also can anyone tell me whether or not I could fit Aventguard springs as I understand the car will sit slightly lower with these.


Nick

Nick,

Our barge came with P6000s and the handling was awful. Admittedly, we changed to Michelin winter tyres but the handling is much more respectable. I must be severely prejudice against P6000s and most Pirellis - check out various other threads but I've not been happy with them since they stopped making the CN36s (shows my age). Goodyears seem to be a good favourite at the moment.

Clive

500E Goodyear F1s
E320CDIT210 Michelin Alpin A2s

 

[turnipsock]

Nick, is the problem more noticable as you turn into a corner and seem better once you are in the middle of a corner? That is, is it worse as you change direction.

My 320CE is like this. I have tried various tyre compinations (by swapping wheels from the 230TE) and have ruled out anything to do with tyres.

I am going to change the rear springs shortly. I changed to front ones a short time ago and there was a remarkable improvement in the handling.

 

[Parrot of Doom]

Have you checked the car's alignment?

 

[malcolm E53 AMG]

Nick,
1) Have you tried swapping tyres from back to front.
2) Have the rear tyres worn evenly.
3) If your running at any more than 32psi this may add to the problem
4) Have suspension linkage points checked
5) Have all four wheels checked for alignment.

These are basic checks that may help.

Malcolm

 

[nick100]

Thanks for the replies.
The squirming can happen in a straight line or around a bend. I'm now suspecting the tyres but I'll follow up all the suggestions.

Cheers

Nick

 

[Parrot of Doom]

What size tyres and wheels are you running? Sounds a bit like tramlining.

 

[nick100]

Just standard mate.

 

[Bolide]

W210 doesn't feel right

If it was a W124 I'd say immediately it's the rear diagonal links that set the tracking at the rear. When the bushes on them wear the cars tend to wander

I think the rear end of a W210 is very similar to a W124 (whereas the front end is different) so the same may pertain

About £15 each


Nick Froome
www.w124.co.uk

 

[maddog]

Nick,
1) Have you tried swapping tyres from back to front.
2) Have the rear tyres worn evenly.
3) If your running at any more than 32psi this may add to the problem
4) Have suspension linkage points checked
5) Have all four wheels checked for alignment.

These are basic checks that may help.

Malcolm

agree with Malcolm here

 

[television]

After checking the pieces mentioned by Bolide, I would do what Malcolm 210says.
When you buy cars secondhand you do not know how the previous owner drove it. The times I see someone going up and down a kerb. These are heavy cars, the strain and stress on delicate components and settings is enormous.
A local shop keeper always parks on the pavement, his 320 has gone up and down the kerb everyday for two years.
The £35-40 cost of a 4 wheel check(not just tracking) will pay for itself in tyre wear within 12 months.

Malcolm

 

[AdrianDW]

Recently obtained a W210 240 Avantgarde - Pirellis all round. When due for renewal - similarly uncomforatable at their ability to lose traction at slightest provovation, and having had issues with P6000's years ago on a V6 Mondeo (sorry!) - I had Goodyear's fitted to the back (NCT 5's). No traction problems since, and they're quieter too. Best of all £15 a corner cheaper!

 

[OlafMaxwell]

What can I say. Car came with Michelins and they were terrible, couldnt keep the car on the road in the wet and one spin was enough for me. The wheels are 16" alloys. I swapped for Pirelli P6000 and they were a bit funny until I pushed them up to about 38psi. Before anyone says its over the top they lasted quite well and wear is even across the treads, no centre wear usually associated with over inflation. Rears changed at 25k [originals off] for Pirellis on. I can get 25-30k with even wear. I use the same tyre shop all the time and when he puts them on he only puts in 32psi but its too low for these tyres.

 

[clive williams]

What can I say. Car came with Michelins and they were terrible, couldnt keep the car on the road in the wet and one spin was enough for me. The wheels are 16" alloys. I swapped for Pirelli P6000 and they were a bit funny until I pushed them up to about 38psi. Before anyone says its over the top they lasted quite well and wear is even across the treads, no centre wear usually associated with over inflation. Rears changed at 25k [originals off] for Pirellis on. I can get 25-30k with even wear. I use the same tyre shop all the time and when he puts them on he only puts in 32psi but its too low for these tyres.

