Radiator cracked causing gearbox failure - what next?

[darrindwp]

C180 2 door Kompressor Coupe'

Just got this car about 7 months ago (second hand). Bought an RAC quality assured warranty with it so that if anything happened I would be covered (stupid me).

So, the radiator has apparently got a crack between the water compartment and the gearbox cooling compartment which has allowed water (glycol) to mix with the ATF causing failure of the gearbox and torgue converter.

Merc have offered to pay around £900
RAC will only pay for the radiator and not the gearbox
I am left to pay £2500 after already paying out £600 to have two oxygen sensors replaced as that was the opriginal diagnosis.

Can anyone direct me towards finding a way of getting this resolved as I feel it is really unfair that I should be stuck with the bulk of the bill on what I believe to be a product fault.

Are there any legal channels I can follow?

 

[Parrot of Doom]

Do a search for 'valeo radiator' on this and similar forums. Common design fault which tbh should be repaired free of charge.

As regards the sensors, I would use that as a big lever - your old sensors were clearly not at fault.

 

[BlackC55]

C180 2 door Kompressor Coupe'

Just got this car about 7 months ago (second hand). Bought an RAC quality assured warranty with it so that if anything happened I would be covered (stupid me).

So, the radiator has apparently got a crack between the water compartment and the gearbox cooling compartment which has allowed water (glycol) to mix with the ATF causing failure of the gearbox and torgue converter.

Merc have offered to pay around £900
RAC will only pay for the radiator and not the gearbox
I am left to pay £2500 after already paying out £600 to have two oxygen sensors replaced as that was the opriginal diagnosis.

Can anyone direct me towards finding a way of getting this resolved as I feel it is really unfair that I should be stuck with the bulk of the bill on what I believe to be a product fault.

Are there any legal channels I can follow?

You are one of many. Have a look at mbclub forum also as it has been covered there also.

I have done a few of these boxes at my workshop.

 

[kth286]

BlackC55

How does the coolant get into the gearbox ????????

AS the radiator must have two completely seperate cooling circuits built into it, how does the cross contamination happen ??????????????

 

[BlackC55]

The rad has two sections to it. It is common practice to do this. The small section where the ATF is cooled allows the coolant from the otherside to seep into the ATF. The front of the radiator is no different to a normal rad just with an extra section on the side of it. If left for a long time the ATF looks like runny toffee.

 

[television]

The other point on this is that the car needs a new torque converter and not a new gearbox along with the modified rad

Here is one of many

http://forums.mercedesclub.org.uk/showthread.php?t=18792&highlight=valeo

 

[Rory]

I am left to pay £2500 after already paying out £600 to have two oxygen sensors replaced as that was the opriginal diagnosis.

Surely they would refund you the £600 as the sensor change didn't fix the problem?

 

[television]

Surely they would refund you the £600 as the sensor change didn't fix the problem?

Why is it that no other trade can get away with these kind of practices, its robbery

 

[type49]

Malc does have a point here. MB themselves do recommend a new rad, torque converter & oil flush - not new gearbox. Depending on how much contamination, you may not need a box.

 

[darrindwp]

Firstly, let me apologise for not using the search facility first. I have (still do) moderate forums and now how annoying it is to be asked the same questions over and over again when a simple search would more than likely reslove with an answer. So, sorry for that.

Thanks for the links and the responses. It gives me a new direction to move in with the MB dealer although after doing a lot of reading here it does not look like I will avoid paying this huge bill. Its interesting to note in other threads that its not normally required to replace the gearbox when a rad failure occurs. There was mention from my MB dealer about the valve box inside the gearbox being removed for inspection ... hence the gearbox replacement requirement.

I just left a message on my service reps answer service mentioning only the known Valeo fault prior to 09/2003 and asked him what new direction this takes us in. I await his call.

 

[darrindwp]

Surely they would refund you the £600 as the sensor change didn't fix the problem?

I had this done through a private garage so no, I cannot get a refund for that, but I intend going back to the original MB dealer for a refund on the charge they gave me to come up with this wrong diagnoses (£140.

