Newbie with a question, please...

[AlisonH]

For the past 25 - 30 years, I have always delegated finding me an estate car to a local father & sons garage not far from my home. They have never yet found me a bad one, despite a very limited budget and a requirement for a good, solid and reliable large estate. I have a small holding and use my cars for transporting animal feed, dogs, logs and so on, often along unmade roads and rough tracks.

My present estate is an 18 years old Renault Savanna, which I have had for the last 4 or 5 years but the pre-MOT check indicates it is time to replace it. Apparently the garage owner knows of a Mercedes estate car - M or N registration that he says is in very good condition for its year and would suit me well. It would come with a new MOT but, although I don't know the model details, and won't until I look at it next Tuesday, looking at pictures, they all seem to be quite low to the ground. What sort of ground clearance do they have, please? (Some of the tracks I have to navigate to collect/deliver eggs and feed sacks have quite deep tyre ruts.) I have also heard some models are more 'lifestyle' than practical nowadays, would that apply to one of this age?

Also, can anyone give me any tips on what to look at/for and a rough price guide for one of this age, please? Apparently, it has hardly been driven for the last year.

Thanks in anticipation.

 

[lakeside]

It'll be a W124. They all have self-levelling rear suspension, which would be an advantage when running loaded up on a rough track. However, being rear wheel drive, traction could possibly be a problem when unladen on a slippery field. If you're carrying eggs, you'll appreciate the magic carpet ride. They are very practical, a genuine utility vehicle, not at all "lifestyle". I regularly use mine when visiting friends in West Wales who live miles up rough tracks, and haven't had any problems. Depending on engine type (petrol/diesel) and spec, they are worth anything between £1000 - £5000. Despite their size, they are very manoeverable, with a tight turning circle. Things to watch out for, especially in your case, would be non-functioning self-levelling. The roof is load bearing, so you could easily bungee a couple of bales on it. They are very strong cars, much more so than your Savannah, and should be capable of many years service. Don't be put off by high mileage - they're built for it. Find out if it has a decent service history.

 

[AlisonH]

Thanks for your reply.

If you visit the wilds of Wales you'll have a good idea of the sort of tracks I drive regularly and the self-levelling suspension sounds good, although not all the tracks I drive have the space to the sides to drive other than in the ruts, so clearance under the centre of the chassis could still be an issue. The Savanna's exhaust barely clears the ground in some places.

Good to know they are very manoeverable. I have back and upper torso mobility problems and find the Savanna quite heavy to steer in tight places and especially when parking in the Fiesta sized slots most neighbours seem to leave these days, or else exit when I'm left with less than a foot of space front and back. In fact, one particular neighbour seems to delight in backing his Corsa literally right up to my tow-hitch. (I rarely need to tow a trailer, but handy to have in an emergency.)

Do you know if the W124s are longer than the Savannas, please? Local car park spaces seem to be about a foot too short for the Savanna, therefore I have to be selective whenever possible about where I park that, avoiding the ends of rows where other vehicles are turning, rather than risk having mine bumped.

I doubt I'd want to bungee one of the bales I use onto the roof - I use the big bales, containing the equilalent of about 8 - 10 of the normal ones - but a local farmer delivers those. However, I must remember not to let my son know the roof is load bearing, else goodness knows what he'd have up on it. :lol: (The Savanna's is scratched to hell from him loading it with timber and zinc sheets. :roll: )

I'm feeling quite optimistic and excited now, and it sounds like I may well be getting offered a bargain, judging by the prices you mention. The chap at the garage offered me a people carrier for £900 and I turned that down as being more than I wanted to pay, plus I'd only have to have the rear seats removed. I usually tell him I've around £500 to spend, but have been known to stretch to £650. We shall see on Tuesday... And if it doesn't have the chassis clearance I need, but is otherwise good and around the price I'm thinking of, no doubt someone else will be wanting the garage's phone number. :lol:

I will let you know how I get on. Thanks again.

 

[AlisonH]

Well, the garage just said I can go and take a look a day early... and I just found out the price. Trying desperately not to get too excited, else I'll never get the key into the old Savanna's ignition.

Wish me luck, I could be an MB W124 estate owner within the next hour!

 

[Blobcat]

good luck and don't forget to post some piccies

 

[AlisonH]

Well, no photos just yet, and it turned out to be a G reg., W124T, 7 seater, petrol estate, so a bit older than I first thought. Cloth interior and 131,500 miles on the clock, but only about 400 of those in the last 4 years.

It's in much better condition than my Savanna, but failed the MOT on a couple of very minor things and three tyres. All that is being sorted by the garage and the MOT retest is booked for Wednesday, so all being well, I can swap vehicles either Wedneday or Thursday.

Yep, I've bought it! (And the ground/chassis clearance is higher than the Savanna, so that should be fine. Just wondering how long the paintwork will stay its present shade of pristine white, though.

