Winter Driving Tips for RWD/Auto gearbox

[ivegotcclass]

This is my first winter in a rear wheel drive automatic and since my excess for my insurance is rather large I don't want any bumps.

Can anyone give me some tips for what to look out for when driving an auto box MB in snow. Since we have already have had quite a covering of the white stuff this morning in Bonnie Scotland, I've already tested whether C or S mode makes a difference, I couldn't really tell but the snow is not yet reallly deep.

Also, what about engine breaking, should I use my tiptronic gear box to allow the engine to slow down the momentum of the car. I tried this earlier this morning and felt that I had to be quick to get the car back into a higher gear so i didn't wheel spin when starting to give revs again.

Any advice, any horror stories??

 

[television]

C will give you a second gear more gentle start. but an interesting point here:

As later cars lock the gear box up (engine breaking) to warm the cat quickly, that is not very funny being the first one out onto a snow covered road, as by the time you reach the main roads or motoway your car is running without lock up.

So on the snow as I see it, lock up is the last thing you need, Engine braking is much harsher than your brakes.

Malcolm

 

[tom7035]

Driving in snow.

Use 'C' mode on the gearbox and ALWAYS retain the engine braking element. This never stops the front wheels revolving therefore steering is at all times available. This is not the case using brakes, which should be AVOIDED whenever possible. The rest is common sense, i.e. a very light touch on the pedals and gentle steering movements and use a holding gear when descending steep hills. Extra time for the journey and keeping your extra distance are also very important in these conditions. If you have previously been accustomed to a front-wheel drive vehicle extra care is needed with rear-wheel drive.
Good luck and have fun!

 

[jberks]

Interesting point about engine braking on snow. I learned this the hard way when I was 17, on a manual too. Had a Viva and was overtaking a slow car (had to be to get past in a Viva!) when I realised that the plough had just stopped clearing just ahead. So, I was parrallel to the slower car, overtaking and about to find myself on snow.
So, following the rules, do everything gently. Kept the wheel straight and eased off the throttle. Next thing I knew I'd done a 360. Took me a couple of weeks to figure out what I'd done wrong. A year later, in mums 3 series, I realised I was on ice so again, gently eased off the throttle, felt the back twitch and remembered my earlier lesson. Banged in the clutch and it settled down and slowed in a nice straight line.
So Tom, the comment "Always retain the engine braking element" is not my experience on a RWD as without the traction to drive it, the engine will drop to idle and you may as well have yanked the handbrake on.
I'm not sure how the MB autos behave in this vein as I haven't had bad enough snow to find out.

 

[clive williams]

I used to enjoy driving is snow until I got the MBs. The auto and the foot operated parking brake mean that the control options are significantly reduced. I thoroughly agree with the concensus that gently does it. I've never found starting off is a problem, MB gear selection + weight usually works. Its the steering and stopping that I find a pain.

the saving grace is that I can look forward to more exiting transport on the rare occasions we have snow.

Clive

500E
E320CDIT210

 

[television]

The reason the best tyres should always be on the back, RWD or FWD is because the average person can control the front of the car, but not the back. Having the back wheels locked in snow is not good, By tapping the brake pedal the weight of the front will have a tendency to slide towards the camber but that is easily corrected, when the back has caught up with the front, that average person panics, and keeps their foot hard on the brakes.

Malcolm

 

[angus falconer]

I used to enjoy driving is snow until I got the MBs. The auto and the foot operated parking brake mean that the control options are significantly reduced.

I agree.....and all the electronics keep interfering - I would prefer to be able to switch them all off and have some fun...

 

[clive williams]

Hi all,

Despite what I've advocated elsewhere, the recent bad weather here in rural west Leics got me into a lot of trouble with the missus who considers the barge as hers since we bought it two months ago. It's proved to be a REAL HANDFUL in this weather, something that I confirmed the other night.

The upshot is that I've bitten the bullet and ordered a set of Michelin Pilot Alpin winter tyres for it to get some grip back. Having read the blurb from Michelin and the various (German) tests it looks that the tyres will be good for snow, ice and wet, cold weather, which means that they will probably be good for use up to the end of March from now.

