That Jeremy Vine cycling incident

[EmilysDad]

.... I had no idea this van was passing until he was up the side of me, about 6 inches from my handlebars, ....

Just asking ..... if the van was only 6" away from you, where were you relative to the lane? The van seems to me to have given you at least 2/3rd of the lane.
What's the white line on the pavement for?

 

[47p2]

The white line on the pavement is for those who prefer to cycle on the pavement (a cycle pavement) I was 1/3 out from the kerb, if I keep into the kerb drivers have a habit of squeezing past two abreast, so I have to ensure that doesn't happen by taking a priority position on the road which I do and which any cyclist has the right to do

 

[EmilysDad]

The white line on the pavement is for those who prefer to cycle on the pavement (a cycle pavement) I was 1/3 out from the kerb, if I keep into the kerb drivers have a habit of squeezing past two abreast, so I have to ensure that doesn't happen by taking a priority position on the road which I do and which any cyclist has the right to do

so you were cycling on the dual carriageway when there was an available cycle lane ....... And you wonder why the van driver was miffed?
would it have been OK for the cyclist to ride 2 abreast?

 

[L John]

Maybe the full left lane should be a cycle lane as well as the section on the path

 

[PovertySpec]

so you were cycling on the dual carriageway when there was an available cycle lane

Quite legal. What's your point?

And you wonder why the van driver was miffed?

The van driver was 'miffed' because he's the sort of knob who would demand that we bring back hanging if some other knob in a van killed one of his kids who was riding their bicycle by driving too close to the cyclist when there's plenty of room for both van and bike.

Hang back, go wide, respect other road users?

would it have been OK for the cyclist to ride 2 abreast?

Yes, or three or four abreast. In fact it's entirely legal for an entire peloton to take up both lanes for as many miles as they deem necessary.

Amazed at the lack of knowledge self-professed experienced road users actually have

 

[L John]

I'm a cyclist too, there are lots of things we can do legally but I chose not to do those things unless I feel they're safe.

You wouldn't catch me riding on that road when there's a great area provided for cyclists to ride on at the side of the road.

Riding squeezed in to the kerb or riding 1/3 of the way out into the road when there's a cycle path just doesn't make sense to me.

 

[PovertySpec]

Riding squeezed in to the kerb or riding 1/3 of the way out into the road when there's a cycle path just doesn't make sense to me.

Hope you like changing your tubs every 10 minutes and in that vid the cyclist wasn't squeezed into the kerb, probably for the same reason.

Absolutely no excuse for white van man to be so close to the cyclist when there are 2 lanes.

Showed a complete lack of respect for the cyclist and no ability to read the road.

I'm a cyclist too, there are lots of things we can do legally but I chose not to do those things unless I feel they're safe

And it's only unsafe because .... ?

 

[Westheath]

I thought cycle lane provision was there for cyclists saftey.

Not using them puts the cyclist in a dangerous position on busy carriageways where fast moving vehicles have to respond to fast moving interaction with traffic in both directions.

If cyclists choose not to use the available safety measures provided for them it must raise the question why ?

Is it just to be pig headed or is it ignorance or something else ?

Every body wants to get to where they are going quickly and safely using the provided road system,
if you decide not to use the road system provided the you are compromising your own safety
and others that have to react/compensate for your decision to ignore the safety measures provided.

I dunno makes no sense to me not to use whats been provided and paid for by motorists.

 

[EmilysDad]

Quite legal. What's your point?



The van driver was 'miffed' because he's the sort of knob who would demand that we bring back hanging if some other knob in a van killed one of his kids who was riding their bicycle by driving too close to the cyclist when there's plenty of room for both van and bike.

Hang back, go wide, respect other road users?



Yes, or three or four abreast. In fact it's entirely legal for an entire peloton to take up both lanes for as many miles as they deem necessary.

Amazed at the lack of knowledge self-professed experienced road users actually have

I'm not doing each point ....
Part of the by-pass where I live is 4 lanes wide ..... but still cyclists want to cycle on it despite a cycle lane running (nearly) alongside it.
I drove up behind a cyclist the other day as we approached a set of traffic lights where the road splits into 2, left for turning left & the right for straight on. Any one on 2 wheels, motorised or not, with half a brain cell would have glanced over his shoulder as he was effectively moving to the right hand lane ..... nothing!
The 2 (and more) abreast has a proviso ..... along the lines of where suitable

 

[47p2]

Ah!!! that old... "there's a cycle lane so why are you on the road?"