Olaf,

Interesting point you made about the effect of over inflation on the Pirellis but I would expect better than 25-30k with even wear on a set of tyres. I'm still assessing the T210 but the 500E gets close to 40k on Goodyear F1 GSD3s, which are a 'performance' tyre and I'm not known for hanging about.
I must admit that we ran the T210 on P6000s (arrived with them on) with 35psi front and rear and it was most unhappy. Traction in the corners was appalling. The Michelin Alpins it has now are much better. I will in the spring change to Avon ZZ3 225x55x16 on 8Jx16 rims and report my findings.

Clive

500E
E320CDIT210

 

[television]

. I will in the spring change to Avon ZZ3 225x55x16 on 8Jx16 rims and report my findings.

Clive

500E
E320CDIT210[/QUOTE]
I have had two sets of Avons on my V70R, the first set were ZZ1's the back tyres went noisy after12k the wine and viabration was awful, they changed them to ZZ3's On a milage allowance. 10k more and these were humming away at 60MPH, the tread was very uneven all over, I binned them and now have Michilin back and Dunlop front. 13k and no problems

Malcolm

 

[malcolm E53 AMG]

Couldn't agree more Adrian, the NCT 5's on the front of mine are excellent. I've had them on the front for a over a year now and I would certainly replace with the same.

While were on the issue of tyres one of my Michelin Pilot rears picked up a self tapping screw at the weekend. The offending item created a complete flat after the car had stood for an hour or so, and because the screw penetrated an inch in from the shoulder the tyre had to be written off. Result, £110 to replace a tyre that had only covered 6K:sad:

It makes you wonder whether its worth spending the extra on Michelin, the competition arn't far behind on quality especially Goodyear.

 

[clive williams]

. I will in the spring change to Avon ZZ3 225x55x16 on 8Jx16 rims and report my findings.

Clive

500E
E320CDIT210

I have had two sets of Avons on my V70R, the first set were ZZ1's the back tyres went noisy after12k the wine and viabration was awful, they changed them to ZZ3's On a milage allowance. 10k more and these were humming away at 60MPH, the tread was very uneven all over, I binned them and now have Michilin back and Dunlop front. 13k and no problems

Malcolm[/QUOTE]

Malcolm,

Thanks for the observation. I was swayed by the german test reports, which rate them in in the same league as the Pilot Sports and F1s across the board.

Malcolm 210,

I was also swayed by the german test reports that showed the NCT5s as having noticeably less dry grip than the same tyres above. Although to be fair my original first choice was the NCT5 - mainly for its wear rate.

Did you know that you're supposed to use proper snow/ice studs in only winter tyres designed to use them!

I shouldn't tell you this but.... I'm becoming quite sceptical about the quality of the information given by some of the tyre herberts. I have found nails in the tyres in the past and effected a reasonable repair (so that I can use the tyre as a spare) by using a motorcycle plug repair. Its easy and quick to use and I've had no problems with the tyres since. As the modern motorcycle can put out 150+bhp at the rear wheel on a contact width of only 50mm and the heat build up can visibly show melted rubber, a plug repair ought to be reasonably durable. A car tyre is under less stress/heat so I reckon as a get me home, the plugged repair spare is good enough.

Clive

500E
E320CDIT210

 

[television]

Clive
In Sweden you buy the tyres with the dub's (spikes) in, they can be re spiked 3 times max, Not allowed in Germany.

One tyre manufacture made a tubless tyre that had a tube inside, when you blew the tube up it pushed the spikes out, handy when crossing borders.

I brought my 300 TE back to the UK with spiked tyres, I parked in a main road with the wheels pointing to kerb. When I got back to the car there was a queue of people waiting to rub there hands over the spikes that were shinning in the sun.

Malcolm

ps re an old thread on the green stuff pads, I have ordered some red ceramic ones for the Volvo and I hope they will de glaze the front disc, fine on MB

 

[230K]

Hi

I use Vredestein Ultracs 235/45/17's on the E300 Turbodiesel estate and get approx 30000 miles grip cannot be faulted especially in wet, can be noisy though.
I had Pilot sports on my C230K and reckon they are over rated.

230K