I looked at the costs and they weren't that bad. It was either cough up or the missus said she would probably kill herself (in it). It was a close run thing but then who was going to look after me in my old age?:lol: :lol:

I'll let you know how I get on with them.

Clive

E320CDIT210 A real handful
500E A worse handful

 

[Rory]

I really only use my C270CDi for long business journeys, and sometimes I'm away for a couple of days at a time. This is my first winter with it and I'm terrified of using it in snow.

What does the traction control do if the surface is very slippy - could it cut power so much that the car won't move? (I do know how to turn it off).

I was thinking of getting some of these: http://www.autosock.co.uk for emergency use and wondered if anyone's tried them?

 

[television]

In the snow you need the tracs (traction control) more than ever, it brakes the spinning wheel if one is spinning. so do not turn it off. By the way it has no effect on the engine or power.

Malcolm

 

[Bumper]

The reason the best tyres should always be on the back, RWD or FWD is because the average person can control the front of the car, but not the back. Having the back wheels locked in snow is not good, By tapping the brake pedal the weight of the front will have a tendency to slide towards the camber but that is easily corrected, when the back has caught up with the front, that average person panics, and keeps their foot hard on the brakes.

Malcolm

Television I must disagree with you there, Front wheel drive cars should have the good tyres fitted to the front for traction and rear wheel drive should have the good tyres fitted to the rear for the same purpose, if the front of your car starts to slide because of the camber of the road you can always apply the handbrake to correct yourself. I never use the foot brake when I go into a skid I only use accelerator, clutch and handbrake

As for the original question about driving tips in winter leave the merc at home buy an old mini and go out and have some fun.

 

[television]

Television I must disagree with you there, Front wheel drive cars should have the good tyres fitted to the front for traction and rear wheel drive should have the good tyres fitted to the rear for the same purpose, if the front of your car starts to slide because of the camber of the road you can always apply the handbrake to correct yourself. I never use the foot brake when I go into a skid I only use accelerator, clutch and handbrake

.

Sorry not my reasoning that the best tyres should always be on the back.FWD and RWD
Its stated in virtually all the good motoring worth reading press all over the world. the average person does not know what to do when the back of the car start to catch up with the front

Malcolm

 

[malcolm E53 AMG]

The weight distribution of a Merc (front end heavy) and most rear wheel drive cars built today does not help grip and stability in bad winter conditions. Anticipation and gentle braking are the order of the day. I know it sounds a bit agricultural but evening up the weight imbalance by adding 8-10 stone over the rear axle helps grip and therefore stability. A couple of concrete slabs in the boot will do the trick. You needn't tell anybody, lol, but it will help you get up the odd slope.

 

[turnipsock]

I'm about to fit winter tyres to the rear of my car. It's always the rear that slides about, I have yet to get the front end to let go.

I won't being using Bridgestone tyres after the GP in the states.

Like Clive, I used to enjoy driving in the snow. You used to have a clutch to dip and give max grip to the tyres. You then just had to be conserative with the steering and pump the brakes a bit.

The other day I struggled to get up some of the hills in the snow and thinking I would have been the slowest person on the road, I was not and found myself overtaking people like I had been driving for years.

Once I hit the motorway there was only patchy snow I was making up time at about 90mph. It was then I saw the blue flashing lights, in the mirror, gaining at alarming speed. They must have passed me around the 120mph mark in a Vulva!

(It might have been a Volvo, I often get the two mixed up with hilarious consequenses)

 

[guydewdney]

I saw an interesting thing coming into hemel last year - a C class AMG (i forget what) was stuck in very slow moving traffic, down a steep hill. lots of ice / snow.

He had a problem that he was constantly sliding off to one side - at under 2mph - the ABS wasnt working - and the front brakes are much better than the rears....

subsiquesntly - he was mashing his lovely AMG alloys against the kerb every time he touchd the brakes..

I suggested to him (fom the safety of my (then) citroen xantia lol -) that he put his handbrake on 1 or two clicks.

this worked, and he was very chuffed with my suggestion as he was now in control again..............