I'll tell you why I cycle on the road and not a cycle pavement, then you can tell me why that gives the van driver the right to drive so close...


1. It's perfectly legal for me to cycle on the road even though there is a cycle lane provided
The cycle pavement surface is:-
2. an uneven surface
3. covered in broken glass
4. covered in all the crap/flint shards/pieces of broken car springs/exhaust brackets and silencer boxes that gets thrown from passing cars
5. has pedestrians, some pushing prams, some elderly
6. has overgrown trees/bushes/branches

...and no I never cycle on the left side of the road, the gutter is for water water and also has the same problems as numbers 2,3 & 4 above plus sunken drain covers.

I will hazard a guess you don't drive your car 3 or 4 inches from the kerb, so why should I cycle 3 or 4 inches from the kerb just so that you can squeeze pass without having to think about it, so that you don't get held up a few seconds.

 

[EmilysDad]

.....
Absolutely no excuse for white van man to be so close to the cyclist when there are 2 lanes.

three if you count the provided cycle lane

Showed a complete lack of respect for the cyclist and no ability to read the road.


....

Obviously read the road enough, he moved over at least 2/3 of the lane

 

[EmilysDad]

Ah!!! that old... "there's a cycle lane so why are you on the road?" ....

You sound as though you would be a good candidate for membership of the group of cyclists that were cycling in front of the HGV I saw the other week. It's the main road from the motor way junction to a huge business/distribution park and these clowns were cycling in a bunch such that the HGV couldn't pass them. There's a f***ing great cycle path at the side! Arrogance at its best

 

[Westheath]

Im going to patent a broom that fits on the front forks of a push bike to clear deadly debris as you cycle along the hazardous cycle paths.

 

[L John]

We need more cycle paths, lots more.
Will that ever happen when cyclists refuse to use them?
I always use them and often pass slower cyclists that are using the road.

Mine has good tyres with self sealing compound and any punctures have self sealed or I've not had any, even riding in the woods.

Skinny racing tyres are more likely to puncture by objects or a rim nip, most wont have a self sealer to keep the weight at a minimum so I guess that's why they refuse to use the paths or ride closer to the kerb.

Risk a puncture or risk getting chewed up in traffic?
Such a hard choice :-(

I'm not having a go at anyone or their choices.
20 years ago I might have chosen the road myself (with a mirror on the bike so there were no surprise vans approaching).
The standard of driving on the roads is terrible these days, especially since mobile phones. I wouldn't want a racing bike if they're no good on a cycle path.

 

[47p2]

Riding squeezed in to the kerb or riding 1/3 of the way out into the road when there's a cycle path just doesn't make sense to me.

That's your decision and choice

I dunno makes no sense to me not to use whats been provided and paid for by motorists.

Paid for by motorists, who told you that? Next you'll be giving me the old 'you don't pay road tax story'!!! Well I do, on 4 vehicles at the present time

You sound as though you would be a good candidate for membership of the group of cyclists that were cycling in front of the HGV I saw the other week. It's the main road from the motor way junction to a huge business/distribution park and these clowns were cycling in a bunch such that the HGV couldn't pass them. There's a f***ing great cycle path at the side! Arrogance at tits best

I'm not here to be a candidate for anyone but myself, whether there is a cycle lane or not there is no legal requirement for a cyclist to use a cycle lane. There's also no need to use obscene language (doesnt matter if you **** it out or not, I know what it means and so will others) on a public forum, some young children could be reading this thread

Maybe it's time some of you guys who think you can drive and think you know the law picked up the latest copy of the Highway Code and studied it from the front page to the back page. It only costs £2.50 and is available here


Oh and if you think I'm some sort of crack jock vigilante on two wheels I'm a professional driver who earns my living on the road, I hold a Class 1 C+E License, CPC Certificate, Hazchem trained, IAM Certificate, Defensive Driving trained, I've driven more miles in a year than most of you will drive in 10 years