Price was £550 and my Savanna, which will be scrapped. (If anyone knows someone looking for a really clean, good and reliable engine for an old Savanna, email me and they can have the garage's phone number where it is going.)

 

[lakeside]

Sounds like a good deal. What size engine? 2-litre, 2.3-litre, or 3-litre? Manual or auto? The mileage is low - it's hardly run-in. These cars do like to be driven though, so the fact that it's not been used much recently is not neccesarily a good thing. Give it a good long run if you can, to blow the cobwebs away. Get the garage to change the oil and transmission fluid and filters. Make sure the self-levelling works ok, and that there's no oil leaks from the cylinder head. Since your trusted local garage supplied it, and you've been a customer for so long, I'm sure all will be well.

 

[AlisonH]

It's a 2 litre engine and has automatic transmission; the self-levelling works fine, oils and fluids have all been changed; engine looks clean and dry around all the gaskets. It purred smoothly onto the forecourt of the garage following the trip to the testing station and after failing the test.

It may need a replacement windscreen at some point, as there's a crack across the corner angle on the lower passenger side and a bit of 'haze' as if condensation has got into the glass - but my Savanna has had almost the same problem since I bought that 5 years ago and it's never leaked.

It's years since I drove an automatic, so that will take a bit of getting used to. Any tips?

Sorted the insurance change over this afternoon and it's only increased my premium by £24 a year. I go fully comp mainly for the extra benefits due to disabilities, but it's still under £300 pa.

I meant to measure up the back so that I can make a protective sheet to fit that - better than feeling guilty over that turning into a market garden by spring! The Sav grew a grand collection of fungi in the spare tyre well and from all the spilled horse manure - and I daren't tell you what else I found growing there once after spilling budgie and canary seeds in there. rofl

Am thinking about removing the extra rear seat to use the well for tool storage and just board over. I haven't used the rear seat of the Sav more than once or twice since I bought that, and its been left flat for the last four years, so I can't justify the 7 seats.

Can't decide whether to call it Snowdrop or Bluebell - its exterior's white and the interior's blue - however, whatever I might name it, my pals always refer to my vehicles as a 'Muck Truck', so the poor old thing is likely to take a trip down in the world. Oh well, at least horse manure smells sweeter than cow dung...

 

[BarryG]

http://forums.mercedesclub.org.uk/showthread.php?t=21890&highlight=driving+automatic

The above could help been couple of threads on driving an auto do quick search

Barry

 

[Stircrazy]

Congratulations!

I bought my W124 estate from a Farmer who used it for the same sort of things in the same sort of conditions.

Mine is even lower mileage than yours.

The only ground clearance issue I can think of is the fuel tanks are a bit low and fragile.

I have been battering mine up and down the lenghth and breadth of the country for 2 years now with minimal problems and in great comfort!

Top tip for an automatic. Never move your left foot 'til you get the hang of it!

All you will get is BRAKES!

 

[Bolide]

The only problems you're likely to find on an older W124 are rust and worn suspension bits. It's worth giving the underside a good going over with Waxoyl to keep rust at bay

Windscreens with milky edges are common but they don't seem to get much worse over time

If you have an aftermarket towbar like a Witter it has a longitudinal under the rear silencer. This reduces ground clearance a lot and makes deep dips a struggle. The factory Oris bar and aftermarket Brink bar are much better in this respect as nothing - apart from the gooseneck - hangs down. A removeable gooseneck is a nice option

The squab of the rearmost seats unclips & comes out - no need for surgery. The backrest cushion can be unscrewed but the well under it is very shallow & fairly useless

Mercedes made a loadspace protector of hard plastic that fills the whole space at the rear. It's waterproof, about a foot deep with a 1" lip at the rear. They're worth searching out on eBay. Some W124 estate specialists keep them in stock

You'll find that the typical waterproof seat covers you get at the farm shop don't quite fit a W124 seat but it's worth buying a pair for the front and modifying them to fit. That way you don't need to worry too much about muck

You can buy cut-to-fit rubber mats from a Mercedes dealer for the front & rear footwells - they're worth every penny. Mercedes used to make specific ones for the W124 but they're no longer available

Finally I always find the older cars have truly appalling headlights. Mainly this is due to the reflector silvering decaying but old, chipped lenses and poor design don't help. I'd recommend a pair of good replacement headlights from a breaker or eBay and a set of (illegal) 90/110 watt bulbs

Best car in the world, btw. But then I'm biased...

Nick Froome
www.w124.co.uk

 

[AlisonH]

Thanks for the advice - like the idea of the loadspace protector, but can likely design and make covers for the front seats, as required. (I design and make MTM greyhound/dog coats, used to make horse rugs, and have an industrial sewing machine and suitable materials to hand. )

Interesting about the headlights, although I rarely drive at night these days. Prefer to spend my evenings home with a good log fire - especially this weather.

Looking forward to taking possession shortly.