 

[television]

Firstly, let me apologise for not using the search facility first. I have (still do) moderate forums and now how annoying it is to be asked the same questions over and over again when a simple search would more than likely reslove with an answer. So, sorry for that.

Thanks for the links and the responses. It gives me a new direction to move in with the MB dealer although after doing a lot of reading here it does not look like I will avoid paying this huge bill. Its interesting to note in other threads that its not normally required to replace the gearbox when a rad failure occurs. There was mention from my MB dealer about the valve box inside the gearbox being removed for inspection ... hence the gearbox replacement requirement.

I just left a message on my service reps answer service mentioning only the known Valeo fault prior to 09/2003 and asked him what new direction this takes us in. I await his call.

Your dealer is telling you porkies, and not being helpful towards you, the valve block does not have to come out and it is not affected by the glycol.

I would suggest that you write to MB as this is not your fault, and you could have done nothing to have prevented it from happening.

This is a known manufacturing fault, please write and I am sure that you will get a fair chunk towards it some have got it all done almost free

 

[darrindwp]

So, just been back in touch with MB Headoffice here in UK explaining that I now know about the Valeo design fault prior to 09/2003 and would they please do the right thing and take care of the balance that they wanted me to pay.

I await the outcome.

 

[darrindwp]

Anyone know where I can get the rest of that Star Bulletin report?

Also, who is this bulletin released by? Is it Merc, Valeo?

 

[darrindwp]

the valve block does not have to come out and it is not affected by the glycol.

Yeah, valve block - I keep calling it a valve box. He said that there were some paper (gasket?) damage due to the Glycol. Perhaps I misunderstood. Maybe he was talking about the Torque Con when explaining the damage.

 

[Rory]

Anyone know where I can get the rest of that Star Bulletin report?

Also, who is this bulletin released by? Is it Merc, Valeo?

http://mbclub.co.uk/forums/showpost.php?p=283631&postcount=33

Have a read through the whole thread too.

 

[darrindwp]

Thanks Rory for the link.

I got a phone call back from MB head office this afternoon and as with most of the folks on these and other boards, MB have come back and said that their current offer is as good as it gets. On further investigation it would appear that the radiator currently fitted does NOT have the white dot indicating it has never been checked.

I am guessing my next step is a carefully worded polite letter to Daimler Chrysler?

I should point out that through this whole of the last three weeks I have the use of a courtesy car from MB while they try and work out who pays what. I have asked to keep this loaner until the end of next week. No response on that yet.

I have had my eye on an SLK and hopefully one day an SLR but I have to say that after the way this has/is going down I certainly won't be buying another Merc in a hurry.

 

[Rory]

You're in a somewhat unfortunate position as you haven't had the car too long (in MB eyes) but too long to be sure of pursuing your seller.

You could still try this, but it's a bit more awkward as legal liability rests with the last seller (so it's easy if you bought the car new). In your case it's going to get very complicated if you try to go after your seller. DC-UK has no legal liability to you.
The Sales of Goods act says goods should be 'durable' - in other words they should last a reasonable length of time. I'm not sure you've said how old the car is, but it would be reasonable to expect 5yrs out of a Mercedes.

See particularly Q1:
http://www.dti.gov.uk/consumers/fact-sheets/page38071.html

Be very cautious with the legal approach as people can throw the shutters up once you 'go legal'.

 

[darrindwp]

I have actually decided to take the vehicle to the repairer that RAC have now recommended. That way I will only be about £500 out of pocket in total (including MB charges to put the gearbox back together). Its still a lot of money to throw away, especially if you include the £600 already paid to have the oxygen sensors replaced but I am at a stage now where I am wasting too much time dealing with MB over this. My business customers are starting to suffer and that hurts more than giving away £'s to MB.

So MB screw yet another customer and I certainly will NOT be buying MB again (secondhand or new). I been pricing up a few Audi's and also looked at BMW.

If anyone wants computer scanner for their MB let me know. It scans the onboard computer for any error faults and also allows you to adjust a few settings.

Thanks folks. Its been a very informative stay on these boards and you have all been most helpfull.

 

[television]

Another today

http://forums.mercedesclub.org.uk/showthread.php?t=31755