As for cycle lanes being safer for cyclists... well that's a load of tosh, here are a few examples of the cycle lanes around my home area, random pictures taken from Google maps. Yes cars parked in the cycle lanes is a common occurrence, cycling along them and having to dodge into the main carriageway and back into the cycle lane is a sure way to get killed...another reason not to use them

Cyclists forced to cycle on the pavement (no its not a cycle lane/pavement) as the cycle lane is full of parked cars

Not happy parking in the cycle lane this white van driver is also parked on the pavement

...and another driver who likes to park in cycle lanes and also on the pavement

The local authority put in a lay-by in front of these shops, but this motorist obviously thinks its ok to park two abreast and in the cycle lane while they pop into the shops for there paper/fags/whatever!!!

Not forgetting the crazy door zone cycle lanes, why would anyone want to cycle in these lanes!!!

Give cyclists space

 

[EmilysDad]

We all know there's no legal requirement to use them ... but common sense says that if there's a suitable lane off the main road, then use it. And again, you cite some stupid cycle lanes, I can think of loads of them myself, but I can also think of those where the cycle lane is by far the safer bit of tarmac to use. Why would you want to share road space with a prossession of HGVs when you could the cycle lane that's at the side of it ie built as a seperate 12' wide pavement ...... the cyclists were just ****** minded, as were you on your photo's.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.5...Ydfop0UhWvDQVFE1llnQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
Many of our roads were laid out for a horse & cart, nobody would have thought that we'd all have a car each ..... we've got what we've got and have to make best use of it

 

[Craiglxviii]

To me it's a simple formula.

If you were in a Smart ForTwo would you argue with a wagon wanting to move in? No, you'd slow down and let the 40 ton behemoth in front of you, otherwise you might get into an accident, even though you had right of way.

If you're on a bit of tubular aluminium and there's nothing between you and crushing agony but a bit of Lycra and expanded polystyrene, and you're holding up a queue of traffic while pedaling like fcuk to get up a blind rise, would you argue with 2 ton of car heading towards you from front or rear at 60mph? Apparently... yes you would, because you have right of way.

Common sense is lacking here.

 

[PovertySpec]

I'm not doing each point ....

47p2 explained neatly why you're wrong.

If you're on a bit of tubular aluminium and there's nothing between you and crushing agony but a bit of Lycra and expanded polystyrene....

If you see someone on a bit of tubular aluminium and there's nothing between you crushing them but a bit of Lycra and expanded polystyrene, why would you be a dick about it and bully them in your 2 ton car?

A considerate person wouldn't.

Common sense is lacking here

Yes, yes it is. (common sense .. the least common of the senses)

 

[47p2]

Yes you're correct Andy, the lanes I 'cited' are indeed stupid, but they are what the local authorities have supplied us with as a legal requirement to fulfill the ridiculously stupid regulations laid down by the government. Unfortunately the regulations don't take into consideration the cyclists safety (yes they supply a lane to cycle in, unfortunately they are sub-standard, unsafe and the local authorities don't maintain the cycle them), so common sense tells me it's safer to cycle on the road where I can mingle with a procession of HGVs. My pictures are not ****** minded, they are a true representation of what cyclists have to put up with, all captured on Google maps. Go have a look yourself and they are there for the world to see!!!

 

[Craiglxviii]

My answers in red below.

47p2 explained neatly why you're wrong.



If you see someone on a bit of tubular aluminium and there's nothing between you crushing them but a bit of Lycra and expanded polystyrene, why would you be a dick about it and bully them in your 2 ton car?

A considerate person wouldn't.

I wouldn't do. My point here is <shudder, I hate these words with a passion> risk assessment; the cyclist is far more at risk than any driver, and should act accordingly (I see many cyclists who insist on holding up traffic on hills/ narrow lanes. Human nature being what it is, this causes "some" drivers to get frustrated, irritated and try to overtake. The cyclist could stop, pull over and wait for the queue of cars to pass, but doesn't... because he/ she is legally allowed to use the road). Similarly, car drivers "should" be far more aware of what's going on around them and not just with bicycles... horses, other cars, pedestrians, cats and dogs are all around the place and I do think that the standard of driving has slipped significantly with more speeding around urban areas going on.

Yes, yes it is. (common sense .. the least common of the senses) So true, so true.