 

[turnipsock]

I find that most mercs will do 5 mph and pull towards the kerb in red light areas.

 

[jberks]

Guys on the good tyres front or back .. I suspect you could justify either from a technical perspective. The real answer is good tyres all round. If you think they aren't good enough, change them. The small amount of snow we had last new year last year was enough to have me popping down for a new set. I still had 1.8-2mm so still legal and I would have run them had it been June, but not in January!
Everyone seems to be getting frightened of their Mercs. Sure they aren't astras but they do move on snow you know!
I took my E up a steep hill on a field car park on Saturday. 4x4s were parking at the bottom. Wet squishy grass and mud and 245 tyres so and I figured no chance of getting to the top but my dad didn't want to walk. Slight throttle fractionally over idle and don't stop for anything.---squirmed a bit but kept moving and the top spot was mine.

 

[DAD190E1990]

The only way to control on ice is to put both feet back against the driving seat and press no pedals at all. I have ridden bikes and driven cars over lots of frozen stuff and snow and i was also trained on a skid pan on wet grease. The 'Dragging' effect of engine braking is the only safe way to slow on ice - this is even more so in the Class 1 HGV i drive which will jack knife if you hit the brakes!
If you put the clutch in it will freewheel and not slow down enough. Touch the brakes and you will pirouette. To write this down is not easy, it's better shown but here goes:
1/ you realise you are on ice / snow and you gently let go of the throttle.
2/ Pull both feet back so your heels are touching the seat base, knees up around the steering wheel.
3/ concentrate purely on steering but keep your right foot ready to brake
4/ allow the car to slow down under it's own engine braking (Manual or Auto)
5/ if you are running out of road or you are going in the wrong direction and steering alone will not sort it out for you, slam your foot onto the brake as hard as you can, then lift off sharp after only 1 second. Back on in 1 second bursts really slamming the brake pedal as sharp as you can. ON OFF ON OFF.
This is called 'Cadence' braking and it's what your ABS does but it does it really fast. When you do this manually it is for "OH God there's the wall" situations AFTER you have done the above actions but it is how we were trained and i have used this technique and saved the car from crashing.It reduces your speed in bursts and although each time it's a miniature skid, the idea of ON OFF ON OFF is to not allow that skid to change your course of direction but to get rid of momentum. The tyres will bite into the snow each time you do it and this will slow you very effectively. This is also ok for very wet roads but it's a last ditch resort, not a smooth driving style. It is un-nerving at first but then so is slamming into trees, walls or other cars !

Find a car park sometime this winter, (An empty one!), and try it out - you will be amazed how easy it is and it will reduce the panic factor when you need to react for real. Panic is what finishes most crashes because it robs you of the vital seconds needed at the beginning of the incident to slow in time. Practice and feel for your car are vital and if anyone is really interested in this, most police forces can put you in touch with 'Skid-Training' schools for like a 1 day course. Not all that expensive and lots of fun.

The most basic thing i think is to go slowly in the first place but when on slippery stuff, even 15mph can stop your heart if you are heading for the wrong part of the scenery - anyone who lives around the 'Derbyshire Peak District' will tell you that.

Best of luck everyone and i hope this will help someone, somewhere keep themselves from a nasty crash.
Be safe.

 

[turnipsock]

Like Clive, I used to enjoy driving in the snow. You used to have a clutch to dip and give max grip to the tyres. You then just had to be conserative with the steering and pump the brakes a bit.

I think Dad's description is a little better than mine.

ABS does the cadence braking for you. It will slow the car down more efficiently and allow you to steer a bit.

A good place to try this out is on a frozen lake. I spent a day doing this, years ago, with my Caterham.

 

[maddog]

I'm not convinced about ABS in icy conditions, i extensively experimented myself on a frozen runway in Labrador, Canada and found i could stop quicker cadence braking myself than the car could using its ABS as all it did was to apply the brakes full on and then full off, this happened too quickly the slower human efforts proved more effective.

Steering however was not better either way.

Its a bit harder controlling a car in snow when you have an auto box and no handbrake but its just a case of taking it steady at least with a rwd car you can use the throttle to steer