 

[AlisonH]

I collected 'Bluebell' this morning and have been busy blowing her cobwebs away by running around fetching overdue sacks of animal feed, and a dozen other tasks rendered impossible by the Sav's flapping door locks. Well impressed by the PAS and amazed to discover just how good the lock is on the steering. It almost turns in its own length and is much lighter than the old Savanna to steer/turn in tight places. With my back in the mess it is, that will be a godsend.

Bluebell will go back to the garage sometime next week for a couple of minor rust spots/bubbles to be sorted out above the rear wheel arches, and before those get any worse, but on the whole it seems in remarkably good condition for a seventeen years old car. Will have to take a 'before' photo when the rain stops - as in before I start abusing her and filling up the rear with all the usual garbage.

Can anyone please explain the 'economy' gauge's purpose? It's been showing to the right of the red area all day when driven, and I'm pretty lightfooted on the pedal and haven't been above 60 mph. Although all the paperwork says it is an automatic, it's actually a manual, 5 speed gear box. (Something need to notify a change of spec for.) Also, I believe the speedometre is very inaccurate - I was seriously NEVER doing 40mph in 2nd gear and a flow of slow moving traffic outside a school today. Is there a way to check/test this, short of following another vehicle holding a specific speed? Could it simply be sticking a bit after having not been driven for a while?

Thanks,
Al

 

[television]

The economy device shows the fuel consumption with regards to your foot on the throtle,the more you press the throtle down the more into the red the gauge goes, you will find a point when going up hill where the car does not go any faster by pressing the throtle and the gauge will show the wasted fuel.

Re the speedometer you do have rev counter that you can work out the car speed of the car from.


Malcolm

 

[AlisonH]

The economy guage never altered its position at all, regardless of pressure on the throttle. It sounds to me as if the idling revs are a bit fast, too, but I'm not an expert and going only by ear and compared to the Sav. Idling revs are about 2K.

Please can you explain what you mean about working out the speed from the revs? I haven't pushed it at all yet. Hardest I hit the pedal was pulling off a steep junction at traffic lights and with a twit sitting on the rear bumper. In fact, another reason I think the revs are too advanced is than I barely need to touch the throttle to keep it at a steady speed in traffic flow.

 

[television]

The economy guage never altered its position at all, regardless of pressure on the throttle. It sounds to me as if the idling revs are a bit fast, too, but I'm not an expert and going only by ear and compared to the Sav. Idling revs are about 2K.

Please can you explain what you mean about working out the speed from the revs? I haven't pushed it at all yet. Hardest I hit the pedal was pulling off a steep junction at traffic lights and with a twit sitting on the rear bumper. In fact, another reason I think the revs are too advanced is than I barely need to touch the throttle to keep it at a steady speed in traffic flow.

In your hand book it could tell you the speed per 1000 RPM in top gear.

As you have a navigation device,these will show the speed of the car, and you could compare against that.

Malcolm

 

[AlisonH]

I have yet to acquire a handbook, Malcolm. As for a navigation device - I have yet to discover one!

The lad at the garage explained carefully where everything was, and never mentioned anything about navigation devices. Fact is, I had enough trouble navigating my way around the windscreen wipers and right-hand indicating, despite five years of trying to indicate with the windscreen wiper in the Sav! Felt sure I was turning the right bit of the indicator lever to engage those when it started raining. Went back to the garage feeling like a right numpty :Oops: and especially as I couldn't get the electric window to close either. :roll: It was almost a relief to discover it was only a fuse or two that needed replacing! (No, I'm NOT blond, honest! :lol: )

 

[D3Less]

Idle speed of 2000 sounds too fast to me

 

[AlisonH]

I think so too - and it was taken to a specialist for an engine tune yesterday too. (That by the local garage I bought it from.)

 

[AlisonH]

Baffled because today the idling revs were down to about 1,400 from 2,000 yesterday. I had a bit of trouble starting it first thing from cold and thought perhaps it was me simply not yet used to it? It actually started, but then cut out when I depressed the throttle. Tried different pressures from almost nothing to fairly firm rev - same thing each time, it just cut out. Resigned myself to speaking with the garage on Monday, then because I'd feed to drop off for a neighbour, went back about half an hour later for another try. It fired and picked up straight away. That, coupled with the drop in the idling revs makes me wonder if perhaps something could be sticking? (Recall something like that from a past vehicle with an auto-choke.)

The economy gauge still hasn't shown less than half way into the red area, though, and despite the drop of about 600 in idling revs.

Considering one of the minor reasons it originally failed the MOT on the emmisions, but then passed after the engine tune, surely if it is wasting fuel, the emmisions would still be too high? (Sorry for the questions, guys - will check the mirror to see if I've turned suddenly blond! )

On a good note, Nick, I drove it after dark tonight and happy to report the headlights seem very good. I felt much relieved after your comment.

Really love the smooth ride, and my back greatly appreciates that.